Almost a Table

[GaryMGg]

Pics of a soon-to-be coffee table for our media room.

The base is a pair of legs and a shelf joined with stub Mortise & Tenons
using glue. Period! Spalted quartersawn sycamore.

A closer shot of the joints.

The top is a slab of Florida Camphor with a hand-cut Black Cherry Nakashima-style bowtie.
Finished size is roughly 50" long X 16" wide X 1-1/8" thick.

The table is set a little lower than normal: the top of the table top is
16-1/2" because it's the perfect height for our feet while watching a
movie or the game. :biggrin:

I've yet to attach the top or lay on a finish. I'm still trying to decide
if I need to add anything to provide structural support to it.
For those of you who also build furniture, a question: I'm not completely
confident the stub mortise & tenons joining the legs and shelf which make
up the base are sufficient for the long-term survival of this table.

If you were going to add aprons, how would you do design them?
What other options would you consider to prevent a collapse from racking?

I have several ideas I know will work; I'm seeking opinions to see if anyone
has a solution that I'd prefer to my own.

Thanks,
Gary

 

[mickr]

Gary I have built furniture for over 40 years (and sold it) so I have a tad of experience in this arena...when you say stub tenon I think you mean a very short tenon in a very shallow mortise..YES??? It may not be adequate..look at your picture & envision your weight on top of it..all the pressure FORCES the 2 legs outward and away from your shelf end..yes? Full through tenons..large enough may work..thru tenons with a wedge will definately work..apron???your design , up to you.. I ssume again that you mean 2 boards running under the top in the long direction when you say apron...you might consider a vertical "apron" on the end to tie the top /legs/shelf together..just a thought..good luck & hope it withstands the test of time

 

[mickr]

sorry Gary more thoughts..I'm guessing metal type fasteners are not wanted in this application..but of course they would strengthen the table immensly..but with wood as an option..you could dowel the shelf in...or use a sliding dovetail tenon...2 other options off the top of my early morning head..if you want any more ideas send me a PM I'd be happy to help

 

[mredburn]

you could router a groove to match the legs in the bottomof the tble top. square ends and glue the legs into the top. you could build an apron 2in tall that was flush with the top of the bottom shelf that was routered on the edges to fit into the legs and shelf. it could be flush with the legs or extend past. what about a 3/4 strip glued and screwed under the shelf to the legs, shorter than the width of the legs. Lots of luck would like to see it when you finish. MIke

 

[NewLondon88]

Tenon and wedge was my thought, too .. but the parts are already cut, so that's
probably out. My dad picked up a bench somewhere that had tenon and wedge to
hold it together and I was surprised at how well it worked. It was wobbly when it
came in but I just tapped the wedge with a hammer and that sucker wouldn't budge
for anything. Someone called it a tusk wedge, someone else called it a trestle pin..
someone called it a tusk tenon.
I don't know what the real name is, but it is a simple and efficient join, very strong
comes apart in a snap. A 350 lb guy tested it out before the rest of us did.

 

[Bree]

If you add some aprons you could put several L brackets under the shelf, bend them out and reinforce the legs against the forces that mickr warned against. The apron would hide them from view. Frankly you probably wouldn't notice 4 of them under there anyway.

You could also run bolts through a stringer under the shelf, recess the holes, and plug them with matching Black Cherry from the dovetail bowtie wood. That might look neat too.

Nice job! Looks real good!
:wink::wink::wink:

 

[GaryMGg]

I'm thinking of running a stretcher on each long side of the table w/ angled dadoes cut on the inside of each such that one stretcher will join
both legs to prevent relative movement of the legs.

For looks, each stretcher would have it's ends angled back the same as the underside of the table -- opposing the angle of each leg -- and having an arched lower edge.
I'd attach the top to the stretchers using 3 buttons or screws -- the middle being fixed and each end one allowing for movement.

What'cha think?

The reason I won't mortise the legs into the bottom of the table top is I don't know that'll preventing racking if, for instance, someone fell and `caught' themself on the top end of the table with their weight pushing toward the middle.

I didn't do thru tenons with tusks on the base because the jig I built for my router used too much of the longest router bit I have and I choose not to do the mortise and tenons by hand. Maybe next time I'll galoot it.

 

[VisExp]

Gary, I like the design as it is. Clean and simple. However, my first thought when I saw it was the joint between the legs and the shelf would not be strong enough. I wonder if added a single stretcher below the shelf would improve the strength without taking away from the clean lines. You could do a through tenon with a wedge.

