Curious about something

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Texatdurango

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I've noticed something on the forum this past year or so and it seems to be happening more frequently as time goes on and am curious as to what is causing it. Nothing earth shaking and I'm not focusing on anyone in particular, just curious..........

In years past, turners seemed to go through stages of evolution as we learned to make pens. Usually the first handful weren't fit to even show anyone (we all have a box full of "shop pens" lying around right!). The next handful were OK but nothing to brag about and usually were still 90% slimlines, then finally we started making some nice looking pens.

This past year or so I notice more and more people are posting the likes of "This is my first pen ever" or "here are my first two or three pens" and they are quite often the more expensive kits with fairly expensive blanks and judging from the fit and finish, they look as if they are seasoned turners.

Are we as a forum of penmakers placing too much emphasis on competition amongst ourselves to the point that a rank amateur feels like they have to compete from day one to fit in?

I can remember the first few pens I made and believe me, they weren't pretty BUT... I posted them anyway because I was proud of them. I knew they didn't hold a candle to some of the other pens being shown and I knew where I stood and continued to make progress and got better with each pen.

So, what's the deal, are some of you new turners embarrassed or reluctant to post your less than perfect creations? Are you intimidated by those with more experience or do you feel the need to compete in the SOYP forum for comments or accolades?

It's almost as if there is a contest to see who can make the first best pen when in reality, it really doesn't matter how fast you learn and no one really expects perfect results from your first pens.

Any thoughts?
 
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Just a thought here, but there is so much info on this forum you can pretty much eliminate any of the flaws that you would do if you just ventured out on your own. I think if I would have found this site when I first started turning pens I may have not made half the mistakes I started out with. I have really learned so much form the people on here its not funny.

Lin.
 
Things have definitely notched up, George. Not sure what the factors are. Just look at the huge jump between last year's best of IAP and this year. I mean, both years are amazing, but it has jumped. I'm noticing, still, a lot of beginner pens of good quality - but not simlines. And one has to consider all the resources available to the beginners??

Just look at all the custom pens showing up since the group buys of taps amd dies. This community has really grown. I just hope beginners can post and share without having to worry about comparisons. This forum is a source of encouragement for all levels of turning.

Happy turning. (I guess I'll have to post all of my kitless screwups now!) : )
 
lorbay said:
Just a thought here, but there is so much info on this forum you can pretty much eliminate any of the flaws that you would do if you just ventured out on your own. I think if I would have found this site when I first started turning pens I may have not made half the mistakes I started out with. I have really learned so much form the people on here its not funny.
Lin.
Click to expand...

George, I agree with Lin, there is so much information and it is so easy to access that a new penturner can read about another's mistakes and know what not to do well before they even buy their first kit. When I turned my first pen in 1999, I was in Hawaii and the pen kits I got were from the Honolulu Woodcraft store. They had slimlines and Europeans so that is what I started with, the kit included an instructions sheet and that is all you had to figure it out. I destroyed many a blank trying to get that tenon just right. The internet existed but it was dial-up for me back then so I did not do much surfing other than e-mail.

If I was a starting now I would feel a lot more confident going in, I would bypass mandrels, cheap brad point drill bits, hand drill drilling, friction polish, paper backed sandpaper and go straight to between centers turning, parabolic bits, lathe drilling, CA finish and micromesh/abranet. It took me a few years to figure this all out.
Eugene
 
George, what I think you are noticing is the evolution of pen turning. So many more kits and types of blanks are available now as compared to say ten years ago. Also you tube and the like have made learning much faster. ANyone now getting into pen turning has this great site and others with gobs of information on fit, finish, etc.

I also suspect that many "my first pens" posts are actually several pens into one's experience.
 
