These two kits appear identical from the catalogs except that the body drill sizes are different by 1/64. I've only made the Hut Titan. Anyone made both? Are they the same?
Hut Titan vs. Berea El Grande
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Daniel
Member
I haven't made either of them, but Hut and Berea being the same violates my rule of thumb. that is Hut, P.S.I. and CSUSA. are the same while berea is it's own breed. and this doesn't hold true always for CSUSA. some of their kits are very different from P.S.I. and Hut. but as a rule their slimlines will be like P.S.I. slimlines etc. but you won't find the Gent's pen in a P.S.I. catalog.
Also the mandrels for Berea are not the same size as the other suppliers. they are thicker.
Hope that helps.
Daniel
Also the mandrels for Berea are not the same size as the other suppliers. they are thicker.
Hope that helps.
Daniel
Hmmm, a mystery. I was at Berea the other day (I work 5 min from them) and they did say that they supply mandrels to Hut. Also, the Hut and Berea Cigar pens are identical as far as I can tell. I think I will buy some of the Berea El Grande kits and report back.
HUT is a reseller for Berea kits. The pens are identical and the parts are interchangeable. Only the packaging, label, instructions, and sometimes the price will be different.
If you need the instructions, buy the kit from HUT because their instructions are better (my opinion). Otherwise go for the lower price.
Both Berea and HUT recommend a 31/64" drill for the main body. Berea recommends a 33/64" for the cap tube, while HUT recommends a larger 17/32" The cap tube can be a tight fit in the smaller hole, and may even require sanding inside the hole if there is any fuzz from drilling. For that reason, HUT is recommending the larger drill for the cap to make it easier to glue in the tube. However, there is the increased risk of turning through the wood
If you need the instructions, buy the kit from HUT because their instructions are better (my opinion). Otherwise go for the lower price.
Both Berea and HUT recommend a 31/64" drill for the main body. Berea recommends a 33/64" for the cap tube, while HUT recommends a larger 17/32" The cap tube can be a tight fit in the smaller hole, and may even require sanding inside the hole if there is any fuzz from drilling. For that reason, HUT is recommending the larger drill for the cap to make it easier to glue in the tube. However, there is the increased risk of turning through the wood
Rudy Vey
Member
To my knowledge Hut sells mainly Berea kits. Berea has two different size mandrel systems (A= 7 mm and B= 8 mm). The Berea El Grande, with Berea bushings, will be turned on the 8 mm mandrel. Woodcraft sells quite a number of Berea kits, including the El Grande - but for the Woodcraft kits the bushings available fit on a 7 mm mandrel.
Also, I bought a special sized drill bit(13.3 mm) from Ernie McFarlane of Beartooth Wood (??) for the cap since, according to another pen turners group, the size mentioned in the instruction give a too small hole and I could not find a 33/64" bit.
Rudy
Also, I bought a special sized drill bit(13.3 mm) from Ernie McFarlane of Beartooth Wood (??) for the cap since, according to another pen turners group, the size mentioned in the instruction give a too small hole and I could not find a 33/64" bit.
Rudy
Scott
Member
I have made the El Grande but not the Titan. I don't doubt that they are the same, since HUT sells mostly Berea kits (as the others have mentioned).
Craft Supplies is not the same as Penn State, though. They each have their own kits. A lot of people resell PSI's kits, but not too many sell CSUSA's kits. I think Woodcraft has actually picked up a couple of CSUSA's kits, but most are from Berea. But for the most part, if you want their kits you either get them from CSUSA directly, or from Bill Baumbeck.
A lot of the kits from the different companies appear the same, but are actually made by the respective company. Like the Polaris from PSI and the Patriot from CSUSA. Of course everybody's slimlines are pretty much the same!
Does this confuse everybody as much as it does me? [
]
Scott.
Craft Supplies is not the same as Penn State, though. They each have their own kits. A lot of people resell PSI's kits, but not too many sell CSUSA's kits. I think Woodcraft has actually picked up a couple of CSUSA's kits, but most are from Berea. But for the most part, if you want their kits you either get them from CSUSA directly, or from Bill Baumbeck.
A lot of the kits from the different companies appear the same, but are actually made by the respective company. Like the Polaris from PSI and the Patriot from CSUSA. Of course everybody's slimlines are pretty much the same!
Does this confuse everybody as much as it does me? [
]Scott.
Daniel
Member
See that's what I get for not buying Hut kits !!!
And yes it is confusing. I mostly follow my rule of thumb in order to make a good guess at which bushings and manderels will work with what kits.
sometimes it works out and others it doesn't. big pain when I have to wait to make a pen for the bushings to get delivered. I now own a metal lathe and can just make my own
Bottom line If I really want to know if two kits are the same I have to buy them both and look them over real good.