If the camphor is anything like some of the camphor turnings I've seen, the table top is going to look amazing. Camphor is a beautiful wood.

 

[gatornick]

It sounds like you aren't against the ideas of using screws. So a possible idea is a single stretcher under the shelf screwed from the outside in countersunk holes. Then you could make some plugs in a contrasting wood and add it as a design feature.

Whatever you choose. I like the design and the wood. Too bad it won't be ready for tomorrow's game. Let us see it when you're done.

 

[livertrans]

Do you have a pocket hole jig? I have built quite a few pieces of furniture for my home using this joinery and it makes for very sturdy and strong joints.

 

[GaryMGg]

Keith -- I like the single stretcher under the shelf suggestion. That area was punky soft and I used a rather large Naki-tie there and filled the area with epoxy.
It feels solid now so maybe that won't be an issue anymore.

Don't know what I was thinkin' -- probably waitin' for the coffee to kick in. Since the base is already glued together, the only way to insert a stretcher between the legs against the bottom of the shelf would be to use loose tenons OR to cut a slot from the floor up in each leg. In my mind, that's not worth it as it creates a new design problem.

I typically work to avoid metal fasteners in my work other than hinges and the like; I prefer traditional joinery. Using screws thru an apron for a table is typical though, especially if run thru buttons. In this case, a button into a stretcher would be silly.

I've been cutting scrap test pieces to see what looks best. More later,
G

Long, narrow (height) Stretchers with angled dadoes which half-lap the legs are barely visible and stabilize this thing like a brigde. I think I've got something I can live with.

Pics to follow....

 

[GaryMGg]

Gary, I like the design as it is. Clean and simple. ...

Me too. And, though I knew the base needed something structural, I held off 'til I could come up
with something to maintain the clean lines.
The table is done except for putting a finish on it; the cherry aprons will really darken up when I oil 'er up.
I tested 4 different styles before finalizing the design. Here's what I ended up doing.

First, I made a pair of short [height] aprons from black cherry cut with end bevels and
a bottom bevel to match the angle of the tabletop bevel.

The aprons are drilled for three screws.
The outer two are oversized to deal with the tabletop's anticipated movement.

Then, I cut a beveled rebate into the top of the legs.

The grain is insane, ain't it?!? :biggrin:

A little glue and some clamps:

I had to do some patchwork to make the spalted leg usable.
The middle lower portion was punky to the point of crumbling.
It's got a hand-cut, hard-maple Nakashima bowtie, epoxy, and TLC.

When I get the finish on the table, I'm confident that streak will blend in.

You've got to get low to see the aprons:

You can't tell from the photo but the apron length is sized so the bevel on the end of each apron,
which is the same angle as the tabletop bevel, forms an imaginary line which ends
at the tip of the outside bottom edge of the legs.

And, even though no one else will likely see them, you can see why I added the rebate
to the legs for the aprons:

I think the base with aprons in one plane maintains the original clean lines.

 

[mickr]

I've looked at your new "improvements" I don't see where you improved the shelf joint with the side boards..can I just not see it? If you glued that shelf to the legs, I hope with the expansion issue that the legs and shelf expand & contract at the same rate...sure looks pretty..when it's finished I bet we'd all like to see it..

 

[GaryMGg]

I've looked at your new "improvements" I don't see where you improved the shelf joint with the side boards...

Mick,
I wasn't concerned with the shelf to leg joint per se. I was concerned with the overall lack of structural integrity.
Adding the two aprons as shown creates the necessary strength.

 

[VisExp]

Don't know what I was thinkin' -- probably waitin' for the coffee to kick in. Since the base is already glued together, the only way to insert a stretcher between the legs against the bottom of the shelf would be to use loose tenons OR to cut a slot from the floor up in each leg. In my mind, that's not worth it as it creates a new design problem.

I didn't realize the legs and shelf were already glued. I can see now how it would be difficult to add a stretcher under the shelf.

I like your solution. It doesn't detract from the clean and simple lines of the table. I can see how the grooves in the apron that the legs fit in will add some strength to the table and prevent the legs from "splaying" out. I'm sure a stretcher under the shelf would have been stronger, but it sounds like you are satisfied with the outcome.

As long as it is capable of holding all the vital "supplies" to accompany the Gators game you're in business :biggrin:

Looking forward to seeing the pictures when you're done with the finish! Nice work Gary.