Well the thing that would bother me is how much learning and understanding or the mechanics of what we do gets lost if we do not make mistakes. Linda can tell you that when things don't go right, she has to deal with a bear, but eventually I gain an appreciation for what I learned the hard way. There is no way for me to post my screw ups after I throw them across the shop so they shatter into garbage that has to be swept up. Nor do I want to take the time to set up the camera to photograph such rubbage. So I guess when I post a first, it is a first completed pen that survived my temper tantrum. :redface:

As for the expensive kits, how many times do you see seasoned turners talk about how a slim line is one of the hardest pens to turn in regards to fit. Not too forgiving. Besides that they are ugly and uncomfortable to write with for me. After spending a few hundred on equipment, what is another $20 on a kit and $15 on a blank. Besides it is a lot more fun making something you like rather than something that just doesn't cut the mustard. Also George, think about what was available when you first started turning and today. There have been a lot of innovations since that day so many millennia ago. :eek::biggrin::eek:
 
I agree that things have changed on this site. I don't know if its a fad, or merely the development of the people engaged in penmaking, but there seems to be a definite bias in favor of kitless pen making (or maybe preference for kitless would be the better choice of words.) When someone posts a kitless pen, there are numerous "likes" and sometimes several lines of them. Additionally, there is a long list of people commenting on the work. Then you come along a posting of a stock Euro. You get comments such as "Sweet," "Good One," or the like. Any member who spends time here can readily see that there is not the same level of appreciation for those who make kit pens. Recently there have been posts suggesting that those who make kit pens are not pen makers, but pen assemblers! Do you think that encourges me to post a photo of my latest Sedona?

Personally, I prefer the style of kit pens. I realize the difficulty of making a kitless pen, as I have friends who make them. It is just not for me. I like the traditional look of wood (or acrylic) with the metal trim, and a kitless doesn't have enough metal for me to appreciate the beauty of the final product. I don't know if I am in the minority here, but based upon the posts, I am WAY in the minority as far as other penturners appreciation for kitless postings. This has discouraged me from posting my pens, and I can only imagine it has discouraged others.
 
George, I'm not sure what has changed but to me the odd thing is that as many of these "newbie" penturners obviously have a computer, they don't know how to use a computer any more than they know turning. By that I mean is seems that very few use the "search" feature on their computer to get information, they would rather get it from IAP members, and even though all computers (I think) have a "spell-right" program where the computer indicates mis-spelled words, not many use it. The presumed improvement of "my first pen" probably means "my first pen that I think can be presented without embarrassing me". And there are some sites that are "attaboy" sites where you could post a kitchen match and receive all kinds of "wow" and "that's beautiful" replies. I don't include IAP in that group but there are times.... I am impressed with the amount of great information that is available in the Library but I wonder if anyone knows what a Library is for! And the long-haired members are really generous with their information, whether here or in PMs or email!

Sorry, Sunday is my long-winded day! Thanks!
 
My first pen posted wasn't my first pen because I had made 5 or 6 before I found this site. If I had found this site I my first pen would have been a little better because I would have known that bushings lie and reading here would have shortened the learning curve. Maybe we are seeing better first pens because new members are doing more research before they start.
 
Turned my first pen in the early to mid 90's site was not here then you learned on your own. I have seen post where folks have been looking at the site for some time before trying it. plus if they are picking up there start from someplace like woodcraft, the folks there tend to be more knowledgeable about turning then even four years ago.
 
Another possible explaination George; the level of posted work is so high and so commented on that a white oak slim, over turned a bit with some sanding marks wouldn't stand a chance...but to the guy/gal that made it...it's the Taj Mahal! At the same time, there is so much evolution personally that must take place to reach another level. I'm just evolving to kitless and casting worthless wood. I can stay in that spot for a long time and not tire of it!
 
I think it's just natural evolution. We naturally try to emulate what we are introduced to, as the norm.
Personally I think it's a good thing for our craft. I'd hate to see the standards getting worse each year!!:eek:

As for the secondary topic about people only getting comments for KITLESS pens, well that's just BS.
Most of the comments in these threads are made because the OP has participated in MANY previous discussions and is willing to share techniques and tricks without any alterior (sp?) motives.
I make loads of kit pens...in fact around 40 to each kitless pen I make.
I get as many comments on my kit pens as I do with many of my other stuff. I don't like all of the kitless pens shown either, but I really appreciate it when someone shares a titbit of knowledge that I can use in my own work one day.

