PennStateInd...

[sochart]

Hello everybody. First of all, I am asking your indulgence about my english (I'm a frenchie living in Canada).
I'd like to add my comment about the poor service I have experienced today.
Order placed 5 days ago, shipped today. Getting the tracking has been a nightmare in itself.
PSI charged 51$ to ship a 14lbs parcel via USPS which is the most expensive rate I have ever seen in my life. In the meantime I have ordered computer parts weighting 92lbs shipped from and to the same areas. Shipping was 39$.
PSI does not reply to emails. Phone customer service is a joke.
I have asked 15 times the lady to get the tracking.
She was just telling me "There are no tracking available".
"I have paid 51$ and there is no tracking, are you kidding me ?"
"No Sir, there is no tracking".
After 10 minutes, she hanged up the phone. WTF ?
I hope their products are correct.

 

[JohnGreco]

Hello everybody. First of all, I am asking your indulgence about my english (I'm a frenchie living in Canada).
I'd like to add my comment about the poor service I have experienced today.
Order placed 5 days ago, shipped today. Getting the tracking has been a nightmare in itself.
PSI charged 51$ to ship a 14lbs parcel via USPS which is the most expensive rate I have ever seen in my life. In the meantime I have ordered computer parts weighting 92lbs shipped from and to the same areas. Shipping was 39$.
PSI does not reply to emails. Phone customer service is a joke.
I have asked 15 times the lady to get the tracking.
She was just telling me "There are no tracking available".
"I have paid 51$ and there is no tracking, are you kidding me ?"
"No Sir, there is no tracking".
After 10 minutes, she hanged up the phone. WTF ?
I hope their products are correct.

I've shipped through USPS to Canadian customers of my own and can attest to the US Post Office not being able to track out-of-country shipments.

That is an insanely high shipping rate though.

 

[weasel1219]

I have been dealing with PSI for a couple of years and have not had any real issues that can't be worked out. I have gotten good customer support and the products have been good to excellant. The only problem I have is the long time for the order to come in, but that is something that can not be blamed on them...I live to far away....dang it.
Everyone is human and does not always have or are having a great day...At least we can to talk to some one in the USA and not some where else in the world..."ie: Tech Support for many companies"...

 

[Xander]

Late 2/14 (like around midnight here in AZ) I placed an order with PSI. It was shipped 2/15, less than 12 hours after ordered. Total wieght a little over 10 pounds, UPS $10.50 ground. It arrived 11:00am today (a holiday). A total of 5 days from placement of order to my door, from PA to AZ by ground. I doubt the truck could have made it any faster.

Oh, and I made my first pen today. First thing made on a lathe (or any woodworking) EVER. Came out real good.

 

[Woodlvr]

I will only say that when a company owner tells the customer that he is "wrong" when he did not hear the conversation is not a person or company that I would deal with. I would rather go without a product then give them my business. JMHO.

 

[JamesB]

My first experience with PSI was great. I asked in a email about the taper on one of their kits sold on Amazon to start turning, got no response on the email but someone called me to answer my question. I thought that was top notch customer service. Since then it's hit or miss with their shipping, one order took about 2 weeks to arrive and another took 3 days. I'm looking at other options for supplies now but I do appreciate 76Winger's pics of their quality. Something else to consider.

 

[Smitty37]

Hmmmmm

Price, quality, service. You can have any two, pick them.
WB

Actually you can have all three.....

 

[Smitty37]

Not necessarily

Hello everybody. First of all, I am asking your indulgence about my english (I'm a frenchie living in Canada).
I'd like to add my comment about the poor service I have experienced today.
Order placed 5 days ago, shipped today. Getting the tracking has been a nightmare in itself.
PSI charged 51$ to ship a 14lbs parcel via USPS which is the most expensive rate I have ever seen in my life. In the meantime I have ordered computer parts weighting 92lbs shipped from and to the same areas. Shipping was 39$.
PSI does not reply to emails. Phone customer service is a joke.
I have asked 15 times the lady to get the tracking.
She was just telling me "There are no tracking available".
"I have paid 51$ and there is no tracking, are you kidding me ?"
"No Sir, there is no tracking".
After 10 minutes, she hanged up the phone. WTF ?
I hope their products are correct.

I've shipped through USPS to Canadian customers of my own and can attest to the US Post Office not being able to track out-of-country shipments.

That is an insanely high shipping rate though.

14 pounds to Canada too large to fit in a large flat rate box shipped priority mail is $53.38 postage - so whether the rate is insanely high or not depends on the physical size.

 

[The_Foo]

I don't purchase from PSI anymore unless I absolutely can't find what I'm looking for anywhere else.

I'm the same way. There are a couple of vendors that sell PSI products. Woodturningz is one, and they can get just about anything you want from PSI even if it's not on the Woodturningz website (at least anything I have wanted so far). And their service & customer support are top notch.

