Twist Mechanism issue

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Jehster1

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Nov 11, 2019
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Washington DC
Hi all,

I just started turning, this is only my 11th pen but I came across an issue that I can't figure out. This is the Rising Phoenix style pen from PSI an after I put everything together, the twist mechanism will not engage if the pen is fully together. The barrel will just spin. The transmission will only engage if the barrel is pulled out about half an inch and turned. See picture. Any ideas or suggestions to fix? If I wanted to take the end cap off to inspect, what's the best way without damaging the pen?

Rising Phoenix.jpg
 
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magpens

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Feb 2, 2011
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Can't really give you much help, other than to point out the following ....
After you have assembled/pressed the barrel to the clip/top, it is extremely difficult to separate without damaging the components.

Your picture shows the pressed-together assembly separated from the nib (lower pointed end) by about half an inch. That half-inch gap should not be there. . Perhaps if you pressed the two ends together to get rid of that gap, the twist mechanism would be engaged and would work.
The twist mechanism depends on there being a quite tight fit of the brass tube (which is internal to the barrel/top assembly) to the twist mech.

You would know, of course, that to replace the refill you would follow the last line of the instructions that PSI supplies .....
(I myself don't find these instructions to be absolutely crystal clear, however !!)

Assembly
• Layout parts according to diagram A
• Affix the spring over the refill, drop into the opening at the front end assembly.
• Screw on the mechanism over the refill end.
• Affix the clip over the recess at the twist cap.
• Press this assembly into either end of the barrel. Note the alignment of the clip and cap (see photo on first page).
• Press the barrel assembly over the first end assembly until the barrel seats on the cap.
• The pen operates by twisting the top and bottom to advance or retract the refill.
• Replace the refill by unscrewing the barrel assembly and exposing the refill.

I hope you get things worked out.
 

Jehster1

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Nov 11, 2019
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Location
Washington DC
It's when the pen is pressed fully together that the twist mechanism does not work. The picture is of how far the pen needs to be pulled apart before the mechanism begins to work. If the pen is pressed together as per normal, the barrel just spins and does not engage the transmission. Sorry if I was not clear before.
 

Chippa

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May 22, 2019
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Location
New York
was it an overly tight fit when you pressed the pen together or did you have issues getting the bushing in on that side? is the twist mech pressed in to the correct depth?

too tight to turn would be ca or something else in your barel causing issue or mech was pushed in to the wrong depth. never heard of it not engaging but can only assume theres no friction to twist the mech.
 

Jehster1

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Nov 11, 2019
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Location
Washington DC
Not a tight fit, everything seemed to press together as usual, turned TBC so no bushings but checked for clear tubes before pressing. When pressed fully together it turns fine, just does not engage the mech. The twist housing comes pre-pressed into the nib and the mechanism simply screws into the housing (pic). If I press that piece in further, if possible, the tip would protrude out of the nib when it's in its retracted state. Maybe i'll try to press out the end cap somehow, worst case scenario is I break and already broken pen lol.
apart.jpg
 

Gersh

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May 22, 2018
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Newbury oh
My first thought is to check the barrel length. I'm not sure if you did it for staging with the picture but if you pull the nib out that much then you shouldn't be able to see any of the refill. If the refill sticks out that far naturally without it being fully screwed in that's a problem.

Based off the IAP bushings and tube app the correct length of the barrel should be 2.67.

Hopefully that helps
 

jttheclockman

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Feb 22, 2005
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NJ, USA.
First off I do not like pens like this to take the refill out you unscrew that mechanism. I rather the person pull the top off and then unscrew that part. But here nor there. It could be the tube is flared out on the cap end because of extra plating and this is preventing the tabs on that twist mechanism from touching the sides of the tube if that makes sense. Sometimes what people do is squeese that part so that the end is oblong to make those tabs stick out more. Or if you could some how use a knife and pull them out more might work. You may have to try a new twist part that screws into the nib end. Or you may need a little longer tube.
 