Just posting a pic of a pen these days won't get you many comments.
Everyone knows what a Sierra looks like and most people don't care where you bought the blank or kit from. What will get you lot's of comments is obvious effort made with the photo to start with, which will show everyone you really have got a superb fit and finish. Then you need to share something like how you decided on the blank to kit or some other interesting thing about the pen.

LOL, I've seen threads where the poster has said something like ...
''Here is a Jr I got from xxxx. I couldn't be arsed to set up my camera so here is a crummy pic I took with my phone'':biggrin: Guess how many comments that one got!!:wink:


Sorry to divert from your original topic George !!:tongue:
 
skiprat said:
......

LOL, I've seen threads where the poster has said something like ...
''Here is a Jr I got from xxxx. I couldn't be arsed to set up my camera so here is a crummy pic I took with my phone'':biggrin: Guess how many comments that one got!!:wink:.......
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Yeah, that's a phrase one comes across at least a few times a day! :biggrin:
 
George: I'm going to turn my first pen tomorrow. I'll let you know how it turns out! It won't really be my "first", though it may look like it. :rolleyes: I think a lot of what we are seeing is people browsing, finding and using the information provided by turners such as yourself and others, and Inspiration of the kitless pens designed and created by turners such as Doc. and others. Further, in regards to the post by my SIL, I have not witnessed him screwing up bad enough for his blanks to go ballistic, but yeh, I expect Linda has!!!!! BUT, I'm also sure she understands perfectionism. She was raised with it! :highfive:
 
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OOPS said:
I agree that things have changed on this site. I don't know if its a fad, or merely the development of the people engaged in penmaking, but there seems to be a definite bias in favor of kitless pen making (or maybe preference for kitless would be the better choice of words.) When someone posts a kitless pen, there are numerous "likes" and sometimes several lines of them. Additionally, there is a long list of people commenting on the work. Then you come along a posting of a stock Euro. You get comments such as "Sweet," "Good One," or the like. Any member who spends time here can readily see that there is not the same level of appreciation for those who make kit pens. Recently there have been posts suggesting that those who make kit pens are not pen makers, but pen assemblers! Do you think that encourges me to post a photo of my latest Sedona?

Personally, I prefer the style of kit pens. I realize the difficulty of making a kitless pen, as I have friends who make them. It is just not for me. I like the traditional look of wood (or acrylic) with the metal trim, and a kitless doesn't have enough metal for me to appreciate the beauty of the final product. I don't know if I am in the minority here, but based upon the posts, I am WAY in the minority as far as other penturners appreciation for kitless postings. This has discouraged me from posting my pens, and I can only imagine it has discouraged others.
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Wow, I never saw this thread morphing into the kit versus kitless argument. I thought about your comments a while before writing this but here is how I see it.

First, I think you are making a big deal out of nothing, creating walls where there are none and don't think biased is the correct word to use in this situation, I can't be biased against kit makers since I still occasionally put a kit together but after seeing 6,438 sierras posted with hundreds of the same blanks over and over again, you are correct, I don't find much to comment on. Does that make me biased, I don't think so.

But, when someone makes a pen from scratch that I have never seen before, never saw the blank, never saw the shape of the finial, etc, yes, those types of posts might get a comment from me quicker.

I agree with what several have said above, that the forum is evolving with lots of new ideas being shown BUT I don't see why there has to be this animosity based on what a person likes to make and show on the forum. I don't see pen making as a competition, I see it as relaxing time in the shop (I mean studio) :smile: and that is one reason I never participate in these "Who's the best pen maker on the forum" type of contests.
 
Didn't intend to make a big deal, but to provide my perspective

From Textatdurango:

Wow, I never saw this thread morphing into the kit versus kitless argument. I thought about your comments a while before writing this but here is how I see it.

