Fair Price - and what is the red stuff?

[RogerGarrett]

I have a a couple of questions of wood type - and perhaps one of purchasing/advertising. Please bear with me as I am still "green" at wood types and quality.

A couple of weeks ago, I set up an order for some olive wood. I was told that the jumbo blanks were "killer" olive wood for $1 each.

When I emailed the person for details, I was told:

Cross cut is $2.00, straight grain is $1.00 each, and angle cut is $2.50 each. all jumbo sized................

So I responded:

I guess I would like 4 angle cut, and 10 straight grain - if you pick me out some nice, nice pieces of each. I don't need a ton to start with......I'll see how it looks and works, and then get back to you if you still have some.

I received the pieces shown in the pics below (actually there was one more blank of the lighter/longer stuff pictured with the red wood - it is pictured in the comparsion pic with the darker piece). Originally they were very dirty because they are green/wet - will have to sit for several months. So I planed them ever so slightly and cut the smaller pieces from two blocks that were roughly 4 X 4 X 1 inch thick. They are still 7/8 X 7/8 or greater - but now I can see the figure and color. Length of the longest ones are about 6.5 inches (pretty good length).

My questions are:

1. Did the seller send what I appeared to order?
2. Was the cost fair for what was originally discussed?
3. What are the red pieces? They don't look like olivewood, but I could be wrong.
4. In the third picture, I show two kinds of allegedly the same olive wood (same seller but a separate order), but the darker one, while quite beautiful, doesn't look like olive wood that I have seen. All of the olive wood in that order looked like the dark one. Also - the dark one is dry while the lighter ones are damp. Are there different species I should be aware of?

I fully expect to order more wood from this person in the future - but I want to be sure I'm getting what was discussed. The wood I ordered from Dario has been absolutely wonderful - but I wouldn't have known until I began to turn some of it. Same with the wood from Rich. This has been a great resource from me - and I want to continue to use it successfully!

Any help/expertise you experienced guys have with these questions of mine would be helpful. Thanks in advance!

Best wishes,
Roger Garrett

 

[alamocdc]

Roger, yes they appear to be olivewood, but only 2 angle cut from what I can tell. The red pieces look like redheart. The price you paid is fair for olive (cheap for Bethlehem olive, so this is not likely BOW).

 

[Dario]

Roger,

Looks like you received 4 angle cut (from the pics) and an extra too! Best person to ask about the red pieces will be the seller. I would guess either bloodwood or red heart but that is a long shot.

On the straight cut, looks like you got what you ordered and some freebie shorts too.

The bottom pic...if that is an olivewood, I want it [][]. Just do a scratch and sniff to tell if it is olivewood. The aroma is unmistakable.

The only question is the "killer" olivewood claim. That is highly subjective.

As far as I am can tell from the pics and your story, you got a good deal...but what really matters is if you are satisfied or not.

 

[JimGo]

Can't comment on the cross/angle/bias cut question, but as to the colors, there are several different species of olive. If all you ordered was "olive", then you really didn't get any specificity from the seller. For example, there is BOW, which has the lighter colors, and then there ROW, which tends to have darker coloring. Check out the pens pictured here to get an idea of the color ranges, figuring, etc.:
http://www.penturners.org/forum/photo_album.asp?mode=search&AlbumUsers=0&Photo_Search=olive&submit1=search

Note that most people here use BOW, as it has a sentimental/spiritual aspect to it, but other olives are also used. ROW, for example, can be found in parts of California, and is relatively inexpesive because the cost of obtaining the wood is nowhere near that of BOW (which I understand must be physically thrown across border fences before it can be shipped).

 

[Dario]

Jim,

Cool!!! I didn't know you can do a search on the photo albums! [:0]

Thanks!!!

 

[RogerGarrett]

Originally posted by Dario
<br />The bottom pic...if that is an olivewood, I want it [][]. Just do a scratch and sniff to tell if it is olivewood. The aroma is unmistakable.

As far as I am can tell from the pics and your story, you got a good deal...but what really matters is if you are satisfied or not.

Billy and Dario,

Thanks for the comments. Satisfied - well - I think I am. The problem I am having is the shocking difference between the dark order of olive (if there is a dark olive) and the lighter order that looks more traditional to me.

Dario - shoot me your address via email - I'll send you a piece or two of the dark - you can tell me what you think. I don't know what the sniff would reveal - as I don't know what olive wood smells like! I can compare to the lighter - maybe I'll try that.

Best,
Roger Garrett

 

[Dario]

Roger,

Just kidding. I do love to try that but you better keep it []. Your generousity is appreciated and noted though. I have enough for now. If you ever want to trade later, then that is another story. []

Re: scratch and sniff...just try the lighter colored ones and then the darker one. If you sanded or planned the others then you should have noticed the aroma.

