General pen finishing questions

[newgenesis]

I am still trying to perfect my finishing technique. I am good at the sand to smooth, denatured alcohol to knock off dust, 3 layers of thin CA followed by 2 layers of medium CA.

On some of the more porous material I am still working with I tend to collect dust that get locked in by the CA. Question I have would using sanding sealer followed by a layer of stain for color and then a couple layers of medium CA for protection help with the dust catching in the pores?

 

[Woodchipper]

I wipe with a dry terry material towel. Surprising how much dust it removes. I have never used sanding sealer on pens. I use a couple of coars of medium or thick CA for porous wood as oak or pecan.

 

[TonyL]

Last night, I turned Bolivian Rosewood. It had tight grain but some thin "checks"/cracks. After sanding it, using ample amount of compresses air, and wiping it down with DNA several times (then compressed air again), I still had some dust that was locked-in. So I took a very sharp and thin metal object and carefully removed the just. (the wiped down with DNA and more compressed air). Applied 3 coats of medium followed by 3 coats of thin (I used GB this time). When I use Mercury, I apply 4 to 5 coats of thin followed by 4 to 5 coats of medium - this is just what I happen to do. I apply thin coats with whatever paper towels my wife buys.

I have no idea if this is the best approach, but it is what I had to do. It turned out fine and no visible dust.

 

[budnder]

How are you cleaning with denatured alcohol? That always does the trick for me - my process is similar.

 

[newgenesis]

I am using the DNA using a blue shop paper towel before I start adding the CA. Seems like I am collecting the dust between the layers of thin and medium CA when I sand the CA. Currently: 1. Sand to smooth after I turn to the profile I want. 2. Apply DNA to remove the dust. 3. Apply three layers of thin CA. 4. Sand to smooth. 5. Apply 2 layers of medium CA. 6. Polish.

Seems as if I am either not getting all of the dust off at step 2 or collecting CA dust between steps 4 and 5.

 

[DrD]

Not too sure of your rational for sanding after 3 layers of "thin." Also, it should be remembered that CA polymerization is not necessarily an instantaneous process. Reading the backs of most all CA bottles you will note there is a cure time given. I would recommend you wait for a minimum of the stated cure time if not longer before sanding especially if you intend to apply additional coats of CA, regardless of viscosity. Following sanding, dust removal is very important; wet sanding is usually recommended when coating with CA - though not by all. Wet sanding followed by a wipe down with a cotton rag usually is pretty good way of eliminating CA dust. It has taken me time to adopt all this myself, BUT I have learned it is far better to take my time, rather than rush; I have come to realize turning a truly nice pen is not a horse race - it is a pleasant stroll thru the park.
Good turning to you
DrD

 

[McKenzie Penworks]

Yea, don't sand between layers of CA... Just build it up. It'll stick to itself just fine without the need to create additional mechanical bonding through sanding. Once you've got it built up where you need it then you can just sand smooth and polish. Frankly, I rarely need to to drop below 800 grit after applying CA unless I was over zealous and have waves. Applying with a nitrile gloved finger drastically improved the quality vs trying to use a paper towel. Paper towels are horrible applicators....

 

[DrD]

Second what Tim says about using nitrile to apply, paper towels - any type, blue, white, etc - are really bad and tend to create more issues than they solve.

 

[Woodchipper]

Second what Tim says about using nitrile to apply, paper towels - any type, blue, white, etc - are really bad and tend to create more issues than they solve.

Been using paper towels for a loooong time. Instead of the quick picker-upper, I use the slow putt-it-downer. What issues are you talking about?

 

[McKenzie Penworks]

Paper towels leave a texture, they soak up as much as they put down, they have a tendency to heat up, etc etc etc. Tried them 10 years ago then wondered why the heck anyone would use them as applicators for any finish, switched to a nitrile gloved finger tip and realized I could use less glue and get a smoother finish running the lathe at 500. Craft foam, the little baggies from the pen kits, etc all are superior to a paper towel for the same reasons. I get it, when you're comfortable with a finishing schedule you stick to it... but paper towels are better at cleaning up messes than applying finishes.

 

[DrD]

Since I have started turning again, I have noticed a bunch of radial rings on my CA finished pens. I inspect every pen I turn with a 20x loupe. I thought these were from not removing entirely the sanding scratch patterns, but after MUCH testing discovered they were the result of applying CA with paper towels - blue or white. All this led to changing my finishing process: apply CA using the little, otherwise useless to me, baggies from the pen kits - I now use waay less CA; let CA finished blank cure over night prior to sanding; wet sand along the axis, off the lathe; wipe down with cotton rag between grits. All this takes longer, and under 20x magnification, NO marks can be seen on finished barrel. This way, am happy and can offer an unblemished product to my customers.

