New woodworker - need input on tools etc.

[Xander]

Hi. New member here. Apologies for repeating questions you must get asked all the time.

OK, so I have decided to start woodworking, and pen making in particular. At this time I have NO equipment but plan to have the basics within a week or 2. Before I spend all my hard earned (disability) money I wanted to get some advice from you guys and gals.

1) The lathe I'm seriously considering is the PSI Turncrafter Commander 10" Var. speed. Questions... Is it as good (or bad) as some of the reviews I've read? Is there anything better for the same money? Jet and Delta are just too much for me. Other options are Turncrafter multi speed and the Excelsior from Rockler.

2) Is variable speed worth the extra money? I mean, you still have to change pulleys to get from "high speed" to "low speed" for finishing so why have the var. speed?

3) I'm going to need a bench drill press unless I do all drilling on the lathe. Is a drill press really needed? I've look at a few but they all seem to have too short spindle throw ... like 2-1/2". Is that enough considering I will be doing pens with 1 and 2 barrels. Is drilling with the lathe as accurate? How inconvenient is it to do it that way?

More to come.

Thanks.

 

[eupher58]

PSI gets a lot of bad rap for its customer service. Some deserved. My experience has been more positive than negative. Yes their shipping can be painfully slow at times. I went with the 10 in variable speed, and I must have got the good one. No problems, perfect alignment and sturdy. Only problem i had was the nut backed out of the live center. One call and they sent me a new one, had it in 4 days, under warranty. The benefit of the PSI outfit was getting a complete setup. This was my first lathe and turning experience, and a did some homework first, tried to find everything needed from different sources, and for a complete starter kit, that was the best deal I could find at the time. Still no regrets. Variable speed is a must. Next lathe will be bigger and better, but for a startup set, that more than filled the bill.

 

[Displaced Canadian]

Don't know about the Turncrafter, I have the Excelsior from Rockler. Bought it about 4 years ago and haven't had any real issues with it. It's good for pens, a little underpowered for anything else. As for variable speed, I wouldn't mind having it but I don't change speeds much. I turn, sand, and finish at the same speed. I do slow down to drill. I drill on my lathe because I don't have the space for a drill press. Drilling on a lathe is a slow process and most tailstocks don't have enough travel to make it all the way through in one shot. The live center on the Rockler lathe won't last that long, Do yourself a favor and but a 60 degree live center when you buy the lathe.
You will also need a way to sharpen your tools. You could buy a Woodchuck carbide tool they last a while and no need to sharpen.
Hope this helps. If you have any other any questions don't be afraid to ask.

 

[D.Oliver]

Ed, Here are my thoughts

1.) The Turncrafter Commander is a decent lathe. It's a middle of the pack lathe. There are better lathes, but there are worse ones too. You may want to look at the Rikon lathes. They have one that is right around 300 dollars that a lot of people seem to like and Rikon has very good customer service. Just an option.

2.) I personally like the variable speed. You will usually pay about $100 more though for a lathe with VS than one without. If dollars are tight I would go with a better lathe without VS than a mediocre lathe with VS. Its easier to add VS to a lathe down the road than to remedy quality problems (casting defects, misalignment, ect).

3. You can drill on a lathe and it is much more accurate than a drill press. I started with a drill press and now do most of my drilling on the lathe. It takes slightly longer than the drill press, but not much. The parts you need to drill on a lathe will run somewhere in the neighborhood of $100 if bought brand new. You will need a drill chuck to hold the drill bit and some type of chuck to hold the blank. You can get a self centering 4 jaw chuck starting around $120 or a collet chuck starting around $90. There are a lot of good threads on the subject. When you have the time, use the search function and go through a few. There is also a good article in the Library about collet chuck usage. Its worth a read.

 

[Xander]

Thanks all.

As for tools, looking at the 3 piece carbide tipped set for $47, free shipping, from ...PSI. I can get away with a lathe in my apartment (hardwood floor in the dining room) but no way I can use a grinder. Hand sharpening is an option but I'm lazy.

My shopping list is looong and way too many $$$ but got to get a good set of tools and supplies right from the start.

Sounds like I'm going with the turncrafter if I can wait until new stocks arrive. Hmmm, mid march.....:frown:

This will be my only lathe and I do want to turn a few bowls and other stuff so if the Excelsior is 'underpowered' ... the extra 1/4 hp of the turncrafter might just seal the deal. I'm thinking in this price range (cheap) pretty much all lathes have pros and cons.

