Thoughts: Does brand matter to you personally? Age of tool?

[Anson]

Hi everyone,

I've been thinking lots about getting myself a personal lathe since I've been using my guild's lathe they lent me past 5-6 months. Very grateful of the guild to have lent me their spare lathe, definitely won't be able to get started woodturning to where I am today.

I'm wondering, what do you look for on a lathe? Is it the brand? Warranty? Does age come into account, when looking for a used one? If I were to mainly turn pens, would a mini be good enough or a midi would be just as good?

Where I am, it'll be a tad hard to find a used lathe. The last one I found was at least 3 decades old, passed down by the seller's grandfather to him, and he has neither a clue what the brand is nor how to use a lathe.

Maybe I've already answered my own question as I'm typing here If I were to get a lathe, I'm looking at a Rikon 70-220VSR Midi Lathe. It seems tad more expensive than other brands found in major retail stores here (like Nova Comet and King Industrial), but the 5 year warranty seems to be worth the purchase and how versatile this lathe is after further research. What do you guys think?

Looking forward to hear from everyone.

Regards,
Anson

 

[monophoto]

Your money, your choice. But f it were my money, here's what I would be thinking:
1. For my first lathe, I might consider a used machine provided it's of fairly recent vintage and appears to be in good condition. Once I found myself hooked on the hobby, I would probably avoid used and only opt for a new machine. However, I might make an exception if I found a fairly new high-end lathe (eg, OneWay, Robust, Powermatic, Vicmark, etc) that is for sale because the current owner can no longer use it. If the present owner is upgrading, ask lots of questions to make sure that the switch isn't due to a problem with the machine.
2. Variable speed is preferred, but not a Reeves-drive machine.
3. For an entry-level machine, the brands that I would consider include Jet, Rikon, or Turncrafter (KingCanada is pretty much equivalent to Turncrafter in your part of the world), or Axminster. I would avoid lathes that are currently getting bad reports from users (eg, Nova and Delta),
4. A mini-lathe is fine as a starter, but my experience is that you quickly outgrown the very limited capabilities of really small machines. In my case, I upgraded to a midi-lathe in less than two years.
5. Ideally, MT-2, and 1"x8tpi spindle, 10" throw, 16" bed length, 1np motor. A machine with more throw, bed and horsepower would be better but not essential - unless you were lucky enough to find a recent-model One-Way, Robust, Vicmark or Powermatic for a very good price. Avoid MT1 and 3/4"16tpi spindles - they are fine for light-duty work like penturning, but it's hard to find fittings for heavier duty work.

 

[Jarod888]

Personally, I like jet. I have 2 1221's, and a 1018. All are variable speed. I also have a nova comet 2 12 inch and I'm not very impressed with it. Infact, it is currently being utilized as a flat bed drum sander.
I also have a one-way and that is the cream of the crop. If funds are no option, go with oneway, robust, vicmark or powermatic. Weight is your biggest friend for any kind of turning, even pens. The reason is weight absorbs vibration and doesn't transfer it to your work.

I've never turned on a rikon, but I have their grinder and it functions well, so I would imagine that their lathes are decent.

Laguna also has a midi size lathe, but I personally feel the jet is a better value. For one it automatically comes with a longer bed lathe and the extension nearly doubles the length. With the Laguna, the bed is 3 inches shorter to star and the extension only adds 16 inches. You may not think you need bed length because you are only doing pens, but trust me you will never regret having the extra length. Drilling pen blanks alone can nearly take up the entire useful area.

The one glaring issue with the jet is the tail stock clamp. Simply put, it sucks. One of the first upgrades you should make is ordering a new hold down clamp from a member here by the name of Rick Herrell. I think his handle is rherrell. It's isn't very expensive and seriously improves the clamping of the tail stock.

I would stay away from pen craft lathes or any of the cheap ones you may see on Amazon.

