Kitless tap and dies

[SWEPEN]

Hi all custom pen turners.

I have a question that needs answers.
I'm about to begin making custom pens and I was thinking about starting with size 6 nibs
And I've decided to go with the m14×0.8 triple start thread for the cap and m10×1 for the section. The question is if this is a good size to start with for a beginner on custom pen making .
And will those dimensions on nib, section, body and cap go well together (taps and dies for those parts) or should I think over the sizes on taps and dies and go for something else.

Have a great one everyone.

 

[RobS]

I would highly recommend m10x.75 for the section.
It would give you a thicker wall to accommodate the converter. As a beginner you will want the more robust wall thickness.

Yes m14, with a #6 works great.

 

[Valleyboy]

I would go for 10x0.75 too. You'll be fine with 10x1 for the 14mm cap threads but if you start making smaller diameter (13 or in particular 12) you'll start getting a bit thin between the minor diameters for the section and cap. So my advice is spend the money once and get the 10x0.75.

Cheers
Ash

 

[Pierre---]

will those dimensions on nib, section, body and cap go well together?

Who can answer this question? Yourself only. Draw them on a sheet of paper (or turn them using some scrap), and you will see if you like them. Many dimensions can work. But for them to go "well" depends of your own taste only.

 

[duncsuss]

I've found M9 x 0.75 works best for me, whether the cap/barrel threads are M14, M13 or M12.

1.0mm pitch feels too coarse (to me) and as Rob and Ash point out, it thins the barrel walls.

I've tried 0.5mm pitch - and that's more elegant, but requires a higher precision when you make the tenon and drill the hole.

0.75mm pitch is a good balance that preserves wall thickness and doesn't require perfect dimensions.

So - I use M9 x 0.75 for section/barrel threads and also for the finial that holds the clip to the cap.

 

[darrin1200]

10x1 will work fine with #6. Your choice of 0.75 or 1.0 won't have any effect or issues with the cap threads, because the major diameter is the same for both; 10mm.
However, the minor diameter on the section thread is smaller with the 1.0. It is .25mm deeper than the .75. This will make the wall of the section thread thinner, which in turn can make it more fragile. It will depend on the resilience of your material.
I know many makers that use the 10x1.0 because it is more readily available.
It is a great place to start.

 

[Valleyboy]

10x1 will work fine with #6. Your choice of 0.75 or 1.0 won't have any effect or issues with the cap threads, because the major diameter is the same for both; 10mm.
However, the minor diameter on the section thread is smaller with the 1.0. It is .25mm deeper than the .75. This will make the wall of the section thread thinner, which in turn can make it more fragile. It will depend on the resilience of your material.
I know many makers that use the 10x1.0 because it is more readily available.
It is a great place to

You are correct. My bad!
I use .75 to preserve the wall thickness of the section threads, not the cap threads.

 

[Chriscb]

The barrel - cap thread is all about your design. Do you want a step between cap and barrel, how thick do you want the cap and barrel? Good place to start is to make measurements of your collection of pens. From that you can derive an average value of length of cap and visible barrel together with the respective diameters. Working backwards will help you to get a picture of your pen. Alternatively have a look at the article by Phil in the library - A Beaufort Ink Introduction to Custom Pen Making (August 2020) - which is an excellent introduction.
Either way you have to be aware that you are diving deep into a rabbit hole which will distort your perception of time and drain your wallet. But hey... so what!
Chriscb

 

[SWEPEN]

Thanks all of you for helping me out . I will listen and learn and I will go with the m10×0.75 tap and die . I was going to buy the mandrels from beaufort ink and they only have the m10×1 mandrel for the barrel and section but I can probably make them myself from aluminum or delrin. I will post a picture of my first bespoke pen in this thread when it's done. Once again thanks .