I agree, Woodturningz is the first place I go when looking for pen kits. Great service and fast shipping. Highly recommend them!

 

[avbill]

I wrote a letter to Top management at PSI now over a year ago.. AND --NO ANSWER!

No answer They get no business from me!

 

[rjwolfe3]

I just had an awesome experience with them. I put it over in the Vendor Cheers forum if you would like to see it.

 

[Donovan's Corner]

Late 2/14 (like around midnight here in AZ) I placed an order with PSI. It was shipped 2/15, less than 12 hours after ordered. Total wieght a little over 10 pounds, UPS $10.50 ground. It arrived 11:00am today (a holiday). A total of 5 days from placement of order to my door, from PA to AZ by ground. I doubt the truck could have made it any faster.

Oh, and I made my first pen today. First thing made on a lathe (or any woodworking) EVER. Came out real good.

Congratulations on your first pen and your first good experience with PSI. When you are a little further along and you have a deadline try not to get your hopes up. I like their kits as do some of my regular customers, but if anyone else had the complete line I would change suppliers. I'll be checking out woodturningz tomorrow BTW.

 

[76winger]

Late 2/14 (like around midnight here in AZ) I placed an order with PSI. It was shipped 2/15, less than 12 hours after ordered. Total wieght a little over 10 pounds, UPS $10.50 ground. It arrived 11:00am today (a holiday). A total of 5 days from placement of order to my door, from PA to AZ by ground. I doubt the truck could have made it any faster.

Oh, and I made my first pen today. First thing made on a lathe (or any woodworking) EVER. Came out real good.

Congratulations on your first pen and your first good experience with PSI. When you are a little further along and you have a deadline try not to get your hopes up. I like their kits as do some of my regular customers, but if anyone else had the complete line I would change suppliers. I'll be checking out woodturningz tomorrow BTW.

I wish Woodturningz did have PSI's complete line as I could easily drive by them daily going to and from work. They do have some models but not all. Be sure to call them to find out if they have what you need, they're good people. They can order just about anything, but then that doesn't buy you any time when you consider the shipping to them and then their shipping to you.

 

[Donovan's Corner]

I just had an awesome experience with them. I put it over in the Vendor Cheers forum if you would like to see it.

PASS

 

[JC Turner]

I checked with my tech support guy Jerry who took this call who is a very sharp guy (but does speak with an accent) ... He specifically told you what our instruction sheet states (yes it IS published on the Web site) and both explained and referred you to these instructions ................
___________________________________________________________________
Loading the Applicator with Perfume
• Dip the applicator tip while in the pen, into the perfume bottle and hold it for one minute. This will soak up the perfume.
The white applicator tip will swell and stay in place when filled with liquid.
• Before refilling the pen, clean applicator tip by soaking it in household type alcohol.
______________________________________________________________________

You appear to be upset since your were either confused by these instructions or upset that we don't give a "handout" about this refilling process. We DO respond to requests of this type but apparently we've never had this request and consequently couldn't possibly anticipated a request like this (yes we DO respond to requests when we feel it would enhance our products). Normally the fellow selling the product will explain the process to the customer or publish his own instructions if necessary ... or the recipient is familiar with this type of product.

I'll sand by our tech, our instructions, and our company on this one and dispute this gentleman's representation of the event.
Ed Levy
VP and GM
Penn State Industries

Wow...speaks volumes as to why some people are unhappy with the customer service.

Instead of "I'm sorry you're having a problem...please call back so that we can help you more thoroughly." The response comes across as "you're an idiot and if you can't understand our stellar customer support you're on your own." While that may actually be what you think why would you risk alienating even one customer by posting such a response on a public site dedicated to your customers? There are A LOT of choices out there for product...in this economy I would want to get everyone I could.

Personally, while I love to get a great deal I'm willing to pay a premium for excellent service.

That said customer service is a sucky, thankless job and that's probably why there are so few really good customer service experiences out there.

 

[Harold E. Payne]

I have bought from Penn State and never had a problem that was their fault. once but it was my fault. they helped me with it. Thanks PSI.

Harold Anniston, Alabama

 

[edicehouse]

Reading around about PSI, I was hesitant to order from them. But saw some things they had that no one else did, and I determined I had to do them . Well the few orders I have made from them I have no complaints about them. The shipping was fast, my dealing with Customer support was great.

 

[opfoto]

I don't turn as much as I would like too, I am not a million dollar customer. I do use the PSI website for reference only. Ordered my first set of kits from them. But I have not and will not purchase from them again as I have found other suppliers that are happy to supply me with my needs no matter how small my orders are. I have purchased and will purchase from those that support this website. They truly know the definition of Customer Service.

 

[dexter0606]

Cheap quality, good quality, good customer service, bad customer service, friendly techs, rude techs, Quick shipping, slow shipping. Everyone has a little bit of all of this and no one is completely on the good side of the meter in every aspect, all of the time.