As far as used, it is really a crap shoot, if it hasn't been used very much it might be a good deal, but if it is old and on the last leg, it isn't worth much. I wouldn't pay more that 1/2 of the new price for a used one, regardless of condition. You are likely to have no support from the manufacturer, so you will have to source replacement parts yourself.

I would also budget about the cost of the lathe for tools. So if you pick up a jet 1221 from Amazon for 900ish, expect to spend about that on tools. You are going to need at minimum:

A chuck with pen jaws. Nova are good. Get a 3.25 inch one. ~135
A drill chuck (mt2) ~50 for a decent import one from amazon
Various drill bits (~100 - depending on the different styles of pens)
Tool chisels, carbide with replaceable inserts is a good starting point. ~150
Tool chisels, high speed steel. ~ 150
Grinder with decent wheels or in reality just get CBN to start. ~ 140, plus 125 per cbn wheel. Woodturnerswonders is a great place to pick up high quality CBN wheels
Some form of grinding jig attachment. ~135 on amazon. Wolverine systems are a good all-around system.
Eventually, you will want to upgrade the tool rests, but the starter ones are sufficient.
Sand paper, finishing supplies, etc. 100 ish.

 

[MRDucks2]

My "new" lathe is a used Powermatic P90 circa 1959 with a Reeves drive and a Variable Frequency Drive (my mod).

 

[leehljp]

I have a Rikon 15 years old; switched the motor out for VSR. You are doing good to get VSR!
I have a Grizzly 16" with non-belt swap VS.

Swapping belts got old fast.

 

[KenB259]

The way I'm reading the OP post is not really asking about any specific brand recommendation, so I'll avoid that. When I buy a tool, any tool, I buy the best quality I can afford. I don't equate quality with price. I have said this before but it explains pretty well my mindset. I want the quality of my work to reflect the best I can do, not the best my tools can do. I can get better, for the most part, my tools cannot.

 

[MRDucks2]

Ken has a point. Determine your budget, how much you can afford, then determine the unit that suits your needs from there. Shop for value per dollar spent within your range.

 

[jttheclockman]

My point of view on the OP question is years ago you could zero in on a brand and check their track record and warranties and parts replacement availability. Today that is harder to do. Many tools weather hand tools or machine tools come off the same asembly line only to painted a different color. I see this alot in the scrollsaw world. Lathes are no different. Yes there are some lathes today that are making that breakthrough and trying to distinguish themselves from others. I too hate to give brand names because first being from different countries and parts of the world it may not be as easy to get and you may have a compatible unit within your area. I do have 2 Jet lathes, a mini and a midi and love both and have had no problems.

Now just another fly in the ointment is battery operated tools. Need to lock into one brand because today the batteries cost are expensive but the good thing is they are interchangeable with that series platform. But need to stay with that brand. When I bought my shop tools and I am talking all big biys machines I stayed with Delta at the time which was a USA company and reliable and and parts were available. Now I would not touch Delta tools.

 

[WriteON]

My first lathe was used/gifted. CarbTec from PSI. A free lathe is the best lathe. It was small and powerful.. I loved it. Eventually it was gifted to a relative and replaced with a Jet 1015vs based on reviews. I liked the Jet and added a 1221. As stated…Buy the best you can afford or target a certain brand and save up for it. As for warranties they are
always questionable…. Never know how good or bad until needed. I had 100% recourse and "0" recourse with things in my lifetime. Good luck whatever you get.

 

[egnald]

I started with a Harbor Freight, Central Machinery Benchtop Lathe (1/2 HP). I think I spent a little over $200 on it. I was very happy with it for about a year. Then I upgraded it using a Variable Speed conversion kit (3/4 HP) upgrade from PSI for a little less than $200. I was very happy with it for another year. Then I had a wonderful company bonus/birthday present to decide on so I replaced it with a Jet 1221VS (1 HP) which I am still using (upgraded with a Rockler dust collector and Rockler tool rests).

