Chuck Help Needed

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Titanium15

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Joined
Jun 16, 2015
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37
Location
North Eastern Kentucky
I was using my Barracuda Chuck last Saturday, trying to make a small hollow scoop. I had removed the live center and was just starting on the hollow and had a catch. It was my first time trying a carbide cutter, and I need more time learning those things. But my problem is that after the catch, I cannot get the chuck to run true. The body of the chuck seems to be fine, but the jaws have a lot of wobble in them now. Does anyone know if is it possible to bend something in the "guts" of the chuck, and if so, how to get the thing to run true again?

By the way, the chuck is about 5 months old, and I have not turned much with it. I have only used two of the sets of jaws so far, and I checked them both to make sure it was not just one jaw set or one single jaw.

Thanks,
Stephen
 
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I cannot imagine that a chuck would contain parts that could be bent in a catch.

When you say that it doesn't run 'true', what do you mean? Is that the chuck alone, or is there something held in the chuck? It's not unusual for a catch to cause a piece to become unseated in a chuck with the result that the piece wobbles.

You said you were hollowing a scoop - I interpret that to mean that the piece you were turning was asymmetrical, and the handle on the scoop was protruding on one side. Did you remove the piece from the chuck, and if so, did you make sure that when you remounted it, you got it back into exactly the same position (ie, the handle was protruding between the same pair of jaws)? Its always prudent to mark the alignment of the piece in the jaws so that if you remove it, you can return it to exactly the same position. Most people mark the centerline of the #1 jaw.

Also, have you checked to make sure that the screws holding the jaws are all tight?
 
By not running true, I mean that the jaws wobble when turning. The body of the chuck, when on the lathe with no jaws, does not wobble. I had a piece of oak in the chuck, no handle on it. I had planned on turning the handle separately. I had finished rounding it, and was going to start on the hollowing of the scoop. When I put the cutter up to it, I must have gone in too fast, or hit a rough spot on the end of the piece, the wood caught and pulled out of the jaws. I tried to put it back in the jaws, but could not get the wobble out of the piece, and in checking, I cannot get any of the jaws to not wobble when they are on the chuck. I have cleaned, taken the jaws off and put them back on. I have used different screws to make sure one of them did not get bent, all to no avail. I have put new pieces of wood on the chuck. Between centers, no problem, just with the jaws on the chuck. I'm stumped.
Stephen
 
I have been able to take my chuck apart cleaning the jaw slides and lubricating them. When the jaws catch or do not move as they should, it is time for cleaning.
My two cents.
 
Titanium15 said:
By not running true, I mean that the jaws wobble when turning. The body of the chuck, when on the lathe with no jaws, does not wobble. I had a piece of oak in the chuck, no handle on it. I had planned on turning the handle separately. I had finished rounding it, and was going to start on the hollowing of the scoop. When I put the cutter up to it, I must have gone in too fast, or hit a rough spot on the end of the piece, the wood caught and pulled out of the jaws. I tried to put it back in the jaws, but could not get the wobble out of the piece, and in checking, I cannot get any of the jaws to not wobble when they are on the chuck. I have cleaned, taken the jaws off and put them back on. I have used different screws to make sure one of them did not get bent, all to no avail. I have put new pieces of wood on the chuck. Between centers, no problem, just with the jaws on the chuck. I'm stumped.
Stephen
Click to expand...

All the jaws wobble? I just see that without some issue with the body of the chuck. Are you saying the jaws rattle or they are actually bent? Almost all these cheaper chucks rattle until you clamp something. It's my experience that you just don't put that much load on the chuck when a piece of wood is thrown out. I'd close the jaws all the way in and look at them to see if anything is bent. After that, I guess take it to a machine shop and have them evaluate the problem. That will probably cost the same amount as a new chuck. You might spend a little more for the new one to get better quality.
 
It's a Barracuda .... a chuck like that should be fairly well made and covered by whichever company you got it through.


