Securing a handle

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Chasboy1

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Hi folks, If this topic is in the wrong forum I'd appreciate if the MODS moved it.
My wife likes 'funky' serving pieces and has been asking me to make some with handles of the same material as the pens. I have 3 utensils, (one pictured below) that she gave me to try and adapt.
I plan to cut the rounded tip off the end so I can drill a hole the size of the remaining shaft.
Would CA-heavy be able to hold a handle onto that metal? Should I roughen the surface first?
Are there other, established methods for this type of application?
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Charlie_W

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Epoxy. You don't want the CA to grab before you have the spoon tang fully seated in the handle. Also, the Epoxy has a little more give and isn't as brittle as the CA. Remember, the wood will move with humidity and a kitchen utensil is more prone to being around moisture.
 

monophoto

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In my opinion, this a choice between two-part epoxy and polyurethane glue (eg, Gorilla Glue). Both are messy, but both would hold much better than CA, and both offer enough 'working time' to get the spoon fully embedded in the handle. The difference between them is the additional step of having to mix epoxy, versus dealing with the foam-out if you use polyurethane.

In your case, the shaft of the spoon is a spiral, and that's a very good thing for two reasons. First, it means that when whatever glue you use cures, it will harden into the shape of that spiral. So the shaft will effectively be screwed and glued into the handle, which means that it will not easily come out. You will want to use enough glue to fill the flutes of the spiral, and one of the challenges is that there is no easy way to know how much glue is enough. Using a glue that gives you more working time provides flexibility if you need to add more glue. You will want to get some glue into the hole before inserting the shaft - that glue will be forced deeper into the hole to secure the bond, but there will likely be some excess glue that will be forced back out of the hole around the shaft that you will have to clean up.

The worst case for this kind of situation would be where the shaft is smooth - in that case, inserting the shaft is just like putting a cork in a bottle - it seals the cavity, trapping the air in the hole under that seal. So forcing the shaft into the hole compress the air which means that when you let go, it will try to expand and force the shaft back out of the hole. There are two ways to deal with that problem - one is to use a clamp to secure the spoon in the handle until the glue cures. There usually is no problem having a pocket of compressed air at the bottom of the hole (and over time that air will work its way out through the fibers of the wood in the handle). Another option is to provide a channel for the compressed air to escape. You could use a Dremel to cut a shallow kerf along the length of the shaft, or you could drill a small 'breather hole' in the wooden handle near the bottom of the hole. In either case, expect to have some glue come out of the the channel as you press the shaft into the hole.
 

Chasboy1

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Thanks all. I did realize that the spiral will allow/assist glue to push out when inserting it. I do use Gorilla glue, so with either one there will be post gluing cleanup. Since the handle will be finished (acrylic) at that point, how do I avoid ruining the finished end where the insertion is? I suppose some painter's tape on the shaft, but my greater concern is the handle itself. Perhaps a layer of grease on the tip where the push-out occurs? These implements will be hand washed from now on btw.
 

Chasboy1

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I'm embarking on making the handles for the aforementioned utensils. However, when I turn my shift knobs, I use a bolt with the same threads as the shifter as the drive arbor/center.
In this case, I don't want to lose much of the blank. Do I do a similar procedure? Do I use a live center at the top to keep it steady, and if so, how much of the blank will I lose? Thanks!
 

monophoto

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Thanks all. I did realize that the spiral will allow/assist glue to push out when inserting it. I do use Gorilla glue, so with either one there will be post gluing cleanup. Since the handle will be finished (acrylic) at that point, how do I avoid ruining the finished end where the insertion is? I suppose some painter's tape on the shaft, but my greater concern is the handle itself. Perhaps a layer of grease on the tip where the push-out occurs? These implements will be hand washed from now on btw.
My approach would be to let the finish on the handle to cure thoroughly (wait a couple of days), and then wrap the end tightly with painters tape. Start by laying a strip of tape across the end and an inch or so down the sides, and then apply another layer of tape around the end. Punch a hole in the tape where the spoon shaft will go into the handle.

