Testing this blower motor

[bradleyheathhays]

I have this blower motor that's out of a used pellet stove the previous owner says was going bad. I suspect it's because it was almost completely clogged at the intake, but I wanted to test it out electrically to make sure. The motor housing says 120v, so not know hardly anything about electricity I cut off the female end of an extension cord and proceeded to apply the two ends to the black and red wires at the wiring harness shown in the picture. Motor spun up just fine and I let it run for about 5 seconds, and when I pulled the wires off the motor was slightly smoking.

So I'm wondering...

1 - Since this is a 120v motor why did it smoke?
2 - What part smoked? Plastic inside the motor or solder?
3 - What's the likelihood I just killed this motor?

Thanks.

 

[monophoto]

1 - Since this is a 120v motor why did it smoke?

Presumably something got hot, but we have no idea whether it was a winding (electrical problem) or a bearing (mechanical problem), or residual material in the air flow path from its previous use. In fact, are you sure it was smoke and not dust or steam? What did it smell like?

2 - What part smoked? Plastic inside the motor or solder?

No way of knowing. You were there - you have to tell us.

3 - What's the likelihood I just killed this motor?

No way of knowing.

How old is the motor? Frankly, I would be expect that the starting capacitor would fail before the motor, and I would also expect that a motor would not overheat to the point of failure as long as it can spin freely and as long as the cooling air flow is not restricted. Five seconds is likely not long enough for the winding to overheat to the point of failure - which also suggests that the thing that may be failing is the starting capacitor. But the bottom line is that you haven't provided anywhere near enough information for any one to help you diagnose what is happening.

 

[rixstix]

Why would you you power black/red? It is a 2 speed motor... black white = high or red white = low accoding to the label. Not sure what connecting black red to power did.

 

[Mike]

Why would you you power black/red? It is a 2 speed motor... black white = high or red white = low accoding to the label. Not sure what connecting black red to power did.

Might still be ok, try white to black or red, with white being your neutral from your outlet. If extension cord has ground usually has green for ground, white for neutral and black for 120VAC.

Mike

 

[jttheclockman]

It is right there on the name plate. Common is the white or neutral wire. But that does not tell the whole story. That connector went into its mate and is there a capacitor in line with that neutral wire.?? What you did was wire the 2 windings in series. One coil has more windings than the other to get the 2 speeds. But each coil sets up a magnetic field and when you did what you did it is possible the fields are bucking each other. The stronger one won out but the wires on the other heated. Now if it smoked then it is possible the wire insulation cooked and the wires shorted. Not definite though.

I am not versed on pellet stoves but don't they need to be oiled?? Also isn't there other electronics involved such as thermostats and speed controllers and damper switches. If so many other things could be cause of his problem.

 

[egnald]

There are lots of motor types and winding systems. Since they are common for blower motors and are among the easiest to manufacture, you could have a Two Speed - One Winding motor. It is likely that high speed is powered between Black (Hot) and Neutral (White). Low speed is powered between Red (Hot) and Neutral (White). Usually the tell is that there is a 2 to 1 ratio between the speeds.

Depending on how the motor is wound, connecting 120V across Black and Red likely overpowered the windings / over heating them. Usually the varnish on motor windings produces a light colored (white or light grey) smoke with a somewhat sweet-ish hot-wiring smell. It's kind of hard to explain unless you have experienced it personally.

I don't know if you let too much smoke out or if it will still work. (It's an old electronics joke - I used to tell my freshman students that smoke is what makes all electronic components work, but if you let too much of the smoke out - they will stop working).

Good Luck with your project - Dave

 

[jttheclockman]

As Dave said there are many types of motors in single phase. Not sure if Fasco is still around. They may have been bought out. If there is a schematic on the unit would help telling what you have but if you are planning on using it and want to try it then try each speed. As someone mentioned there is sooooo much info missing here to really help but the one thing for sure I would stay away from wiring anything. You have shown your electric background is not there. Just my opinion.

 

[Mike]

There are lots of motor types and winding systems. Since they are common for blower motors and are among the easiest to manufacture, you could have a Two Speed - One Winding motor. It is likely that high speed is powered between Black (Hot) and Neutral (White). Low speed is powered between Red (Hot) and Neutral (White). Usually the tell is that there is a 2 to 1 ratio between the speeds.