 

[jttheclockman]

You have to remember all these things that everyone talks about is ways and methods that work for THEM. They are not the gospel way of doing things. I have used paper towels for 15 years and have no problems . One thing I will agree on is do not rush the finishing process. It is what makes or breaks that pen.

 

[newgenesis]

I do not sand between layers I only sand 3 times. Once after turning to profile at high speed to smooth. Then after the 3 layers of thin to remove any imperfections in the CA. Then finally a very light sanding after the medium. Polish and 90% of my pens come out beautiful. It is just the ones with pits or open pores that collect any dust.

 

[McKenzie Penworks]

No reason to sand between the thin and medium. Truth be told, you don't need to even use thin and could use just medium. Or just a lot of thin... either one works. No real need to use two different ones. Folks make pen finishing a lot more difficult than it needs to be sometimes.

 

[budnder]

I am using the DNA using a blue shop paper towel before I start adding the CA. Seems like I am collecting the dust between the layers of thin and medium CA when I sand the CA. Currently: 1. Sand to smooth after I turn to the profile I want. 2. Apply DNA to remove the dust. 3. Apply three layers of thin CA. 4. Sand to smooth. 5. Apply 2 layers of medium CA. 6. Polish.

Seems as if I am either not getting all of the dust off at step 2 or collecting CA dust between steps 4 and 5.

I have to clean with Alcohol after every time I sand - e.g. would be step 4.5 above. I have had issues with CA dust if I don't.

After cleaning with alcohol, I typically do a couple of coats of thin, then 3-4 coats of thick - applied with a paper towel and no sanding in between. Then sand with the lathe off lengthwise with 400 paper until there's no shiny spots. Then clean with alcohol and repeat - couple of coats of thin, then a few of thick. Then sand with 400 until no shiny spots, then 600, then 1000, then micromesh and then novus #2. If I skip the second CA application, I've got a 50/50 chance of sanding through the CA in a spot or two, so that's why I do the second round.

I have tried applying CA with craft foam/baggie/nitrile/etc. and the CA definitely goes on thicker, but I find that it also doesn't go on as smooth and takes more sanding.

 

[newgenesis]

Thanks for the inputs on finishing pens. Just for a bit of clarification on my sanding. The first stage is sanding from 150 - 2000 to get absolutely smooth. Second and third stage sanding is micromesh pads from 1500 - 12k. I am truthfully getting beautiful results with my current technique. I will, however, take the advice of wiping a little DNA after sanding/polishing the CA.

On a different (slightly) note could I run a little stain or something to get a different effect on my blank and use CA to protect the blank appearance?

 

[DrD]

Just as a point of interest, if you check a MicroMesh grit comparison chart - comparison to ANSI grits, it is my understanding - and I could be mistaken - that 1500 MM is equivalent to ANSI (Commercial sandpaper) 400 grit. So you may not need to take all that time with sand paper beyond 400 grit.

 

[Woodchipper]

A fellow in our AAW club turns about 300 pens a year. I asked him about finishing. He used 400 grit wet/dry sandpaper. I experimented with MM and Hutt polish. Came out smooth. More than one way to finish a pen.

 

[Woodchipper]

Paper towels leave a texture, they soak up as much as they put down, they have a tendency to heat up, etc etc etc. Tried them 10 years ago then wondered why the heck anyone would use them as applicators for any finish, switched to a nitrile gloved finger tip and realized I could use less glue and get a smoother finish running the lathe at 500. Craft foam, the little baggies from the pen kits, etc all are superior to a paper towel for the same reasons. I get it, when you're comfortable with a finishing schedule you stick to it... but paper towels are better at cleaning up messes than applying finishes.

CA will naturally heat up due to the chemical reaction. Anyone had CA on bare skin?

 

[McKenzie Penworks]

CA will naturally heat up due to the chemical reaction. Anyone had CA on bare skin?

Doesn't react with nitrile... And it only takes a second at 500 rpms to apply. Usually people that have issues are trying to push down instead of letting it just lay out on the pen body. Never had a problem with heat with this method over the past decade...

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk

 

[Woodchipper]

I apply turning the headstock manually, wiping with the grain. Mark the mandrel so I only turn it two times. After that the CA starts to set up and there is the mess.

 

[howsitwork]

I'm trying applying CA using polythene bag to wipe it on wit lathe running , seems to work OK thus far but now got to get on with micro meshing it. As has been said many ways to get the result you want