That having been said, you may want to go ahead and close up the chuck all the way, just to make sure that everything is in alignment. There shouldn't be any gap between the pin jaws at all ... Once you've checked that and find that it's ok, try chucking some wood up again.

If you find that one or more jaws aren't in the center when you have closed them all the way, you may need to disassemble and then reassemble your chuck to fix the issue ... it could have just slipped out of alignment during the mishap. While you have it apart, you may as well clean and lube .... :)
 
I have the PSI Utility chuck - which is the really inexpensive end of the Barracuda line. The inner workings of a chuck are heavy, machined and hardened steel. I really can't imagine a catch that would bend anything in the essential components of the chuck that would cause runout.

And I'm also a great fan of Occam's Razor - the simplest explanation for a problem is the most likely explanation.

Which jaws were you using when you had the catch? If you are using the #1 jaws, do they attach with or two screws?

You mentioned that you disassembled the chuck. To Greg's point - do the slider's align when the chuck is closed? The sliders have to be installed in the proper sequence so that they will come together exactly when the chuck is closed. If you install the sliders in the wrong sequence, the closing motions of the sliders won't the synchronized and they won't come together.

Also, were the jaws reinstalled on the correct sliders? The sliders are jaws are numbered, and those numbers must match.
 
Let me give this another try.
I put the jaws in the chuck, screw them tight so they meet in the middle of the opening. No gaps, no signs of one or more of them being out of place. I screw the chuck on the headstock, and when I turn the lathe on, the ends of the jaws do not run in a circle, but rather wobble, or make an oval. They are not lose in the chuck body, as if the screws are loose. That's what I mean by not running true, they do not turn in a true circle, but in some eccentric shape. I have cleaned and lubed as much as I have been able to so far, I have not taken the whole thing apart yet. I guess that is going to have to happen soon. I have only been turning for about a year, so most of this is still very new to me, and I may not be using the correct terminology when trying to explain myself. Sorry for that.
Thanks for your help,
Stephen
 
Stephen

So what you are saying is that the jaws are tightly attached to the sliders, but when the chuck spins with nothing held between the jaws, the jaws appear loose and wobble.

If the jaws are tightly attached to sliders, but the jaws appear to be loose when the chuck rotates, that means that the sliders must be loose.

Have you tried mounting a blank in the chuck? Do the jaws wobble then? Are all four jaws wobbling to the same degree, or is the wobble in just one jaw?

How much wobble are you getting? I just checked my chuck - not the same model as yours, but when the jaws are tightly attached to the sliders, they still wobble just a little - less than 1mm.

The sliders in the chuck are held in grooves machined on the sides, and teeth on the bottom ride in a spiral groove causing them to move in or out when you turn the chuck handle. It's normal for there to be a little slop in that mechanism, and the wobble goes away when the jaws are tightened on a blank.

But if the wobble is significant, and if it doesn't go away when the jaws are tightened (which probably also means that the jaws CAN'T be tightened), then I would wonder about a problem with the way those sliders are held in the chuck. Keep in mind that the chuck is made of heavy, hardened steel and should be able to withstand any abuse you might give it. But I had a catch that caused the shaft of my toolrest to snap off, and that's not supposed to happen either.

Did you find any bits of metal under your lathe when you had your catch? Did you try shaking the chuck - does it rattle suggesting that there is a bit of loose metal inside?
 
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The real test is to chuck up a steel dowel or even a long socket of just about any size, say 1/2". What does the dowel do with the machine running?
Don't stand in front of the chuck, BTW.
 
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Titanium15 said:
Let me give this another try.
I put the jaws in the chuck, screw them tight so they meet in the middle of the opening. No gaps, no signs of one or more of them being out of place. I screw the chuck on the headstock, and when I turn the lathe on, the ends of the jaws do not run in a circle, but rather wobble, or make an oval. They are not lose in the chuck body, as if the screws are loose. That's what I mean by not running true, they do not turn in a true circle, but in some eccentric shape. I have cleaned and lubed as much as I have been able to so far, I have not taken the whole thing apart yet. I guess that is going to have to happen soon. I have only been turning for about a year, so most of this is still very new to me, and I may not be using the correct terminology when trying to explain myself. Sorry for that.
Thanks for your help,
Stephen
Click to expand...


