Pen Blank glue-up definitions

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skiprat

skiprat

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Hi all, there often seems to be some confusing definitions with regards to glue ups. Do you think these are reasonably accurate discriptions? If you can think of better ones or new ones please add them. But no fights please[}:)]

1. Inlay Marquetry, thin flat layers of material set parallel into the surface to form a pattern or design. Often done by hand with a blade.

2. Infill Material used to fill a deliberate or natural void. Often done in a hard setting liquid or paste form.

3.Segmentation A joint made by the connection of more than two pieces.

4. Lamination A joint made by two pieces. Often thin parallel layers, layers could be mutiple.

5. Glue-up Generic term for all of the above or any combination of them.
 
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I agree with all but glue up. In fact, I would say Glue Up would have a definition that does not include inlay or infill. It would include segmentation, and would barely cover lamination. Glue -p more describes segmentation in pens, or assembly in flatwork.

IMHO
 
If I were doing it I would define Lamination and Segmentation slightly differently.

Lamination is the gluing of multiple parallel pieces of wood to form a new piece that is the same width/length as the original "layers" but taller. For example a piece of plywood is created by lamination.

Segmentation is the gluing of multiple non-parallel pieces of wood to form a new piece that is the same width and height but longer. This is used for decorative purposes. RonMc has a great example of a segmented pen here: http://www.penturners.org/oldalbums/Ron%20Mc/curlysideclosed.jpg

I agree with Mikey on Glue-up.

GK
 
Ok, I reckon I agree with Mikey and Greg on the glue up.

Greg, what would you call a blank made from only two layers?[8D]
I think in essence that if there is only one piece of material on either side of the glue line then it would be a lamination.[?]
There could be lots of layers though, but not necessarily so.

I can't remember who did it but there was recently a cool 'brick' pattern pen done, I would call that a classic example of a segmented pen. The sides of each piece may or may not be parallel as long as more than two bit share a glue line?

Strangely, the example you showed of Ron's pen, I would have called a lamination, because each piece is glued to only one more piece[:D]

Can anyone think of any more definitions for various glue ups?
 
From my perspective all the techniques mentioned (infill, inlay, laminate, and segment) require a glue-up. How else to do 'em? Hence, glue-up is a generic term subsumed by the rest. [:D]

A segmentation may be parallel, as in a bowl with horizontal segmented rings where ring1 is parallel to contasting wood ring2 which is parallel to contrasting wood ring3 ad nauseum.

A lamination, in my mind, is typical two or more pieces of different or similar material glued together along their longest axis such that the finished component is of one size in that axis. For instance, in Eagle's spiral inlay blank, the individual components that are inlaid are the laminates.

I think Ron's pen is segmented because the glue-up is end-grain to end-grain where as a lamination is face-grain to face-grain (typically). Also, if lamination is along the longest axis, Ron's doesn't fit that criterion.

I'm sure there's more. How about piercings? [:D]

Gary
 
Originally posted by alamocdc
<br />
Originally posted by GaryMGg
<br />I'm sure there's more. How about piercings? [:D]

Gary
Click to expand...

No thanks... tattooes are good enough for me.[}:)][:p]
Click to expand...

Yeah but I've been thinkin' I want to do New Yankee Workshop pen.
"Just shoot a couple'a quick brads here til the glue dries and then...." [:0]
 
Hey you two.... get back on topic.....or else[:D]

Heres a pic of two of my own. I didn't want to post someone elses better example without permission. Please post examples and what you call them. I don't have any inlays or infills. They're old pens so please don't comment except on their definitions
I call this a lamination



2007524192916_laminated.jpg
<br />

This one I'd call segmented




2007524192754_segment.jpg
<br />

Gee.. what a job getting those pics in[:I]
 
Steve, can't see your pics yet but I'm sure you'll get it edited.

Here's my inlay:
GoldTNBaronYinYang2.jpg


The inlaid component is a glue-up comprised of maple and ebony.
Technically, I don't know if the Yin Ying itself is a lamination or segmentation;
It's probably best describes as marquetry than the others.

Here's my simple segmentation of sapelle and maple:
slimseg3.jpg


I don't have any infills, but I don't there's much doubt as to what that is.