It's the pens like the Executive from P.S.I. which is I believe the retro or something like that at CSUSA. that everyone has a look alike that make the lines pretty hazy. It has always been my impression that Berea kits have to use Berea manderels though. as the manderels are thicker than P.S.I. etc.
And yes it is confusing. I mostly follow my rule of thumb in order to make a good guess at which bushings and manderels will work with what kits.
sometimes it works out and others it doesn't. big pain when I have to wait to make a pen for the bushings to get delivered. I now own a metal lathe and can just make my own
Bottom line If I really want to know if two kits are the same I have to buy them both and look them over real good.
It's the pens like the Executive from P.S.I. which is I believe the retro or something like that at CSUSA. that everyone has a look alike that make the lines pretty hazy. It has always been my impression that Berea kits have to use Berea manderels though. as the manderels are thicker than P.S.I. etc.
Scott
Member
Hi Daniel,
I use Berea's mandrel anyway, but a lot of people have told me that PSI bushings then won't fit on the Berea mandrel because they're made to fit the barely slimmer PSI mandrel. Maybe I'm weird (or my mandrel is) but I never have problems using PSI bushings on my Berea mandrel, except the "B" mandrel, of course!
You're lucky that you can make your own bushings now! I will get there someday.
Take care!
Scott.
I use Berea's mandrel anyway, but a lot of people have told me that PSI bushings then won't fit on the Berea mandrel because they're made to fit the barely slimmer PSI mandrel. Maybe I'm weird (or my mandrel is) but I never have problems using PSI bushings on my Berea mandrel, except the "B" mandrel, of course!
You're lucky that you can make your own bushings now! I will get there someday.
Take care!
Scott.
Tapered bushings!!! Why didn't I think of that??!!??
I really like the idea of having a tapered bushing at the tip. That would make it easier to turn and sand the transition of the wood into the tapered tip.
Thanks!!
I really like the idea of having a tapered bushing at the tip. That would make it easier to turn and sand the transition of the wood into the tapered tip.
Thanks!!
Daniel
Member
Making my own tapered bushings was the main reason I bought my metal lathe. then I got the idea to make Barrel trimmer pilots for the larger pen kits also. weel long story short I havhe gotten buried under other projects so bad I havn't been able to get to either of them. i spent 7 hours straight in my shop today and didn't even make a dent in one of the projects I have going, combine that with trying to make 100 pens for the freedom pen project and I am busy for a long time. I'm just glad the kits are not in yet for the freedom pens. handy excuse.
pen-turners
Member
In reference to making your own bushings. I have a Jet Mini and I make my own bushings all the time!!! You don't need a metal lathe to do this. I use a piece of brass rod which I drill a 7mm hole through, mount it on the mandrel and turn the brass down with normal HSS tools. It is not complicated and can be done by anyone. I wear out 7mm bushings FAST and have made a bunch of them. One note--- the brass bushings DO wear out faster than the steel you are normally using but I bought a whole brass bar for the price of one set of bushings.
Just my opinion.
Chris
Just my opinion.
Chris
Daniel
Member
I thought about that. and have turned some brass on my wood lathe. I also thought about making them from very hard wood, like mahogany which I just happen to have a bunch laying around. also inthe case of actually buying the metal lathe youhave to make 100 sets of bushings just to break even. 101 if you count the cost of the material
In my case I have many other uses for it. so making my own bushings is actually on a long list of reasons I got it. I also want to fiddle with making my own end caps. tips center bands etc. adn actully intend to use it for the first time in making the 100 pens for the freedom pen project. I need a custom set of bushings for the pens i want to make as will as I can rough turn the blanks to the largest diameter I need them before finishing on my wood lathe. I hope to have my sone turning the rough blanks while I finish them. then I will have him help with the sanding and polishing while my wife and daughter assemble them. hopefully a nice family experience. and will get the whole job done faster.
In my case I have many other uses for it. so making my own bushings is actually on a long list of reasons I got it. I also want to fiddle with making my own end caps. tips center bands etc. adn actully intend to use it for the first time in making the 100 pens for the freedom pen project. I need a custom set of bushings for the pens i want to make as will as I can rough turn the blanks to the largest diameter I need them before finishing on my wood lathe. I hope to have my sone turning the rough blanks while I finish them. then I will have him help with the sanding and polishing while my wife and daughter assemble them. hopefully a nice family experience. and will get the whole job done faster.
pen-turners
Member
I know what you mean. I had to make a bunch of custom bushings for some pen kits I bought from Canada. I got the regency pen kits which have the most wood on them of any pen I have seen. They are almost all custom made!! I got them at www.woodchuckers.com if you want to check them out. Warning. They are definitely not for the beginner.
Chris
Chris
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