What do we make next? (US Made Pen Kits)

[McKenzie Penworks]

We're headed into full year #2 since purchasing LaserLinez and now have the Liberty, Desire, Coyote, and Click Coyote pretty well figured out. Our finishing methods are finally where we like them and we've even managed to take the polishing phase from 48 hours down to about an hour thanks to our friends at Mass Finishing. That means it's time to plan for the next year and figure out what kits we want to bring to market.

My current plans:

Jan/Feb: Snap cap pen design using rollerball and fountain pen options
March/Apr: Click version of the Falcon (old LaserLinez design.. would only be 4 parts total to the pen, 2 machined, 1 clip, and the SKM88 click)

From there I'm thinking of releasing the Raven and Eagle which are capped Jr. sized fountain and rollerball pens, we'd just probably let our various resellers carry them so they all have some things that are a little different.

What I'm wondering is... what am I not thinking of? Should we have a "bolt action" type pen that isn't bullet themed? More of a toggle really... do we mess with slim line or close to slim line type kits if they'd still be like $15? What would you guys like to see from a US Manufacturer in stainless steel? Themed kits are NOT an option. Think profiles that can be done on a lathe, if we have to mill anything that adds cost.

I should mention we'd like to do Brass but matching clips are tough... we don't use plating currently so that would also mean that it would patina over time and the clip strength wouldn't be ideal. We DO have access to a PVD coating facility that can do black/gold/etc but quality PVD could add as much as $5 to the cost of a kit.

 

[rixstix]

While I am currently on a kitless journey, I prefer a bronze option over brass due to a different patina & strength.

CDA521 to be specific.

 

[tgsponge1]

Just keep doing what you are doing! I feel that you have enough on your plate now, get through these model and see what happens.

Everything you have come out with recently has been quality and made in USA

Pedro

 

[McKenzie Penworks]

While I am currently on a kitless journey, I prefer a bronze option over brass due to a different patina & strength.

CDA521 to be specific.

Could be an option... and one idea we do have is the minimalist approach to custom (kitless) makers that might want a ballpoint option. Figure a threaded cone for the nose and a threaded piece for the back of the pen that accepts the SKM-88. You'd have to drill and tap your material and then screw them into place. Easy enough to offer with or without a clip for those that prefer to make their own.

 

[McKenzie Penworks]

Just keep doing what you are doing! I feel that you have enough on your plate now, get through these model and see what happens.

Everything you have come out with recently has been quality and made in USA

Pedro

Thanks my friend! It's been an adventure for sure... We're definitely already going to busy for the next couple months between my ideas and then tooling up the Artemis for Bullseye but lots of months left in the year to try and plan for!

 

[SabertoothBunny]

I am really impressed with what you guys have been putting out. My recommendation would be to keep your current plan and not rush to push out more kit styles. Maybe focus on building up inventory for the short term and testing different kits for late 2023 or beyond. Keeping balance of ball point and fountain.

I would recommend against a slimline pen, $15 is a lot for that basic style and I am not sure how much success you would have with it. A bolt action pen would be neat though, not necessarily a .30 or something already done but your own twist. Maybe a click style sierra type of pen. Something else to consider could be bottle stoppers/openers or other non-pen specific items. Maybe a hobby knife style of kit?

 

[McKenzie Penworks]

I am really impressed with what you guys have been putting out. My recommendation would be to keep your current plan and not rush to push out more kit styles. Maybe focus on building up inventory for the short term and testing different kits for late 2023 or beyond. Keeping balance of ball point and fountain.

I would recommend against a slimline pen, $15 is a lot for that basic style and I am not sure how much success you would have with it. A bolt action pen would be neat though, not necessarily a .30 or something already done but your own twist. Maybe a click style sierra type of pen. Something else to consider could be bottle stoppers/openers or other non-pen specific items. Maybe a hobby knife style of kit?

Inventory is going to happen regardless of anything else... The last piece of the puzzle for us was figuring out the polishing process in a way that didn't take 48+ hours. After we establish a stable wholesale market to a couple resellers we'll be investing in a 2nd of the larger finishing machines which takes capacity up to about 100+ kits a day at a relaxed pace. With a new employee we'll be able to finish 400+. Process improvement is a HUGE deal for me and I think we've optimized to the extent we can without a new shop.

I've thought about doing some project kits... keychain containers, etc. I'm not going to do bottle stoppers because Ruth Niles already does a GREAT job of those and I prefer to fill needs vs try to compete directly with someone and risk hurting their business.