 

[RogerGarrett]

Originally posted by JimGo
<br />For example, there is BOW, which has the lighter colors, and then there ROW, which tends to have darker coloring. Check out the pens pictured here to get an idea of the color ranges, figuring, etc.

Jim,

BOW is Bethlehem Olive Wood
ROW is ? Regular?

None of the pens in the pictures you searched on have the same color as the dark olive wood I was sent. But the lighter wood looks very similar to the wood those pens were made from.

Thanks for the info! I'm learning.

Best,
Roger Garrett

 

[KenV]

I have been inpressed with the wide range of grain colors and patterns of olive wood. Even in the "holy land" market, there are significant differences in those from bethelem, and nazzarath. Add to that sources all through the warm climates from greece to spain and the warmer US states. I have california and arizona olive wood. The sap wood tends to plain.

If you want to share the source, drop me a pm. Looks like reasonable value.

 

[Dario]

ROW - Russian Olive Wood

 

[Rifleman1776]

$1.00 per blank, even for near junk is a very reasonable price.

 

[DCBluesman]

Ok. I'm not saying this is definitive, but I've got a fair amount of experience with most of the olive woods. The top 5 blanks are "killer" figure. The two red blanks are red heart. The six full-length blanks in the next picture are excellent figure. The shorts are good to excellent. In the last figure, the top blank appears to be Russian olivewood...with excellent figure. The bottom blank appears to be olivewood burl...something I'd kill for! If you want to know if the wood is olivewood, lightly sand a blank and then smell it. It will smell like olive oil...yummm. Make me hungry just thinking about it. Did you get a good deal? I'd be happy with that assortment for the price you paid.

 

[DCBluesman]

Roger - to see some really dark olivewood, see Mik's album. He has a number of pens, pen rests and boxes that are extremely dark and beautiful.

 

[JimGo]

Thanks Lou! I couldn't remember how he spelled his username...was going to point Roger there too!

 

[BigRob777]

OK, I don't want to step on anyone's toes with my opinion, but I have a different idea on some of this. First of all, you can't tell angle cut from cross cut, if you don't show the other side (not the end grain side). I agree with everyone that this is most likely European Olive, but I think that the red wood is bloodwood, or padauk. Since the lighting is causing a yellow tint in the pictures, it is hard to tell. Red heart is lighter, by far than bloodwood, so you can tell by picking them up. The dark wood looks exactly like the box of South Eastern U. S. walnut burl that I have. Of course, picture color makes a huge difference. A dollar a blank is a good price for Olive. I've never sold European (Russian) Olive, but I've sold BOW and am getting ready to sell some African Olivewood. Your material here looks OK. If it were BOW, it would cost more and should have more contrast and swirl, but as it isn't it seems like a decent deal to me. That much difference in cut style seems like a lot to me though.
Also, be careful buying green wood. I almost never sell it green.
Rob

 

[wudwrkr]

Have you contact the seller with these questions? The olive wood blanks look good and for a buck I'd be pleased with them. You never mentioned how many blanks you ordered. Many suppliers of blanks will add some free stuff and it looks like you got more than you bargained for. That last "darker" blank looks more like the macasar ebony that chitswood has been selling. I have some of it myself.

 

[Skye]

Jerusalem olive is my favorite. Lots of lines.

 

[RogerGarrett]

Originally posted by wudwrkr
<br />Have you contact the seller with these questions? The olive wood blanks look good and for a buck I'd be pleased with them. You never mentioned how many blanks you ordered. Many suppliers of blanks will add some free stuff and it looks like you got more than you bargained for. That last "darker" blank looks more like the macasar ebony that chitswood has been selling. I have some of it myself.

Looks like I hit an interesting topic/discussion.

I have continued to ask the seller, but no response (which can be very frustraing!). Let me explain a bit further - but I assure you, I do not want to create any problems on a list or moderated website. My only goal is/was to find out the types of wood and your thoughts. For the most part, everyone is saying the wood is worth what I paid - $25 inclusive of shipping. I will be paying again for the second shipment - I may like a great deal, but I can afford to pay $25 - just as I figured I could lose $25 if the deal went bad (which I don't think it has). However, there are aspects of the "deal" that are odd - and I'll share what I can without jeopardizing anyone's identity.

I ordered the amount I discussed in my first posting - 4 angle cut and 10 straight grain - all "killer jumbo blanks." I waited nearly a week, and I heard nothing (didn't get confirmation that he received payment), so I contacted the seller via the website email and asked if he could give me the status of the order. He responded with a one sentence reply that said, essentially, "it says you received a shipment on the 27th, wasn't the olivewood with that shipment?"

I responded that I had not received anything from him. No response for two more days, so I contacted him again and asked him to respond. Nothing. I asked a member of this list who had done business with him if he was on the up and up, and the response was a qualified yes with a stamp of approval. So I again sent an email. I don't want to share with all of you how I finally got him to respond, but eventually I receieved communication via a variety of emails from him and through another party - all very conflicting. One said the order had been sent, the other said he received payment but hadn't sent it, another said he needed to know what exactly it was that I ordered, and so on. Eventually, he told me he would send another shipment and if the first arrived - just keep it (!).