 

[corian king]

Hello and Welcome from Va.
I have a friend that has that lathe and has had it for about 5yrs.He loves it and has never had any problems.I know money is tight as it is for alot of us.But if you plan on doing some of the harder materials I would reccomend talking to member
Wood-of-1-kind and getting yourself a carbide tool right off.That way you don't have to invest in all the other tools and a grinder to keep your tools sharp.Just my 2cent worth.Good Luck! Happy turning!

 

[ctubbs]

Ed, when I started, I bought the starter set of pen tools from PSI. They do make a very nice wall hanging but are not used for anything else. Regular tools will do anything the smaller "pen" tools will do and better, in my humble opinion. Even better, contact Ken "bitshird" Farrell here http://leapwood-precisioncrafts.com about his WoodChuck carbide tool. They do not require sharpening and do a very good job. Very rarely do I go to any other tool now that I have that one.
I very much prefer a drill press to drilling on the lathe. The biggest caveat there I have found is you must go for a quality DP. Most of the low price versions have alignment problems or a too short quill travel.
I found an old 70 year old lathe from a school shop and rebuilt it with a VS drive. 12" throw with 46" bed. Monster but solid as a rock. Shop around and possibly save a bit of cash. BEst of luck and make some shavings. post photos and ask questions.
Charles

 

[OOPS]

Well, you asked a lot of questions, but some good ones. I was faced with a similar limitation of funds when I started. After months of agonizing, I ended up buying the Harbor Freight lathe with the VS, for about $120. Many will disparage HF products, but my lathe has been problem free so far, more than a year. I would not buy ANY lathe without VS, as its so much faster to change the speed with a knob rather than move pulleys. Think of it this way...would you even think of buying a new TV without a remote? After changing the channel about 30 times, you'd be sick of it. The same with the pulley on a lathe. I bought the HF because I needed other things too, and the money I saved on the lathe allow me to get them. This lathe is probably not robust enough to do bowls, but if you decide you really like turning, you are going to end up buying a bigger lathe anyway. Many with big lathes end up buying little ones to do pens, so I will always have a need for my little HF. I passed on the Turncrafter because of the cost and the vastly different experiences reported with the lathe.

I use a bench top drill press of good quality. When my brother started turning, he bought an inexpensive drill press for about $99. Many of my friends now "drill" on the lathe now, and say its more accurate, albeit slower. I have not used my lathe for drilling, but have watched my friends. Based upon this, here is my opinion. If you are going to make smaller pens, (slimlines, or others using a 7 mm bit) then a drill press is fine, and a cheap press is no problem. Even the Wall St. 2 pens (Sierra or Mesa) is not a problem. If you want to do mostly acrylic pens, a drill press again would be fine AS LONG AS YOU'RE PATIENT ENOUGH so that you don't have a hot bit melting the blank while drilling. The real problem comes with drilling hardwoods, and particularly so when you start drilling larger holes in the blanks. If you want larger pens, or rollerballs/fountain pens with caps, the hole you drill in the cap portion of the blank is quite large, and a small "oops" will take you right out the side of the blank. Caution and patience is paramount when drilling these, as these woods sometimes just don't want to be drilled! This causes "chatter" and lighter drill presses can actually flex from the resistance. The lathe actually does a better job of holding everything in a manner that won't allow for blank movement, therefore, you end up with a perfectly centered hole.

I have drilled all my blanks on a drill press so far, but have purchased some of the parts needed to drill on a lathe. When I have purchased all of them, I will still drill on the drill press, but the drilling of large holes will all be done on the lathe.

To save money when starting, I learned to hand-sharpen my lathe tools. A year later, I am still hand-sharpening and have no plans to change. I find that its sometimes nice to sit down for a few minutes, sort of a "half time" during turning, and sharpen the tools. I learned from people at Woodcraft and its really not that difficult. Plus, now that I have learned a few things about sharpening, I sharpen my pocket knives, steak knives, and the like, and find it enjoyable.

 

[Daniel]

I also own a HF lathe. Ofter years of using a belt type VS lathe this one is a dream. So far it is the best wood lathe I have owned and I am not sorry I got it. I am anythign but a newbie at penturning so I knwo quite a bit about what I would like in a lathe. I woudl tweak a few things abotu this one but otherwise it is solid reliable for drilling on. has a dead stock spindle that will readily accepts all my accessories. and runs very smooth. I plant o turn pepper mills on it as well as pens but that will be the worst I put it through. So I am not looking for a monster tough lathe. I suspect that if I where doign turnign that put the quality of the materials to there test the story might change in a hurry.Otherwise very nice lathe for the money.