 

[PatrickR]

Thanks all of you for helping me out . I will listen and learn and I will go with the m10×0.75 tap and die . I was going to buy the mandrels from beaufort ink and they only have the m10×1 mandrel for the barrel and section but I can probably make them myself from aluminum or delrin. I will post a picture of my first bespoke pen in this thread when it's done. Once again thanks .

Don't use delrin for a mandrel, it would be far too flexible. aluminum would barely be stiff enough. Brass or steel would be a far better choice.
fwiw I have made several with 12mm cap threads and 10x1 section threads. So far so good.

 

[Niels]

I have the same issue with the mandrels from beaufort but i can't make mandrels myself. Not in metal in any case. But i was wondering. Does the combination triplestrat M13x0,8 and section thread 9x0,75 go well together? Cause that would solve the problem of the thickness of the barrel.
To me it seems like the most simple solution to the problem or are there other considerations why people choose the 10X1 die

 

[RobS]

I prefer the m10x.75 on a M13 or M14

It provides a solid wall thickness in the section between the threads and the converter. I highly recommend it for new makers.

People will argue for the M10x1. As a Mechanical engineer I prefer the extra meat that the M10x.75 adds. Also the .75 is not too course nor is it too fine.

 

[darrin1200]

I will second what @PatrickR says above. Do not use delving for turning mandrels, there is way to much flex for accuracy. I have been using aluminum for a few years now. But I have realized that they have tended to bend from repeated use, to where they dont turn true. I am in the process of making new mandrels in brass. Keep in mind, that you will make more and more mandrels you will make. For mandrels that I will only need once or twice, I will still make from aluminum. It about 1/3 the price of brass.

All that said I will use Delrin, or some other plastic to make buffing mandrels. Basically, a handle to hold the piece when I am working on the Buffing Wheel.

 

[wtturner]

Where do you find a 10x.75 tap and die set?

 

[RobS]

Most places currently sold out. Except here:

Search Results

drillsandcutters.com

 

[wimkluck]

In the Netherlands the are also out of stock. I just looked for Volkel. Here only available as a set of 2. Prices are 15.49 euro included the 21% Vat.
shipping cost to the usa ????? A die 10x0.75 is about 17.50 euro's including VAT. ( is in stock)

 

[JamesC]

Hi all custom pen turners.

I have a question that needs answers.
I'm about to begin making custom pens and I was thinking about starting with size 6 nibs
And I've decided to go with the m14×0.8 triple start thread for the cap and m10×1 for the section. The question is if this is a good size to start with for a beginner on custom pen making .
And will those dimensions on nib, section, body and cap go well together (taps and dies for those parts) or should I think over the sizes on taps and dies and go for something else.

Have a great one everyone.

Like others have said, .075 You will save a lot of time and material on sections and Barrels. Just starting out myself and this is one of the changes that really made a difference. I have made a lot of mistakes, and continue to learn from the members of this forum.. Always get great advice..
Jim

 

[PatrickR]

I don't think its been brought up and I haven't done the math but making the barrel wall thicker would in turn make the section wall thinner. I use 9x.75 with #5 nibs and 10x1 on #6.

 

[jalbert]

1mm triple for caps, .5mm for everything else threaded, is my go-to.

 

[PatrickR]

1mm triple for caps, .5mm for everything else threaded, is my go-to.

Was it you that was making them with a course square thread similar to an acme thread?

 

[jalbert]

No, all 60 degree

 

[PatrickR]

No, all 60 degree

Thanks. I'll have to look at some pics.

 

[jalbert]

Sorry I misread. I was doing block threads at one point, but haven't for a while.

 

[PatrickR]

Sorry I misread. I was doing block threads at one point, but haven't for a while.

Did you stop because of form or function?

 

[jalbert]

Mostly annoying to try and polish between the threads, and the novelty wore off.

 

[kjturley]

Mostly annoying to try and polish between the threads, and the novelty wore off.

Howdy, I had a customer ask if I could do block threads so I was searching around and found your comments. Were you using a tap and die to do them or cutting them on a metal lathe?

 

[jalbert]

Metal lathe