Stephen -- I have a couple of this brand of chucks in my bucket. They can be passable, but they are not top drawer gear. One is worse made than the other and jams a lot, so I have had a lot of practice tearing it apart. Both are long since out of warranty and the worst one has been replaced with a Nova chuck for the Jet 1014.

Sounds like you may have removed the slides that hold the jaws. The slides fit onto a spiral raised "worm gear" that moves them in and out in coordination. If the slides are not "clocked" in order, you can get the jaws off set so the apparent center is not the center of rotation of the chuck body. Once removed they have to be installed in order in the correct slot. e.g. slide 1 goes in slot 1.

One other possible reading is that you are attempting to remount the oak piece that came out of the jaws -- and it is not running true (expected given damage of being torn out of the jaws) -- and that is more likely fire wood than an easily recoverable item.

Hope this helps --
 
Thanks one and all.
I tore the whole thing down last night, seems that one of the jaws jumped or got out of order on the worm gear that closes and opens the jaws. No clue how, but that seems to be what the problem was. I did send PSI an email, their response was, well lets say it was disappointing. They want me to ship them the chuck, they will examine it, and then tell me what it will cost to replace any worn or broken parts. I have been turning for less than a year, have had the chuck for about 6 months. I did not realize that they did not last that long. Oh well, live and learn. I am going to start saving my pennies and get a different chuck. Any suggestions? I may have to put one on my Christmas list.

Thanks again all of you who responded, I really appreciate your time and input.
Stephen
 
You must have had a dramatic catch :eek:to cause the slide to jump a thread... I have 2 of the Barracuda CSC2000, one CBG3 mini and a Grizzly Barracuda clone that I've used all told for about 15 years... they do every thing I want them to do with no problems...

my biggest complaint would be the tommy bars.. sometimes I need 3 hands to mount a blank, or one of the bars will slip and invariably land in the pile of shavings on the back side of the lathe where it burrows all the way to the bottom. The grizzly has to be a dedicated number 2 jaws as the jaws from the Barracudas won't fit it.:mad::mad:

One of my Barracudas has a little looseness about it... if I open the jaws too wide, the slides will fall out and I get to spend 15 minutes to half an hour putting them back in order so the thing turns correctly and will hold... otherwise I'm satisfied with them.
 
Solution for Tellico

TellicoTurning said:
You must have had a dramatic catch :eek:to cause the slide to jump a thread... I have 2 of the Barracuda CSC2000, one CBG3 mini and a Grizzly Barracuda clone that I've used all told for about 15 years... they do every thing I want them to do with no problems...

my biggest complaint would be the tommy bars.. sometimes I need 3 hands to mount a blank, or one of the bars will slip and invariably land in the pile of shavings on the back side of the lathe where it burrows all the way to the bottom. The grizzly has to be a dedicated number 2 jaws as the jaws from the Barracudas won't fit it.:mad::mad:

One of my Barracudas has a little looseness about it... if I open the jaws too wide, the slides will fall out and I get to spend 15 minutes to half an hour putting them back in order so the thing turns correctly and will hold... otherwise I'm satisfied with them.
Click to expand...


Mr. Tellico, I have a solution for your 3 hands problem:
This is something I do every single time I need to open or close the chuck.
I pull the tool rest back in line with the chuck at a distance that the red on the handle is resting on the rest, so no marks on rest, (I have a mark on the rest holder at the lathe way). You have two holes in the chuck, to open the chuck put the tommy bar in the right hole and let it go to the rest, then pull back on the left bar and it opens. to tighten put the tommy bar in the left hole, hold the part with the right hand where you want it to go, and close the chuck by pulling down on the right bar, or forward set of holes. The holes are offset so you may have to pick another set of holes to get perfect leverage. But it becomes instinct after awhile.
Of course this reverses for chucking an ID item, but you soon get the hang of it. It gets the rest out harm's way too, and pretty soon this is second nature, you don't even have to think about it.
This is why I love Tommy Bars so much, I can get a lot tighter than I ever could with a T handle. (I suppose if you're a T handle purist you'll have to spin the chuck and tighten each set of holes.)
 