I also have the small pen turning carbide tipped tool set. I use them once in a very great while. But my go to tool is the Rotondo or Skooger. Basically the same type of tool recommended above under the name of the woodchuck. One has a square insert the other a round one. Not the typical turning tool but they work wonderfully.

You can put money into the chucks to drill on the lathe (accurate) or a drill press (do your homework if it is bench top) a drill press can be every bit as accurate as the lathe just not as easily or as realiably. Drilling on the lathe requires more time but is going to be accurate more often than not. I drilled bullet tip after bullet tip a few years ago. this required that a not necessarily very perfect bullet get drilled very nearly perfectly dead center nearly 100 times. The lathe did not miss it's mark enough times for me to keep count. and even then it was a problem with the bullet being out of shape and not the lathe. Now keep in mind that was a metal lathe that has a whole different scale when it comes to being accurate. Still the lathe is reliable but slow. drill press less reliable as to accuracy but faster. For me it is the drill press for the most part but when I need that hole exactly where I want it. I go to the lathe.

 

[Xander]

Thanks for the input. All suggestions are helpful

The Woodchuck looks nice but as I have a lot of other stuff I NEED to get started I can't justify (or afford) $100+ for a single tool. The 'package' offered with the lathe ... if I get the package... contains a set of 3 chisels but they are very poor quality, not even HSS. I can't put money into a grinder/sharpening station and even if I could I can't use it in my dining room (now woodshop). My thinking is that for under $50 I can get 3 carbide tipped chisels that shouldn't need sharping for some time and I can use until my skills improve to the point that I need something better. (or I dicide this is not the hobby for me).

I have found a bench drill press that sounds OK for around $200. I might get one in a month or so as it will be usefull for other things besides pens. The package I'm getting with the lathe comes with pre-drilled blanks so I'm good to start, no need to drill, yet.

So many questions, things to research, ... stay tuned for more.

....... now, the HF lathe has how many speeds?
....... what was the slowest speed on the shop fox?
....... was the grissly a #1 or #2 MT ? :wink:

aarrrrgggggg. I'm going to bed. Night all.

 

[PTsideshow]

I am also a new pen turner, I have the 5 speed HF bench top lathe. And find it to do what I ask. On sale and with the 20% coupon it is a deal.
A word on the the import lathes. THEY all are made, by the same factory in China!. some of the better known brands have more and different accessories also the finishing process is a little better. That is the reason they pretty much look the same.
The thing with the HF stuff is, you can take it back if you don't like it for any reason. When you get any lathe do the center to center test, to see if they line up.

If you have issues with Harbor Freight then you can get a lathe someplace else. I too have a woodchuck pen pro from Ken and love it.

If you choose to get a starter set of tools, get the higher priced set from HF as they are the same sets other sell at a higher price.

I will also second the replacement centers to start, both the drive(live center) and the tailstock center I have a ball bearing rotating tailstock center.

Before you buy anything since you are just starting out I would suggest you buy this book The Pen Turner's Bible: The Art of Creating Custom Pens by Richard Kleinhenz a member here. This can be your best first tool starting out. You can get it from woodcraft, Amazon B&N etc. Worth twice the cost!

Then after reading it and taking in all the photo's you will have a better idea of what it is you will need.

On a drill press make sure that the table has a crank height adjustment, as holding a drill press table even a bench top can be a pain for us olde farts! They are even heavier with the vise you use to hold the blanks for drilling.

I also have drill chucks for the lathe, but since I'm still at the making chips and dust stage. Figuring out what I doing, I haven't drilled much more then center drilling as of yet turning between centers. wood,resins and Corian materials. So I will leave that part to others.


Since you are in an apartment, I would suggest you go slow and pick you tools wisely, as you will need a good shop vac for dust control and clean up! I have a Ridgid with their accesory sound muffler and it does seem to help. Wife is over my lathe location, on the first floor at her computer desk.
:clown:

 

[widows son]

I would check your local wood turning clubs or pen turners group before buying a lathe. you might get lucky and find a used Jet mini lathe or something similar from one of the members and save enough to buy something else you need. Better yet, you might get to to try a couple of lathes and get some lessons. Last but not least if you plan on doing larger projects, a mini lathe usually doesn't have the power or capacity. It's easy to to turn something smaller on a big lathe, not so easy to turn some big on a small lathe.

I have a set of "Pen Turning" tools that someone gave me and I haven't found a use for them yet. Another reason not to buy a starter set.