The next day, he emailed me confirmation that the second package was going out. That same day, the first package arrived......had I jumped the gun? I felt guilty - but wait - it didn't look like olive wood at all - although it was nice wood. It was dry and heavy, and despite 6-7 angle cut pieces (I had only ordered 4), the rest consisted of 22 short cross cut pieces - and I had ordered staight cut. Hmmmmm.....some weird stuff going on here. I had wood - but it didn't appear to be what I had ordered in the numbers I had ordered or the cuts I had ordered. A mystery!


Two days later, I received the second shipment - and the wood looks entirely different and is really pretty much what I thought I was getting - except for the two red pieces - which do not appear to be either paduk or redheart - not very heavy. I've seen some good bloodwood - but this didn't look like that either. Frankly - it really looks like the olivewood - only red. Very strange.

Anyway - my goal was to pay for the second shipment also - afterall - it cost him $ in terms of shipping and wood - and, even though I hadn't expected to pay for two shipments, the price seemed good and he followed through. He should be paid.

However - the differences in wood are so enormously huge - I don't really think the dark stuff is olivewood. I did go to Mik's homepage and visited his photos (9 of them) - and NONE were nearly as dark as this wood. When I put the dark crosscut pieces together, it resembles Wenge - but I can't tell. I emailed the seller and told him I would be contacting him with some more information as soon as the second package arrived (I didn't tell him the first had arrived - to be safe). I contacted him yesterday to explain that I had received both shipments and could he tell me what the red wood is and what the dark wood is? NO RESPONSE YET. *sigh*

I'm enclosing three photos of this wood - some cross cut "reassembled" so you can see the regular grain, and some of the longer angle cut both ways.

I hope these pictures provide better clues to the mystery. I had to go outside on a nice sunny day and take the shots to see the grain well.

Looking forward to more answers.

Best,
Roger Garrett

 

[Dario]

Sounds like a shipping mix-up. probably someone out there is waiting for his package...or got what you originally ordered.

These things do happen and I think the seller did good...so do as you would and send him what you think is fair. (I think I know who []).

 

[BigRob777]

Dave,
I think you got it. It does look like macassar ebony, since there are no voids in it. Well, Dario knows what Texas ebony looks like, so it probably isn't that either. This is definitely NOT wenge.
Rob

 

[mrcook4570]

Mac Ebony, angle cut and cross cut. Turns fairly easily for angle cut and polishes beautifully.

 

[RogerGarrett]

Originally posted by mrcook4570
<br />Mac Ebony, angle cut and cross cut. Turns fairly easily for angle cut and polishes beautifully.

Mystery solved []- I finally heard from the seller - and we are square. He sent a shipment to me instead of someone else - but he has no idea who that someone else is. The wood is in fact Mac Ebony. Anyone missing a shipment???? []

The red wood is redheart - but it sure is lighter than the stuff I have. He had thrown it in as a gift.[]

Can't complain about the sale - and I understand how a shipment can go to the wrong place - I've done it myself back in the old days of starting up the baton/mouthpiece business.[xx(]

Thanks for your expertise - you guys sure know a lot about wood!

Best wishes,
Roger Garrett

 

[JimGo]

Glad to hear everything is square!

 

[BigRob777]

I am humbled. Lou got it right, as did others. That means I was wrrrrrrrrrrrrrr...........not right. [] BTW, the redheart that I have is also quite light, as compared to bloodwood.
Rob

 

[chitswood]

Wow, I missed alot[]

I've been writing a term paper so I didn't stop and look much and this post escaped me like the email did.

ya, you guys figured it out. I know Wayneis is missisng some ME, but I don't think thats his order, I also won't be able to fix the shipment till saturday.

Glad you liked it Mr. Garret, sorry about the confusion, the extra redheart is just random blanks I may throw into an order.

The Olivewood is SPANISH

I originally only offered the straight grain blanks for a dollar, but added cross cut and angle cut as I ran into wider (and more costly) boards. There's no bait and switch here Mr. Garret, just availability.

BTW, when I do crosscuts, I don't always have a 6 inch wide clear board, so instead I send two 3" pieces. I didn't realize this was real important, but from now on I'll call that out.

Happy turning everyone, if anything is wrong with your orders, expect me to fix your problem despite my own costs, slow communication isn't me ignoring, its school and shipping. Regards -Darick

 

[53Jim]

Roger Garrett wrote...
The problem I am having is the shocking difference between the dark order of olive (if there is a dark olive) and the lighter order that looks more traditional to me...

It's so easy, I'm surprised nobody wlse thought of it.


The light wood is from a GREEN olive tree, and the dark wood is from a BLACK olive tree.[][]

 

[BigRob777]

Jim,
You're bad.
Rob