First, I think you are making a big deal out of nothing, creating walls where there are none and don't think biased is the correct word to use in this situation,



I was not intending to make a big deal out of nothing, nor was I creating or attempting to create walls. Your original post suggested that things have changed, and the "first pens" displayed by new members to this site are improved over those in previous years. It is my opinion that people who make traditional kit pens do not receive help, encouragement, an "attaboy" or whatever from the other members of the site, when in previous years they used to. I have actually observed these new posters and they don't get the number of comments or the quality of comments as some of the others receive, and especially in comparison to the kitless posts. I used the word bias, but added that preference might be the better term, so I meant no offense.

Skiprat suggested that my opinion was BS. Really? I agree that when a person, such as Skiprat, who has posted numerous pens over the years, posts a new pen, he's likely to receive more response because he's well known. But if I understand him correctly, he suggests that members here must "earn their stripes" so to speak before they will receive attention to their efforts. All I was attempting to point out is that other members, and newbies are included in this group, notice the disparity and it COULD, it MIGHT be a contributing factor in why only the nicest or most spectacular "first efforts" get posted. I agree completely with Skiprat when he says that someone who can't take the time to find a real camera and submit a proper photo of their latest pen should not be taken seriously, as I too think that's just poor citizenship on this site.

I was not attempting to start any kind of mischief. You posted your thoughts, and I was giving you my impressions. Simple as that.
 
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First of I'm curious about the slimline comment. Even though it may have been a starter pen for most of us I wouldn't consider it a lesser pen. Ths reason most of the pens I make are slimlines are that all my friends a cheep so I give more pens away than I sell. The kits are inexpensive so I can make several without a lot of out of pocket expense. I also want people to use and carry then and the slimline are an easy pen to do so. Don't get me wrong I'm not offended just letting you know my reasons. So far I've been able to do most of the things with the slimline that I felt like I was capable of doing with any other style of pen. As long as it would fit on a smaller tube. Another thought is whenever I try something different such as casting, segmenting or whatever I call it my fist pen. It might not be my fist pen ever but a new stage in penturning for me. Thanks
 
Hmmmm

I think it's the change in the internet....when I decided to start turning pens I bought books and read about it. I never ever heard of this site until after I had been turning a couple of years. The social contacts on the internet have changed that.
 
OOPS I agree that the participation (number of comments/likes per thread) does favor kitless pens, I've certainly noticed this trend. I do agree with the others though that the reason for this is 'trendy' factor of kitless and the 'I've seen that before' factor of kit pens. Those posting kitless also tend to post better quality (and more) pictures and better descriptions of their work, this opens the dialog for others to discuss the pen.

AK
 
nativewooder said:
George, I'm not sure what has changed but to me the odd thing is that as many of these "newbie" penturners obviously have a computer, they don't know how to use a computer any more than they know turning. By that I mean is seems that very few use the "search" feature on their computer to get information, they would rather get it from IAP members, and even though all computers (I think) have a "spell-right" program where the computer indicates mis-spelled words, not many use it. The presumed improvement of "my first pen" probably means "my first pen that I think can be presented without embarrassing me". And there are some sites that are "attaboy" sites where you could post a kitchen match and receive all kinds of "wow" and "that's beautiful" replies. I don't include IAP in that group but there are times.... I am impressed with the amount of great information that is available in the Library but I wonder if anyone knows what a Library is for! And the long-haired members are really generous with their information, whether here or in PMs or email!

Sorry, Sunday is my long-winded day! Thanks!
Click to expand...

I am not sure what the line about long-haired members means? I do think that people would rather ask how to do something rather then try it, look up articles in the library or books. I think that may have to do with learning style or just wanting to take the easy route. I do think that pen turning has evolved since i started almost 7 years ago. I actually like making slim lines for their diversity and how they have made me a better turner. My turning has improved so that I can turn and get a great fit, finish and each pen, no matter what type, is a learning experience.
I think that many turners, who might have thought that pen turning wasn't turning have changed their minds and bring to pen making their many years of turning experience, which makes a difference. My learning curve took longer since I had never seen a lathe until I took a pen making class at Woodcraft. So it was all new and did take a long time to really understand it all.
 
OOPS said:
From Textatdurango:

Wow, I never saw this thread morphing into the kit versus kitless argument. I thought about your comments a while before writing this but here is how I see it.