 

[rixstix]

Could be an option... and one idea we do have is the minimalist approach to custom (kitless) makers that might want a ballpoint option. Figure a threaded cone for the nose and a threaded piece for the back of the pen that accepts the SKM-88. You'd have to drill and tap your material and then screw them into place. Easy enough to offer with or without a clip for those that prefer to make their own.

If/when you start thinking about cones, consider the dimensions of Schmidt 8126 & P8126 capless rollerball refills just in case the same cone would be useful for them & Parker ballpoint refills. SKM-88 taps are readily available, so you might not need the threaded piece.

 

[Curly]

A question that comes up here every few months here is for fountain pens that are thin. That might be a direction to look into. A long shot but maybe you can find a supplier of a nib smaller than a #5.

Pete

 

[McKenzie Penworks]

A question that comes up here every few months here is for fountain pens that are thin. That might be a direction to look into. A long shot but maybe you can find a supplier of a nib smaller than a #5.

Pete

Exactly the idea behind the snap cap pen... it'll be a thinner profile fountain pen. We're having to get a little creative with tubes to do it but I think it'll turn out well in the end.

 

[walshjp17]

While I agree with Marcus about Slimlines not being "cost effective", Cross pens still are big sellers, especially in the corporate world. If you could make a stainless steel version and not call it a "Slimline" (perhaps with a 3/8" tube and a Parker refill), it might be something to offer folks. An alternative might be a 3/8" European/Mont Blanc style.

 

[dogcatcher]

A refillable felt tip pen, also make it as thin as possible.

 

[Dannv]

I too am doing mostly kitless fountain pens. Maybe not a full kit idea, but decent looking clips with a ring larger tan 10mm or a clip that is set up to be hidden on a 12 to 15mm cap would be cool. Also, a section that will hold a nib housing (I like the Jowo #6) that is more the size of a common section with a threaded insert for the body might also be a cool thing to have access to.

 

[TonyL]

A longer (around 3in barrel length) , single barrel pen, Schmidt click or standard twist with a 8m hole (so it accepts a Parkers style refill, and a body dimension similar the PSI EDC or Classic). The "meaty" (but still relatively slim body), may allow one to use less opaque materials with less reliance on reverse and/or tube painting and will have more structural integrity than the thin-walled kits. I would also have the top and bottom to be the same diameters (same-size bushings). That is what I would like. I have no idea what others prefer or sell. Thanks for asking.

 

[Amanap]

I personally would love an American made key chain option. I do a lot of fordite and hate idea of putting material from the American car industry on foreign hardware.

 

[PreacherJon]

Jr. Gents and Zen Pens are pretty much all I turn. So, I'm interested in kits with those. I will on occasion make the Patriot type pens. If there were kits for the patriot, I'd probably make a lot more of them.

 

[jcm71]

Exactly the idea behind the snap cap pen... it'll be a thinner profile fountain pen. We're having to get a little creative with tubes to do it but I think it'll turn out well in the end.

Perhaps something along the lines of the Marksman Nighthawk (As far as I know, no longer in production). A postable version if possible.

 

[McKenzie Penworks]

A longer (around 3in barrel length) , single barrel pen, Schmidt click or standard twist with a 8m hole (so it accepts a Parkers style refill, and a body dimension similar the PSI EDC or Classic). The "meaty" (but still relatively slim body), may allow one to use less opaque materials with less reliance on reverse and/or tube painting and will have more structural integrity than the thin-walled kits. I would also have the top and bottom to be the same diameters (same-size bushings). That is what I would like. I have no idea what others prefer or sell. Thanks for asking.

Have you seen our Coyote click pen? It's got a little more meat on the bone, uses a 3/8" tube, and the Schmidt SKM88 click We are looking at a Liberty version which will definitely be chunkier since it's 27/64.

 

[McKenzie Penworks]

Perhaps something along the lines of the Marksman Nighthawk (As far as I know, no longer in production). A postable version if possible.

That's actually the starting point for that pen... I bought the Marksman/LaserLinez designs from Constant and we found a few pieces from that pen in a bin and decided we absolutely had to have a pen based on that.

 

[McKenzie Penworks]

Jr. Gents and Zen Pens are pretty much all I turn. So, I'm interested in kits with those. I will on occasion make the Patriot type pens. If there were kits for the patriot, I'd probably make a lot more of them.

I'm assuming you mean the Patriot (at Exotic) that's the Apollo design other places? We do have 1 JR based design out, and plans for 2 more that are already designed but just have to gather up the funds to bring them back.