Would I do it again, probably. I started out with the least expensive option I could get because at that time I had zero experience with a wood lathe and I didn't want to lay out much money in case I didn't like it or just plain didn't have the skills required to use it. The Variable Speed conversion to the basic lathe in my opinion was well worth it and was a huge improvement since I could get by running it at a good turning speed and at a slow drilling, sanding, and finishing speed without having to mess around with changing the belt. Only after I was convinced I would be using the lathe frequently (pen turning addiction kicked in hard after the VS conversion), I decided I would be turning enough to benefit from a better and more expensive lathe (for my bonus/birthday present).

Good luck in whatever decision you make! - Dave

 

[penicillin]

Does tool brand matter? Does the age of the tool matter? Yes and no to both.

Sometimes older tools are the best made tools you can find. Other times they are a nightmare that never ends. There is no easy answer - you must consider the individual tool. What is its condition? What will it take to make it useable and safe? Will parts be available when you need them? Does the model have a history of known issues or a reputation for reliability and longevity?

Brands matter too, but what matters just as much is when the tool was manufactured by a given brand. Some great brand names from the past were bought out by companies who threw away everything but the formerly great brand name.

It isn't as easy with lathes as it might be for other old woodworking tools. The reason is that there are a lot of accessories that fit modern lathes. Some old lathes may be solidly built, but they may lack standard tapers or headstock threads.

Whatever lathe I might look for, I would not settle for anything less than a midi size lathe with MT2 tapers, 1 inch x 8 TPI headstock threads, and an electronic variable speed control. It should also have a flat cast iron bed (no tubes, no aluminum). It should last my lifetime, and be reasonably easy to maintain and repair in the future. Beyond that, everything else is improvements in robustness, taller swing or longer bed, extra features and capabilities, etc.

I want to add one more comment:
Modern power tools rely more and more on computer chips to operate. I worry that computer circuits will be the "Achilles' heel" of our power tools. The tool may have a powerful motor, solid cast iron everything, and be built to last a century, but if the computer controller that runs everything on that tool fails, it will be impossible find a replacement part in 30, 40, 50 years. Far too many otherwise useable tools have found themselves in the landfill, and that is only a harbinger of the future flood of unrepairable large tools that is coming. Older tools relied on ordinary switches, wires, and the most simple circuits without computers - the electrical aspects of those tools can be maintained easily with common, standard parts.
-> This issue is not only related to tools. The same concerns about dependence on computer controllers and their impact on waste apply to so many things around us - vehicles (yeah, think about those large trucks on the road), appliances, etc.

 

[Anson]

Thanks, everyone, for your replies! I purposely left the question somewhat open ended to see what everyone's thoughts are, and I'm getting lots of incredible and different answers I've never thought of.

Brands are definitely harder to zero-in now, since I am aware that some of the lathes with similar specs are actually made from the same manufacturer, just slapped on with their specific brands.

I'm very grateful to be in my woodturning guild when I wanted to try woodturning out for the first time. Just like Dave, aka egnald, I got addicted after making my first pen, and now I have countless pens made.

The current lathe I'm using belongs to the guild I'm in. It's a Delta 12-1/2" Variable Speed midi lathe. This lathe has done wonders in making pens for me. I've told the guild president that I can give back the lathe whenever they need it, and I am still using it after 6 months! With the art gallery maker space closed down, maybe permanently, in my area, this guild lathe will most likely be jumping from member to member until they find out what to do with it.

I'm definitely pursuing this hobby lots and so I will certainly be looking at a new lathe. I'm still dead set on the Rikon 70-220VSR Midi Lathe, which I'm hoping that will serve me many years to come. No idea when I'll get it yet, hopefully sometime early next year, since I've spent quite a bit on Christmas gifts for my family I should cut back on buying gifts and make them gifts instead on my lathe

In mean time, I'll enjoy my time to use the current lathe I have and hopefully have more fun with my personal tools in near future

Thanks, everyone!!

Regards,
Anson