Gary
 
"What would you call a blank of only two layers?" Well, that depends. Lets add this to my definitions: A lamination has all the glue lines going parallel to each other. A Segmentation has the glue lines going non-parallel.

So, kinda extrapolating, to be if the single glue line runs parallel or perpendicular to the tube I would call it a lamination. But if it runs at an angle I would call it a segment. Now, I admit, this is based purely on the warp in my mind that makes me think that having one "straight" line would lead to further straight lines but that angled lines doesn't...

So, if it was like a piece of plywood with all the glue lines parallel, is a lamination whether it is 2 plies or 2000 plies. If any of the glue lines are non-parallel it is a segmentation.

Interestingly Dictionary.com has a lamination is "bonding thin sheets together" and something that is laminated is "Composed of layers bonded together". And Segmented is "Divided into or made up of distinct segments". So, lamination is a subset of segmented where the segments are "thin sheets".

Looking at GaryG's example throws off my definitions a bit. All the glue lines are parallel so by my definition above I would say it is a lamination. But I agree with him that it is a segmentation. So does a lamination need to be a parallel glue up of *thin* or nearly-equal thickness layers? So a segmentation is the glue up of non-thin/not-equal pieces?

Looking at Skiprat's examples, I think they are both segmented.
GK
 
Originally posted by gketell
[br
So, if it was like a piece of plywood with all the glue lines parallel, is a lamination whether it is 2 plies or 2000 plies. If any of the glue lines are non-parallel it is a segmentation.

Looking at Skiprat's examples, I think they are both segmented.
GK
Click to expand...

Greg, all the glue lines are parallel in the top one. They are curved, but still parallel.[:D] Now you're confusing me[:D][:D]
 
I think when you laminate it's face grain to face grain, even if the layers have grain running on opposing directions. In plywood, each layer of the laminate is typically 90-degrees to it's neighbor which is why there are an odd number of layers. In pen making we don't do that as our laminations are so small and we're not doing it to reduce wood movement and increase stability as in plywood.

It is possible that segmentation subsumes lamination; that is, a lamination may be a segmentation but a segmentation is not a lamination.
Where's Lou?, he's good at this stuff. [:D]
 
Here's my take

1.<b> Inlay</b> thin material cut and glued to fit in a substrate. Set flat to the surface. Forms a pattern or design. Can be done by hand or power tools.

2. <b>Fill</b> Material used to fill a natural or man-made void. Glue is is used as a base and mixed with anything you can imagine.

3.<b>Segmentation</b> Think puzzle.

4. <b>Lamination</b> Two or more flat pieces glued together. A lamination can be cut into any of the above.

5. <b>Glue-up</b> All of the above.
 
Hmmmmmmmm

In geometrical terms objects that are parallel are also straight.
"3. Geometry.
a. (of straight lines) lying in the same plane but never meeting no matter how far extended.
b. (of planes) having common perpendiculars.
c. (of a single line, plane, etc.) equidistant from another or others (usually fol. by to or with)."

Your top one would be described as a segment (geometrical definition: "as a part of a circular area contained by an arc and its chord") with a curved line equidistant to the segment at all points".

In non-geometrical terms you could take: "having the same direction, course, nature, or tendency; corresponding; similar; analogous": to match with your pen but the example associated with that definition from dictionary.com is "Canada and the U.S. have many parallel economic interests".

hmmmmmm
This is making my head hurt!!

But I still think the top one was segmented just based on gut feeling. [:p]

GK

[:D]
 
Ron's definitions work pretty well. "Two or more FLAT pieces glued together" is simple and concise and does the job. Both RonMc's pen and Skiprat's pens are segmentations based on that definition.

How would that work for something like the:
laminated%20design%201.jpg
where it is a series of laminations cut and glued together as more laminations. Is this still a lamination or a segmented pen? My "gut" says segmented but does the definition? You could have a flat piece that was formed by lamination and cut.

hmmmm
GK
 
Greg, my head hurts too now, thanks.[}:)]
If parallel lines have to be straight then what about Cancer, Capricon and the Equator? Or is the earth still flat too?[:D][:D]

Have fun. It's almost midnight and I'm going to bed.[xx(]
 
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