Cutting Segments. Table Saw or Band Saw?

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Jim Campbell

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I have finished a couple of segmented pens. They were composed of four 1/2"x1/2" squares glued into a 1" square blank, turned round for a 7/8" collect for drilling, cut, and rotated. Cutting the initial 1/2" square stock on the table saw was not a comfortable process. I would like to cut 1/4" x 1/4" square stock but need a better grounding in saws and jigs.

Thus the question; Is it preferred to cut segment stock on the table saw or band-saw? What is the preferred blade for the saw of your choice? What is the preferred jig?

Please feel free to send pictures.
 

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Nice pen . Now I am wondering if I want to go down this rabbit hole of segmenting :)

I did try a few a couple of months back and learned a lot. Especially about the scallops.

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I don't really buy special blades. My table say has a thin kerf Diablo 40 tooth combination blade. Kerf is .102. My bandsaw has a Timberwolf 3/16 blade, couldn't even tell the tpi, the kerf is approximately .040. I have many many jigs that I use. You can't be as precise without them.
 
jjjaworski said:
Nice pen . Now I am wondering if I want to go down this rabbit hole of segmenting :)

I did try a few a couple of months back and learned a lot. Especially about the scallops.

View attachment 297726
Click to expand...

I've said this before and it's very true, if it weren't for segmenting, I wouldn't still be making pens. The segmenting is what holds my interest.


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All the comments from Ken above are excellent. I'll only add... learn how to use what you have - SAFELY! Most saws will allow you to learn how to give you the precision you need. But, proper jigs are a must. I have used a Bosch contractor's table saw, a Rikon band saw, a Craftsman band saw, a Craftsman table saw, and a Byrnes Model Makers Table Saw for the same cuts.

You did say to add pictures, so...

And, the three photos are with segmented trim rings with many glue joints. Get used to failures as you learn to use your tools safely, be patient, note why you failed at times, make tweaks, refine your jigs (KenB259 is a master for this!), and have FUN!
 

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Jim, I made a segmenting saw from a circular saw some years ago when I lived overseas, and recently pulled it out and am making a few minor modifications to it. I bought the saw in Japan and had the full advantage of the metric system (I am basically bi-lingual when it comes to weights and distances) and purchased and have numerous 150mm (6 inch) blades that have kerfs of .9mm, 1mm, 1.2mm. So I can make small kerfs.

However, I recently learned that a few bandsaw blades are made without alternating teeth set (angles) (senior moment on the correct term) but the correct BS blades can make smooth cuts too - with the right setup and skill.

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There are a few commercial mini-saws that really excellent in assisting the making of segments too.
 
There is, at least was down here in OZ until very recently, a mob from Germany called "Proxon" who make very nice "hobby" tools for things like dolls houses and the like. Before the fire that wiped us out in 2017 I had a couple of their tools from back when I played with dolls houses and the like. None of their gear is cheap but if you think "Festool" but 1/4 scale you may get the idea. You could also consider one of the battery powered "drop saws" (you folks may call them "chop saws"?) you can get some really fine-toothed blades for them and with a couple of clamps and a stop-block they may do what you want. There is a little Ryobi that would work and I bought a 60 tooth blade for mine. The 45 degree stops are off a bit but 90 degree stop is good on mine.
Edit: I got the spelling wrong, it's Proxxon and their page is: https://www.proxxon.com/en/
I might just go back and drool a little.....
 
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Segmenting. The sky is the limit. Segmenting is used in turning far more than pens by the most talented people you would ever meet. I could never even carry the scraps that they drop for what they do. One of my all time idles is Malcolm Tibbetts . He is a master when it comes to segmenting and his tools are a Festool Kapex miter saw. But he also uses the table saw and has many jigs to work with each. Rarely does he use bandsaw because accuracy is limited even with the best of jigs because the blade is not as stout as a fixed blade. But his other tool that is important in his line of segmenting is a true disc sander with jigs to hold pieces in proper alignment.

I bring this up because they may work with larger segmented pieces at times than we do when making a small round pen blank but the ideas are basically the same and can be carried over. Just look up the name and see the beautiful work that he does. There are many more true turners that do things like he does.

But to address the OP questions, as mentioned bandsaw, tablesaw of any size, and also chop saw along with the lathe and router, can be used. Jigs are made to both safely cut small pieces and to be able to repeat the cuts with accuracy. Knowing your tools plays a big role and tuning the saws so they do what they were designed to do. Having jigs that have hold downs is important for both safety and again accuracy. Myself I love to use a tablesaw and will never use a chop saw. My thought here is I want to be able to see and control the blank or wood I am working with. I want to be able to see the entire cut all the way through. With a chop saw you are blinded when that blade is pulled down so it would not be my choice. As I said I do not make fine cuts on a bandsaw because no matter what you do the accuracy needs to be tuned after the cut. For some of the segmenting I have seen here such as celtic knots the cut is not that important when done for clean cutting. Just infill and it is good to go. A tablesaw will give you a cleaner cut. Now I have done many segmented blanks using my lathe and a router platform. When you get into this line more you too will find what works best for you because there are many ways to get the same results. I have to say one of the most important tools I use when working with small pieces is doublesided tape.

Tablesaw blades --- I use 1/8", mostly 3/32" and also 1/16"
Bandsaw I use mainly 3/16" and also metal cutting blades.

Jigs I brought this thread back to life the other day hoping others would contribute but seems not many segmenters on this site. but Ken started it and he shows some of his jigs. There are also articles in the library showing jigs for cutting blanks.
https://www.penturners.org/threads/shop-built-jigs.164721/
 
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Well, I did go back to Proxxon, then I went to the shed, found a section of Forest Oak that was anything but square, set the saw at 6mm and made some sawdust. I actually ended up with some stuff ranging from 5.5mm to 5.8mm and a bit over 300mm long which translates to about a foot long and a couple of cigarette papers less that 1/4". I worked out that you need a "zero clearance insert" on your saw if you want to do this without dramas. The little Ryobi drop saw has a 7.1/4" 60 tooth Diablo blade which leaves a really nice cut face but once again you need "zero clearance" fences otherwise those little bits you cut off end up somewhere...On the top of the cupboards, behind the mower, you get the idea. Anyway, I took a photo of the little bits I cut and the good part is, no blood loss!
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Hi Jim,

I just wanted to say thanks for asking your question. This was one of the more informative threads yet, Thank you everyone for sharing your experience and ideas. After turning pens for just over one year now (with only a few segmented pens mixed in) I decide this year to focus on expanding my segmenting knowledge. I have used both the band saw and table saw and like most I use sleds on both. I mainly use the table saw because it seems to be more accurate. I am going to start of with scallop pens and just finished making a jig for those (I got the design from Gabe Castro of Exoticwoodpen). The jig is set for 45 degree and 60 degree scallops.
 

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TDahl said:
Hi Jim,

I just wanted to say thanks for asking your question. This was one of the more informative threads yet, Thank you everyone for sharing your experience and ideas. After turning pens for just over one year now (with only a few segmented pens mixed in) I decide this year to focus on expanding my segmenting knowledge. I have used both the band saw and table saw and like most I use sleds on both. I mainly use the table saw because it seems to be more accurate. I am going to start of with scallop pens and just finished making a jig for those (I got the design from Gabe Castro of Exoticwoodpen). The jig is set for 45 degree and 60 degree scallops.
Click to expand...
You could very easily make Celtic knots with this same jig.


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