First, I think you are making a big deal out of nothing, creating walls where there are none and don't think biased is the correct word to use in this situation,



I was not intending to make a big deal out of nothing, nor was I creating or attempting to create walls. Your original post suggested that things have changed, and the "first pens" displayed by new members to this site are improved over those in previous years. It is my opinion that people who make traditional kit pens do not receive help, encouragement, an "attaboy" or whatever from the other members of the site, when in previous years they used to. I have actually observed these new posters and they don't get the number of comments or the quality of comments as some of the others receive, and especially in comparison to the kitless posts. I used the word bias, but added that preference might be the better term, so I meant no offense.

Skiprat suggested that my opinion was BS. Really? I agree that when a person, such as Skiprat, who has posted numerous pens over the years, posts a new pen, he's likely to receive more response because he's well known. But if I understand him correctly, he suggests that members here must "earn their stripes" so to speak before they will receive attention to their efforts. All I was attempting to point out is that other members, and newbies are included in this group, notice the disparity and it COULD, it MIGHT be a contributing factor in why only the nicest or most spectacular "first efforts" get posted. I agree completely with Skiprat when he says that someone who can't take the time to find a real camera and submit a proper photo of their latest pen should not be taken seriously, as I too think that's just poor citizenship on this site.

I was not attempting to start any kind of mischief. You posted your thoughts, and I was giving you my impressions. Simple as that.
Click to expand...



I agreed with you 100% up until you mentioned the photography bit, I joined this site to get encouragement and to gain knowledge on how to turn a pen. I didn't join this site or any other to have my photography skills criticized, if I wanted that kind of criticism I would join a photo group. I have already spent a load of money just getting set up to turn a few pens, I don't have any intention of spending any amount of money on photography equipment. I find it to be like peole aren't paying attention to the actual pen that is being shown, all they are interested in doing is finding fault in everything. Up until last year I never owned a camera, and I didn't or still don't take any amount of pictures. As far as I'm concerned it's the pen that should be looked at, and not the quality of the picture. And what is in the backround shouldn't make a spit of difference, as long as you can get a good look at the pen. I've never enjoyed taking pics or having my pic taken, so why should I take hours of time to figure out something that I know I won't enjoy doing? If the person who turned the pen is satisfied enough with the picture then who are you (meaning anybody) to do nothing but complain about pic quality and to not even mention the pen? I've seen this happen on this site and all I could think of is, what a harsh crowd a fellow shows up to display his newly turned pen, and all he gets is his picture critized
Len
 
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George,

As the person who observed the need to post your thoughts in introducing this subject of first posting, pics of whatever quality you nominated your expectations and then surprise lots of people followed with their observations.

As another member who has thoughts may I suggest this forum means different things to all of us who as members equal in every way. How we apply our skills, what we say is important equally.

I trust that we can foster unity and help in our own way simply, without bias in such a way the large number of newcomers to this site will feel comfortable when submitting their contributions. Trends come and go and thank goodness for the stimulus I receive personally.

AS is the norm a dedicated group of volunteers man, manage, provide us with limitless opportunity to share.

Taking this opportunity then many thanks to the owner of the forum who enables us.

Kind regards to all.

Peter.
 
OOPS said:
I agree that things have changed on this site. I don't know if its a fad, or merely the development of the people engaged in penmaking, but there seems to be a definite bias in favor of kitless pen making (or maybe preference for kitless would be the better choice of words.) When someone posts a kitless pen, there are numerous "likes" and sometimes several lines of them. Additionally, there is a long list of people commenting on the work. Then you come along a posting of a stock Euro. You get comments such as "Sweet," "Good One," or the like. Any member who spends time here can readily see that there is not the same level of appreciation for those who make kit pens. Recently there have been posts suggesting that those who make kit pens are not pen makers, but pen assemblers! Do you think that encourges me to post a photo of my latest Sedona?