 

[darrin1200]

A long shot but maybe you can find a supplier of a nib smaller than a #5.

Oh that would be so cool.

 

[McKenzie Penworks]

Oh that would be so cool.

Schmidt has some pretty small nibs...

 

[TonyL]

Have you seen our Coyote click pen? It's got a little more meat on the bone, uses a 3/8" tube, and the Schmidt SKM88 click We are looking at a Liberty version which will definitely be chunkier since it's 27/64.

that is a very nice kit and close to what I am talking about thank you

 

[McKenzie Penworks]

that is a very nice kit and close to what I am talking about thank you

It's been fun approaching this as a pen maker... "what would I want to turn...." the Coyote twist pen is great but I think in click form it really shines. Plus, it's one less part to actually have to manufacture and finish which saves time. The old Falcon is also 3/8" tubed and we'll be bringing it back as a click for sure, not entirely sold on doing another twist. One of the things I want to do is look at some of the Schmidt twist mechanisms and build a pen or two around them vs the ones from Taiwan.

 

[jcm71]

Exactly the idea behind the snap cap pen... it'll be a thinner profile fountain pen. We're having to get a little creative with tubes to do it but I think it'll turn out well in the end.

Nighthawk tubes were 23/64 and 29/64.

 

[McKenzie Penworks]

Nighthawk tubes were 23/64 and 29/64.

I'm keeping the over all design and we're looking into what tubes to use... I want it to be as slim as possible. The pieces I found were SMALL so it looks like Constant had been experimenting with a thinner version. The other change I'm planning is to make it postable. That'll require some redesign around the back of the pen obviously.

 

[KenB259]

It's been fun approaching this as a pen maker... "what would I want to turn...." the Coyote twist pen is great but I think in click form it really shines. Plus, it's one less part to actually have to manufacture and finish which saves time. The old Falcon is also 3/8" tubed and we'll be bringing it back as a click for sure, not entirely sold on doing another twist. One of the things I want to do is look at some of the Schmidt twist mechanisms and build a pen or two around them vs the ones from Taiwan.

I'm glad you're thinking about more click pens with the Schmidt skm-88 mechanism.

 

[McKenzie Penworks]

I'm glad you're thinking about more click pens with the Schmidt skm-88 mechanism.

I want to reduce points of failure... That mechanism is solid. The only thing I can ding it on is that if you're a little too gentle it seems to kind of like to hang a bit. Easy enough to just click harder but that was just something I noticed when I was looking into it.

 

[jrista]

We're headed into full year #2 since purchasing LaserLinez and now have the Liberty, Desire, Coyote, and Click Coyote pretty well figured out. Our finishing methods are finally where we like them and we've even managed to take the polishing phase from 48 hours down to about an hour thanks to our friends at Mass Finishing. That means it's time to plan for the next year and figure out what kits we want to bring to market.

My current plans:

Jan/Feb: Snap cap pen design using rollerball and fountain pen options

So, this is intriguing to me. I have owned a couple of snap cap rollerballs, still have one actually. They are quite nice, despite not being very expensive. They have a particular feel to them, though...that high end feeling, where things are not clunky, they have a slightly softer feel...kind of like that "rich shlunk" you hear and feel when you close the door on a high end car... There is some kind of rubber sheath inside the cap, so that when you push the cap onto either end of the pen, it snaps in place, but has that kind of "rich shlunk" feel to it. It snaps in, but its not a hard, clacky, "cheap" snap...its a high end softersnap. The whole pen has a particular weight to it as well, well balanced, but not light weight, and not overly heavy...

I've made a couple of the existing snap cap kits on the market now. I can't say I like any of them. All of them in the end, just had a really cheap feel to them. I have decided not to even try to sell any, and won't be making more. That, however, hasn't stemmed my desire for a nice high quality, higher end snap cap rollerball/fountain pen kit. Something with shlunk, rather than clack. Seems there might be an opportunity here...

 

[PreacherJon]

I'm assuming you mean the Patriot (at Exotic) that's the Apollo design other places? We do have 1 JR based design out, and plans for 2 more that are already designed but just have to gather up the funds to bring them back.

This is the one I'm talking about... made by CSUSA Patriot.... Woodcraft has the same pen and the call it something else. I would think a laser cut item would be great for this style.

 

[socdad]

How about a pencil to match the Coyote click pen?