Depending on how the motor is wound, connecting 120V across Black and Red likely overpowered the windings / over heating them. Usually the varnish on motor windings produces a light colored (white or light grey) smoke with a somewhat sweet-ish hot-wiring smell. It's kind of hard to explain unless you have experienced it personally.

I don't know if you let too much smoke out or if it will still work. (It's an old electronics joke - I used to tell my freshman students that smoke is what makes all electronic components work, but if you let too much of the smoke out - they will stop working).

Good Luck with your project - Dave

And if you let the smoke out, you can never put it back in.
I was never an instructor or professor, but I helped train many young guys and a couple young ladies in my career.
And I have smelled that smell, never thought about it but it is a little sweet smelling.
Have seen some unqualified person wire a 100 HP 480 3 phase motor in the oilfield wrong, some smoke and stink, blew the fuses real quick. Electrician came and wired it right and it ran fine. I don't like working around 480.

Mike

 

[bradleyheathhays]

Well sirs, some smoke was definitely let. It was white so hopefully it was just some varnish. Guess we'll soon see.

And thus, my avatar.

 

[Darios]

(It's an old electronics joke - I used to tell my freshman students that smoke is what makes all electronic components work, but if you let too much of the smoke out - they will stop working).

IT joke too. nosmoke.exe One of the most brilliant handoffs and volley backs ever seen... if true.

Field support horror story

groups.google.com

 

[Turner Terry]

I was an industrial electricial for several years. It is possible that you did not hurt the motor for the short period of time you ran it.
Just hook it up again only this time hook your white from the extension cord to the white on the motor and then hook the black from the cord to the red on the motor (which from what I can read on the label is the low speed). Plug it in and let it run for a while. If it doesn't smoke or trip your breaker you are good. Then you can switch the black wire form the cord to the black wire on the motor and test the high speed.

 

[Rob H]

Every electric device is a smoke machine if you operate it wrong enough. Saw that on the interwebs =)

 

[MRDucks2]

Gang, hate that we haven't exactly addressed this yet, but someone needs to:

"…so not know hardly anything about electricity I cut off the female end of an extension cord and proceeded to apply the two ends to the black and red wires at the wiring harness…"

With all due respect, Brad, please ask for help or guidance BEFORE messing with electrical work rather than after in the future. We have a lot of electrical experience on this site alone that could provide you quick guidance.

I could care less if you burn up a sub $100 motor. Trying stuff with electricity when you admittedly know nothing about it will end up getting you or someone you care about hurt or killed at some point in your future.

You are an important part of this community and far too important to your family to put yourself at risk. I appreciate you and your can-do attitude. But, please plan to do things more safely in the future.

 

[jttheclockman]

Gang, hate that we haven't exactly addressed this yet, but someone needs to:

"…so not know hardly anything about electricity I cut off the female end of an extension cord and proceeded to apply the two ends to the black and red wires at the wiring harness…"

With all due respect, Brad, please ask for help or guidance BEFORE messing with electrical work rather than after in the future. We have a lot of electrical experience on this site alone that could provide you quick guidance.

I could care less if you burn up a sub $100 motor. Trying stuff with electricity when you admittedly know nothing about it will end up getting you or someone you care about hurt or killed at some point in your future.

You are an important part of this community and far too important to your family to put yourself at risk. I appreciate you and your can-do attitude. But, please plan to do things more safely in the future.

I sorted of hinted at it in one of my remarks. trying to be friendly about it. But it is so true electricity is nothing to play with. If you are not sure just do not do it. I will take it a step further being you went there. Everyone is telling him where to hook the black and white wire up to but no one addressed to ground that darn thing. If there was slow down problems with the motor it could be going to ground. So many things can go wrong. So hook the green wire from the chord to the motor somewhere. You see there is no green in that connector he shows does not mean that ground is not important. If that motor is shorted to the case that can be a problem especially if motor is not grounded it will not trip breaker. You may just see even more smoke.

 

[bradleyheathhays]

I opened her up and looked around and best I can tell all the connections were still intact so I plugged her up (to the stove) and tried things out. I'm lucky as you know what because it's acting like it should. Another lesson I'm glad to have learned.