Personally, I prefer the style of kit pens. I realize the difficulty of making a kitless pen, as I have friends who make them. It is just not for me. I like the traditional look of wood (or acrylic) with the metal trim, and a kitless doesn't have enough metal for me to appreciate the beauty of the final product. I don't know if I am in the minority here, but based upon the posts, I am WAY in the minority as far as other penturners appreciation for kitless postings. This has discouraged me from posting my pens, and I can only imagine it has discouraged others.
Click to expand...


Alot to digest here but somethings that stand out. Who cares if you make kit or kitless pens. You make what you like. I do not like the kitless fad that has gone through here and tired of seeing some people keep making them and showing just because they made from a different colored material. We get it. Move on. It has though open many newer possibilities and skills so it is also a good thing. Not for everyone but keep an open mind.

The same can be said for kit pens. When people show a pen and there is no background to the making of it there is a tendency to have those short one or two word responses. If the blank or kit or the design is out of the ordinary it will open to more detailed responses so you should take cues from that. Be creative in your discrition and by no means be afraid to show your work.

Lucky2 said:
OOPS said:
From Textatdurango:

Wow, I never saw this thread morphing into the kit versus kitless argument. I thought about your comments a while before writing this but here is how I see it.

First, I think you are making a big deal out of nothing, creating walls where there are none and don't think biased is the correct word to use in this situation,



I was not intending to make a big deal out of nothing, nor was I creating or attempting to create walls. Your original post suggested that things have changed, and the "first pens" displayed by new members to this site are improved over those in previous years. It is my opinion that people who make traditional kit pens do not receive help, encouragement, an "attaboy" or whatever from the other members of the site, when in previous years they used to. I have actually observed these new posters and they don't get the number of comments or the quality of comments as some of the others receive, and especially in comparison to the kitless posts. I used the word bias, but added that preference might be the better term, so I meant no offense.

Skiprat suggested that my opinion was BS. Really? I agree that when a person, such as Skiprat, who has posted numerous pens over the years, posts a new pen, he's likely to receive more response because he's well known. But if I understand him correctly, he suggests that members here must "earn their stripes" so to speak before they will receive attention to their efforts. All I was attempting to point out is that other members, and newbies are included in this group, notice the disparity and it COULD, it MIGHT be a contributing factor in why only the nicest or most spectacular "first efforts" get posted. I agree completely with Skiprat when he says that someone who can't take the time to find a real camera and submit a proper photo of their latest pen should not be taken seriously, as I too think that's just poor citizenship on this site.

I was not attempting to start any kind of mischief. You posted your thoughts, and I was giving you my impressions. Simple as that.
Click to expand...

Now there is definetly some truth to the words earn your stripes. This site has dwarfed (in my opinion) as a beginners site. We have so many new members joining as evident by Jeff's posting on this subject which is a good thing in a way. Hopefully with the new members brings fresh ideas but it does get abit annoying when the same questions get asked over and over and over. What you then see is less and less people responding to these questions and sometimes facts or other ideas are left out. If the people would use the library or search feautre more often they will get a chance to see past responses and more of them which can be more helpful. So when some points a newbie to the library or search feature it is not a diss at all and don't take it as one.

You will get members that show alot of their pens here may draw more comments. Just make more pens and what you need to do is strive to do better with each one you make and show. Soon you will get more meaningful comments.

______________________________________________________________________________________________________
OOPS -----Should have been a space between here