 

[McKenzie Penworks]

So, this is intriguing to me. I have owned a couple of snap cap rollerballs, still have one actually. They are quite nice, despite not being very expensive. They have a particular feel to them, though...that high end feeling, where things are not clunky, they have a slightly softer feel...kind of like that "rich shlunk" you hear and feel when you close the door on a high end car... There is some kind of rubber sheath inside the cap, so that when you push the cap onto either end of the pen, it snaps in place, but has that kind of "rich shlunk" feel to it. It snaps in, but its not a hard, clacky, "cheap" snap...its a high end softersnap. The whole pen has a particular weight to it as well, well balanced, but not light weight, and not overly heavy...

I've made a couple of the existing snap cap kits on the market now. I can't say I like any of them. All of them in the end, just had a really cheap feel to them. I have decided not to even try to sell any, and won't be making more. That, however, hasn't stemmed my desire for a nice high quality, higher end snap cap rollerball/fountain pen kit. Something with shlunk, rather than clack. Seems there might be an opportunity here...

We'll be using delrin for the capture against the steel... it's "softer" engaging than some plastic options. Considering the pen parts will all be machined solid stainless, I suspect it should be pretty solid feeling over all!

 

[McKenzie Penworks]

How about a pencil to match the Coyote click pen?

My next order from Schmidt will include a few pencil mechanisms to play with... Don't want to commit to any sort of time frame but I've seen enough "Hey I need a recommendation of a pencil and pen set" posts over the years to realize that's a missed opportunity for sure!

 

[jttheclockman]

Tim, this is a thought I had and was going to leave alone but you posted a photo in this link and had to say something. This would be my suggestion.

https://www.penturners.org/threads/click-pen.176618/#post-2177581

 

[McKenzie Penworks]

Tim, this is a thought I had and was going to leave alone but you posted a photo in this link and had to say something. This would be my suggestion.

https://www.penturners.org/threads/click-pen.176618/#post-2177581

Haha replied there but... yes... we have plans for a minimalist/advanced turner type. The plan right now is that you would drill/tap your blank and we'd put something like 10-1 threads on our parts. No tube... Just nose cone and rear metal piece to accept the schmidt mechanism. Keeps costs down, and allows you to have a pen without a bunch of metal on it.

 

[Wayne]

Tim,

Just a thought. Take a look at a poll I posted.

Which kind of kits do you prefer to turn?

NOTICE: IF YOU ADD OR CHANGE A VOTE YOU MUST RE-ENTER ALL PREVIOUS VOTES! Many members ask the simple question, Which kits do members prefer to turn? Here are some things you might consider, or ask others for their preferences. • This Poll is not meant to encourage you to turn what others turn...

www.penturners.org

 

[McKenzie Penworks]

Tim,

Just a thought. Take a look at a poll I posted.

Which kind of kits do you prefer to turn?

NOTICE: IF YOU ADD OR CHANGE A VOTE YOU MUST RE-ENTER ALL PREVIOUS VOTES! Many members ask the simple question, Which kits do members prefer to turn? Here are some things you might consider, or ask others for their preferences. • This Poll is not meant to encourage you to turn what others turn...

www.penturners.org

Pretty much no surprises there... All within what we're looking at doing. Plus after more than a decade of turning pens, I am working on designs I would want to turn/sell too.

 

[BULLWINKLE]

This is the one I'm talking about... made by CSUSA Patriot.... Woodcraft has the same pen and the call it something else. I would think a laser cut item would be great for this style.

Also resembles PSI Polaris. Maybe the same as different companies use different names for identical products

 

[BULLWINKLE]

Two things I like about your products are American made and Stainless Steel, with no platings. I don't get any themed kits as most are gaudy and ugly. There must be a large market for them as every catalog I receive has new kits that are uglier and higher priced. Due to the cost they are doing away with the platings that hold up well, such as rhodium.
Stick to stainless steel and keep the designs classy. That's my opinion for what it's worth. The flashy theme pens may have a good market but most people I know prefer elegant. I've been considering buying a kit in sterling silver even though it's pricey. If I do, I'll make it for me and not to sell.
Also, perhaps etching some scroll work or design into the stainless. Something simple to make it stand out more.
Chrome and other cheap platings wear off. What about some stainless that is anodized to give it permanent color ? Not on every kit, but as an option. That way the customer has a choice. If they want color it costs more of course.

 

[ZanderPommo]

The world needs a click rollerball. If you could do a long single tube design (like a long clicker) and adapt a mechanism inside the nib to keep it close to airtight, you'd have to increase your staff just to keep them in stock.