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Not having the pen in my hand my suggestion would be to contact the tech group at PSI (not sure if Tech is correct but I've talked with them in the past), and explain what's going on. I had a similar situation with a Fly Fishing kit and after talking with them it was an easy fix. If you go to their website, use Chat, they'll direct you to the support people.
 

Jehster1

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Nov 11, 2019
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Victory is mine! I used a transfer punch to persuade the endcap out and didn't find anything out of the ordinary so I dry fit everything back together without the barrel and it worked fine so then I pressed everything back together and it also worked fine... now I just wish I knew why it didn't work in the first place...
 

jttheclockman

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Victory is mine! I used a transfer punch to persuade the endcap out and didn't find anything out of the ordinary so I dry fit everything back together without the barrel and it worked fine so then I pressed everything back together and it also worked fine... now I just wish I knew why it didn't work in the first place...
Do you know if you reversed the barrel?? If you did then what I said maybe the answer about the cap.
 

penicillin

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Feb 27, 2019
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I have worked with Penn State pens with designs like yours. The mechanisms depend on being slightly wider than the parts they screw into. Sometimes they have three flanges that stick out to grab the inner walls of the brass tube.

The mechanism depends on friction between the inside of the brass tube and the top of the pen mechanism (usually the three flanges). As you twist the top, the inside of the tube grips the mechanism through friction and rotates it to extend the pen.

The tolerances are very close. If you make the mechanism diameter large to make a tighter fit, then you won't be able to push it through the tube during assembly. If you make the diameter too small, then the mechanism will push in easily, but it won't engage with the brass tube to extend the pen tip. (That's what happened here.)

My guess is that inside of the brass tube was slightly too large in diameter where the mechanism is supposed to engage with a friction fit near the top of the pen. Lowering the mechanism in the pen helped it find a slightly narrower area of the brass tube to make a firmer friction fit with the mechanism.

The problem was fixed by inverting the brass tube so that a different part engaged the mechanism.

I would have suggested a very thin coat of thin CA at the measured depth of the mechanism. Allow to dry, and it should make the walls barely thinner - enough to grab the mechanism.
 

qquake

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Feb 8, 2004
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Northern California
Not a tight fit, everything seemed to press together as usual, turned TBC so no bushings but checked for clear tubes before pressing. When pressed fully together it turns fine, just does not engage the mech. The twist housing comes pre-pressed into the nib and the mechanism simply screws into the housing (pic). If I press that piece in further, if possible, the tip would protrude out of the nib when it's in its retracted state. Maybe i'll try to press out the end cap somehow, worst case scenario is I break and already broken pen lol.
View attachment 229347

I don't see the transmission in this photo. It should be screwed into the silver tube. I've made several of these with no problems.

 

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bertha

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Sep 16, 2018
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mexico city
I have worked with Penn State pens with designs like yours. The mechanisms depend on being slightly wider than the parts they screw into. Sometimes they have three flanges that stick out to grab the inner walls of the brass tube.

The mechanism depends on friction between the inside of the brass tube and the top of the pen mechanism (usually the three flanges). As you twist the top, the inside of the tube grips the mechanism through friction and rotates it to extend the pen.

The tolerances are very close. If you make the mechanism diameter large to make a tighter fit, then you won't be able to push it through the tube during assembly. If you make the diameter too small, then the mechanism will push in easily, but it won't engage with the brass tube to extend the pen tip. (That's what happened here.)

My guess is that inside of the brass tube was slightly too large in diameter where the mechanism is supposed to engage with a friction fit near the top of the pen. Lowering the mechanism in the pen helped it find a slightly narrower area of the brass tube to make a firmer friction fit with the mechanism.

The problem was fixed by inverting the brass tube so that a different part engaged the mechanism.

I would have suggested a very thin coat of thin CA at the measured depth of the mechanism. Allow to dry, and it should make the walls barely thinner - enough to grab the mechanism.
Nice
 
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