Next, put a few drops of water into the hole in the tape and into the cavity in the handle and let it soak into the wood. Then, use a toothpick or skewer to push some polyurethane glue into the handle through that hole. Don't go overboard here - just make sure that there is glue inside the hole. Finally, put a few beads of glue on the shaft of the spoon, and then push the shaft through the hole in the tape and into the cavity in the handle. If you use too much glue, you will get more foam squeezout and cleanup will be more difficult. Rotate the spoon as you push it in, and every inch or so, withdraw the shaft and twist to make sure that the glue is fully distributed inside the cavity. Wipe off any squeeze out (it should be on the outside of the tape). At this point, I would clamp the spoon and handle together to prevent the foaming action of the glue from pushing the shaft out of the hole - the clamp doesn't have to be tight because that foaming action doesn't really create a lot of force; it would probably be sufficient to just wrap a length of painters tape over the end of the spoon and down the sides of the handle. Alternatively, you could probably just stick the spoon into a jar and let the downward weight of the handle provide clamping force.

After the glue has cured for an hour or so, use a craft knife to cut away any foamout where the shaft of the spoon penetrates the hole in the tape, and then peel off the tape.
 

monophoto

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I'm embarking on making the handles for the aforementioned utensils. However, when I turn my shift knobs, I use a bolt with the same threads as the shifter as the drive arbor/center.
In this case, I don't want to lose much of the blank. Do I do a similar procedure? Do I use a live center at the top to keep it steady, and if so, how much of the blank will I lose? Thanks!
Don't understand this at all. Are you using a metal lathe with a drive screw or a wood lathe?
 

Chasboy1

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Don't understand this at all. Are you using a metal lathe with a drive screw or a wood lathe?
I'm making acrylic handles and I have a Shopsmith with a Nova Chuck, Drill chuck, live centers, and various drive centers. I make shift knobs for C5 Corvettes. They all use a 9/16-18 thread. When I make them I drill a hole and thread it, then mount it on a 9/16 threaded rod. I usually have extra at the top to allow for a live center to keep it steady thru the roughing/shaping phase.
 

monophoto

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I'm making acrylic handles and I have a Shopsmith with a Nova Chuck, Drill chuck, live centers, and various drive centers. I make shift knobs for C5 Corvettes. They all use a 9/16-18 thread. When I make them I drill a hole and thread it, then mount it on a 9/16 threaded rod. I usually have extra at the top to allow for a live center to keep it steady thru the roughing/shaping phase.
Ah Ha - now I understand the question.

The typical livecenter will penetrate into the end of the blank, causing some waste that must be removed to eliminate the hole caused by the livecenter, and the further into the blank the livecenter penetrates, the greater the amount of waste that must be sacrificed. There are a number of variables that determine how deep that penetration will be - the hardness of the material you are turning is one very obvious consideration, but a subtle factor is how ornate you are making the handle. The longer you work the piece, the further into the end the tailstock is likely to penetrate, and therefore the more waste you will need to remove. My experience with a number of different kind of spindle turnings ranging from tool handles to cane and walking sticks to closed-end pens is that you should expect to have to remove at least 1/8", and perhaps as much as 1/4" of waste. Its usually easier to get a clean end on the turning if you have more waste because you don't have to be quite as fussy about how the waste is removed, but the end of the process inevitably involves sanding the end to get it smooth.

But if you are trying to minimize the amount of waste, you might want to consider using a livecenter that doesn't leave a penetration in the workpiece. There are many options for live centers ranging from cups that might leave only a slightly burnished circle on the end of the turning, to shop-made 'soft touch' centers that mark the workpiece even less. You can make these from wood, and if you are fussy, you can embed a chunk of HDPE in the face of the live center to further reduce the tendency to mark the workpiece.
 

Chasboy1

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Thanks! Just noticed this response. I made all 3 pieces and ended up with about 1/4" waste. I used my 'old' method from metal shop by rounding and removing the waste area as much as possible, then chucking it into the jaws as far as I could with pads, then cleaned up the end as you described. Here's the final product:
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