Internal kitless pen section threading

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Jans husband

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May 4, 2020
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Whilst browsing previous threads about the difficulties in forming the internal threads for a kitless pen section (Bock no 5 nib housing), I see that many Members have experienced problems in getting the threads on the housing to engage with the internal female thread. That is probably why Beaufort inks sent me 3 spare housings to "practice on" !!.

Please forgive if this is a silly question, but is it acceptable to glue the housing into the section, and bypass the need for threading? I can't envisage any occasion when I have heard of anyone having to remove a housing on a Kitless or commercially made pen, (although I appreciate that a nib change may be occasionally required). Surely the section is in there for the life of the pen. I have a couple of Waterman pens, and the section is an integral part of the pen and can't be removed, but I must admit I have not tried to do so after a big breakfast!!

So- Am I missing something apart from the obvious pleasure in turning the internal thread and being able to screw the housing into it--and also could that operation be capable of being repeated on a number of occasions, given that the housing thread is made of delicate plastic material?

What do the many experts out there have to contribute?

Thanks

\Mike
 
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PenHog

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Hi Mike,

(caveat: not an expert) There are pen makers that do this; I own a couple pens where the housing is glued in. One is a Wing Sung, which is relatively cheap (but I really like it), and the other is a Molteni, which is not so cheap. So, it's done, and I can't think of a really convincing reason not to, but here's a few comments:

(1) For my own pens, when I change inks, taking out the whole triple (housing, feed, nib) for rinsing makes life easier in terms of avoiding left-over ink mixing with the new. Arguably, you might still get the same results with a glued-in housing by removing the feed/nib, and then just rinsing the bottom of the section.

(2) I don't like using glue unless I must, but that's purely a personal choice/hangup, I guess. Perhaps if the material were translucent or clear, you might prefer a few visible threads to a possible smear pattern with glue...

(3) An even weaker reason might be wear and tear on the housing. If you ever crack it, you'll need to drill it out. But this isn't so difficult, and it's probably unlikely that you'd crack the housing on a new Bock triplet any time soon. Personally, I've found some slight variation in Bock nibs; for example, a titanium will be a bit tighter on the fit than a steel nib. I suppose you could argue that, with enough time, the housing might become loose, especially if trading between nibs of slightly different thickness. But I'm not sure that's much of a concern.

I'm also interested to hear what others have to say about this.
 

eharri446

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Mar 17, 2016
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Another thing to be aware of is the Bock #5 uses a different size drill bit than you would think based on the size of the threads. When I first calculated it, I got 7.4mm for the drill bit size. Beaufort Ink says to use a 7.5mm drill bit because the end of the section has a small bump which will not go into a 7.4mm hole.
 

Jans husband

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May 4, 2020
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Thanks for those helpful comments and advice.

I have a copy of the Bock 5 and 6 drawings, and also the advice from Beaufort Inks about the drill sizes, which are next to the lathe as I work.

May it also be the sequence in which you proceed, by that I mean, in what order you drill, tap, die shape etc, and also possibly the way in which the section is secured as you work and turn it round in the chuck/collet to ensure that it is completely centred again?
 
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It's been a while since I made a fountain pen. The threads are very fine and almost feel like they aren't there. I know some use a drop of varnish or similar substance to keep it all in place but if necessary can be broken loose. I try make them as tight as possible so it's practically a friction fit.
 

Phil Dart

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Jul 26, 2015
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Can I help maybe?

Firstly, there seems to be a bit of confusion here - we advise that you use a 6mm drill for the thread of a Bock size 5. Major minus Pitch actually works out at 5.8, but because of the design at the bottom end of the housing, you need 6mm for clearance. We DO NOT recommend using 7.5 for a size 6, but having said that, you'd probably get away with it even though there's no need to go above Major minus Pitch, which for a size 6 equates to 7.3mm

We send a few spare housings with taps to practice with purely as a courtesy, not because there's anything especially tricky about threading for a size 5 housing. You haven't said, Jan's Husband, if your problem is that the housing slops about inside your threaded Section or if the whole thing is too tight. I'm guessing that, since you're considering gluing in the housing, that it slops about too much.

My strong advice would be to NOT glue in the housing, but to get to the bottom of the problem. In the first instance you could try just drilling a 6mm hole into a piece of scrap, then threading it, to see how the housing screws in. Too tight, too loose or just right. I doubt it will be too tight, but too loose or just right will give you some clues as to the next step to take in order to solve the problem.

If you want to try that, (if you haven't already done so), I'm more that happy to help you here to get to the root of the cause, but we need to take one step at a time to find out where the problem is.
 

More4dan

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Mar 17, 2016
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Katy, TX
I would prefer to have a threaded section for holding the nib housing, especially when using a JOWO #5. Yesterday I had a request for one of my pens but they wanted a rollerball instead of a FP. I had made the front section so it would work for both the JOWO and a Schmidt FRS rollerball nib. Unscrewed the FP housing and replaced it easily with the rollerball one.

The advantage I see with glue or varnish to hold the housing would be if one were only making a one off and didn’t want to invest in the specialty sized taps. I’ve had some kit pens that had glued in housings, presumably to save manufactoring cost.

Danny


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