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TurtleTom said:
TellicoTurning said:
You must have had a dramatic catch :eek:to cause the slide to jump a thread... I have 2 of the Barracuda CSC2000, one CBG3 mini and a Grizzly Barracuda clone that I've used all told for about 15 years... they do every thing I want them to do with no problems...

my biggest complaint would be the tommy bars.. sometimes I need 3 hands to mount a blank, or one of the bars will slip and invariably land in the pile of shavings on the back side of the lathe where it burrows all the way to the bottom. The grizzly has to be a dedicated number 2 jaws as the jaws from the Barracudas won't fit it.:mad::mad:

One of my Barracudas has a little looseness about it... if I open the jaws too wide, the slides will fall out and I get to spend 15 minutes to half an hour putting them back in order so the thing turns correctly and will hold... otherwise I'm satisfied with them.
Click to expand...


Mr. Tellico, I have a solution for your 3 hands problem:
This is something I do every single time I need to open or close the chuck.
I pull the tool rest back in line with the chuck at a distance that the red on the handle is resting on the rest, so no marks on rest, (I have a mark on the rest holder at the lathe way). You have two holes in the chuck, to open the chuck put the tommy bar in the right hole and let it go to the rest, then pull back on the left bar and it opens. to tighten put the tommy bar in the left hole, hold the part with the right hand where you want it to go, and close the chuck by pulling down on the right bar, or forward set of holes. The holes are offset so you may have to pick another set of holes to get perfect leverage. But it becomes instinct after awhile.
Of course this reverses for chucking an ID item, but you soon get the hang of it. It gets the rest out harm's way too, and pretty soon this is second nature, you don't even have to think about it.
This is why I love Tommy Bars so much, I can get a lot tighter than I ever could with a T handle. (I suppose if you're a T handle purist you'll have to spin the chuck and tighten each set of holes.)
Click to expand...

Tom,
That's how I do too, but when it's a BIG piece of wood, the tool rest can be in the way... I usually then lay the piece down with the tenon up and let the weight of the chuck rest against the wood, then tighten... I rarely use the inside chucking method... I don't trust it as much as the outside tenon and I use a lot of dry and spalted wood that sometimes has a tendency to break out.

While I would (maybe) like one of the keyed chucks, my budget won't allow it #1, and #2 I've always been taught make do with what you have... I turn lots of bowls and pepper mills.... don't know that the keyed chuck would make me any better as a turner.
 
TurtleTom said:
The big part I had a lot of experience with as a machinist, but we used cranes above the lathe. Maybe you need to fabricate some assistance.
Click to expand...

I don't work in pieces that big.. the largest I'll put on is about a 13 or 13 1/2 blank... I'll start with a face plate on one side and shape the blank with a bottom tenon, then reverse to the chuck. I was just saying my Barracudas handle about anything I might want to make.
 
If it runs in an eccentric, you've probably assembled the jaws incorrectly. I've done that too. Here's what I found that works -- everything's numbered.

Remove all the slides (they're numbered)

1) Insert the #1 slide in any slot. Now here's the important bit --

2) Rotate the scroll gear counterclockwise so that the first part of the gear begins to engage the #1 slide, then rotate the scroll gear clockwise just enough to engage the slide.

3) Insert the #2 slide in the next slot and continue rotating the scroll gear to engage that slide

4) Insert the #3 and #4 slides sequentially in the same manner, rotating the scroll gear to engage each in their order.

That should bring all the jaws together in the center of the chuck. Just follow the numbers and you should be OK.
 
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