I agreed with you 100% up until you mentioned the photography bit, I joined this site to get encouragement and to gain knowledge on how to turn a pen. I didn't join this site or any other to have my photography skills criticized, if I wanted that kind of criticism I would join a photo group. I have already spent a load of money just getting set up to turn a few pens, I don't have any intention of spending any amount of money on photography equipment. I find it to be like peole aren't paying attention to the actual pen that is being shown, all they are interested in doing is finding fault in everything. Up until last year I never owned a camera, and I didn't or still don't take any amount of pictures. As far as I'm concerned it's the pen that should be looked at, and not the quality of the picture. And what is in the backround shouldn't make a spit of difference, as long as you can get a good look at the pen. I've never enjoyed taking pics or having my pic taken, so why should I take hours of time to figure out something that I know I won't enjoy doing? If the person who turned the pen is satisfied enough with the picture then who are you (meaning anybody) to do nothing but complain about pic quality and to not even mention the pen? I've seen this happen on this site and all I could think of is, what a harsh crowd a fellow shows up to display his newly turned pen, and all he gets is his picture critized
Len
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Now this one I totally disagree with. Cameras today are very cheap. You do not need professional equipment at all. I shoot with a simple camera and simple lighting. I hate when people show pens that you can not make out any detail or color or anything and then expect comments favorable. I avoid them. You will not like what I have to say. You will get some that because they see a photo of a pen all they have to do is post one or two words. I do not. If I do not like the setup or quality of the photo but do find the pen somewhat interesting I may post a few suggestions how to make it stand out better. And if that person takes it as a knock then so be it. I will live. Just like pen making you want people to enjoy what you have made so take some time and put a little effort into showing a good photo. Remember all we have to judge your work by is a flat screen and some colored dots. We do not have the pen in our hands. Use the photo editing programs out there. Once you find that sweet spot for taking good photos and your hard work in that area is over. Just an opinion.

Now George

To get back on topic. As mentioned so much new equipment and information is available that quality of pens being made should be getting better right out of the box. I remember when I first joined here I did not post any pens or hardly joined in. But I did follow and read alot here and have to say my first pen which was a Sierra ( I always hated slimline) came out quite well even at todays standards. I was able to adapt the CA finishing technique quickly from reading others failures and trials. I thank the forfathers of this site that setup the format and forums here that helped me and hopefully many others get the info needed to make better pens. I also think there are many new pen turners here that have turning skills so that helps. They just wanted to try something new as I do with segmenting larger projects in the future. Anyway just an opinion. :smile:
 
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Comments....

Most of the pens I look in SYOP at are just that - pens. Now pens, no matter what you do with them are still pens. Now whether the makers used kits or did everything from scratch, and be they one piece bodies, two piece bodies or whatever, they will still look like pens - a tube with a clip to hold it in a shirt pocket.

To me about the only thing that ever really catches my eye is the blank. Some colors or color combinations really jump out at me, others don't.

The workmanship is usually good enough that unless the picture quality is really good, any short comings are not even noticeable to my eye, but then my eyes aren't what they were 40 years ago either. I might see a little more if I have my glasses on but not a lot.

Hence, I rarely have a comment about the pens pictured and when I do it is usually limited. Several members here routinely offer encouragement to new comers on their submissions and that is really great and if the submissions from newbies are getting better that's great too.

btw, in my opinion whoever said slimline pens were the easiest to turn was obviously not comparing them to the single bbl styles, which seem to me to be a lot easier.
 
I can't comment on forum changes, since I'm new around here.

And I can't speak for anyomne else, but I eagerly posted my first pens which were both poorly made and finished and horribly photographed.
 
I myself am a new member to this group and have been using it ask some questions and gather some information before turning my first pen. I bought my first lathe used from craigslist a little over a month ago, had the good fortune of having an awesome member send me the mandrels, live drive and some old parts off of his old machine he no longer uses, and have bought a few parts and tools preparing for that maiden voyage!

I will tell you that I bought 2 slimline kits from the local woodworking shop in Omaha and thought i would give those a try first because they look the easiest to start with but I really have no idea. I'm not gonna start with any exotic wood beings that I bought a blank of cherry, walnut, and cedar but I am very excited to attempt it just the same! With that said I plan on posting pictures of whatever comes of my first turning, whether it looks like i'm a seasoned veteran (which i doubt is gonna be the case) or it simply looks like a dowel with ink flowing from it. Either way i'm gonna be extremely proud for being able to make something with my own hands and anticipating the next one and hoping it'll be that much better!

I personally think for me it's worth it with all the videos i've been watching online and research i've been doing to maybe make it an easier experience the first time. I don't know that years ago when some of you veterans were starting that you had all the resources at your disposal but I do in today's age and I like to take advantage of any help I can possibly get.

Jon
 
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