Your going to get a varied mix from of all of this from any supplier and none are completely invulnerable to all of this because in the end you're dealing with human beings and even good people screw up once in a while on something. The question to be asked is what do YOU do when YOU have problem with a supplier? Do YOU call and get the problem worked out satisfactorily or do YOU give up disgruntled and run off to complain to everyone about it?

I'm thinking about this in terms of a great little book I read last year called QBQ (Question Behind the Question) by John Miller. The premise of the book to encourage a line of thinking where, instead of thinking about what someone is going to do fix my problem, I think about what I can do to fix the problem or make it better.

I also think it's better to spread positive views about people and things rather than negative. Yeah I know there's a lot of negativity out there, but spreading negativity just makes me feel more negative and bitter. And when it comes down to it, I feel better not spouting off about the negative stuff and just spreading the positive experiences. The power of positive thinking makes you feel positive ya know!

I also fail understand how people can expect a company as it grows larger to keep responding as quickly and efficiently as it did when it was smaller. Sheer economies of scale are going to dictate that as a company grows larger and larger that it will become harder and harder for it to respond as well to small quantity orders that helped it grow larger to begin with. It's a sad fact that the costs to a large company grows considerably and they have to devise ways of keeping costs down, providing good quality and decent service that us little guys can't fully understand. It's really amazing most of the larger companies still do as great a job as they do!

Instead of my rambling on forever, let me pose an example from my own experience here. Below are four cigar pens I recently made and the back two I paid a little more for and waited an extra day or so for due to ordering them from PSI. And the front two are from one of the vendors that sell PSI pens (as well as non-PSI pens) but they don't indicate in their listings which are and which aren't from PSI, so I got a couple to try to see if saving a couple bucks would be good. I notice clearly that the clips are thicker on the front two and not finished nearly as well on the sides as the PSI pens. And the first one in the front even has a slightly wrinkled nib because it apparently has thinner metal and deformed in my press during assembly (which has never happened with any other pen I've assembled so far.


Now let me ask a question: Who do do think I'm going to buy next round of Cigar pen kits from?

I will give ya one hint - I'll always favor quality over speed.

Well put!!

 

[glycerine]

Holy resurected thread Batman!!

 

[dexter0606]

Holy resurected thread Batman!!

I know!!

 

[LL Woodworks]

To psilevy - I try understand you standing behind PSI people on this incident; but the truth of the matter is that PSI customer service on the whole is less than good and just plain incompetent at times. PSI may not be interested in this rating from customers, but they should be. I have bought from PSI for several years and most of the time there are no problems. But we don't need customer support when things go right. It is when things go array that PSI Customer support fails. I've had several issues where I simply gave up because of the frustration of dealing with PSI customer support. Wrong parts shipped, not once or twice but three times on the same issue. Perhaps that is the PSI philosophy; "Endure they will eventually give up". Give up I did and have - purchasing for PSI is a last resort to the tune of several thousand dollars a year on turning supplies.

 

[ALexG]

I never had any problem with PSI, my only suggestion would be for recurrent customers like myself from time to time they can give as a nice gesture a freebie, my last order was almost 1K and nothing, while ordering $250 from other vendors at least I got a couple of blanks for free+free shipping. I don't know sometimes you need to pamper your customers as an appreciation for their business... anyways is just what I do with my customers

 

[Joe S.]

I've never ordered from psi (except the free DVD on metal spinning), I have been ordering from Woodturningz since the beginning. Just recently I've been "sampling" vendors like Bear Tooth Woods, and I should be getting a package from Exotic Blanks today. I keep thinking about trying PSI for the bolt action pens but, judging by the comments, there is a 50% chance of it being an issue. And that seems a little high to me.
Just my $0.02

 

[edicehouse]

Joe S. the thing to remember the ones that have a problem are always more vocal than the ones that have no complaints.

 

[TellicoTurning]

I've been dealing with PSI since I started turning, over 10 years... never had a single problem with any of their service... my thoughts are that if you go looking for trouble, you will find it or it will find you... positive thoughts beget positive results.

 

[BKelley]

I buy from PSI on occiasion, not a lot, but from time to time. I have only had one problem with them and that was rectified with one phone call. They have always been courteous, and shipped well. I would rate them with an "A".

Ben

 

[wolftat]

Since the original post was about instruction issues for perfume pens, I figured I would post a solution to this issue. I sell a lot of perfume pens and since people can't remember everything they hear at a show, it helps to include this card with their purchase. The vendors do not include instructions but at an additional charge I'm sure they would be happy to. I personally prefer to make my own. here is what I include with every perfume pen sold for the customers ease of use.



They were relatively cheap to have a thousand made up and have my regular business card on the other side, they have helped me sell more pens as these are very popular around here.

As far as people wanting to change the perfume in the pen, I tell them it can't be done and sell them another pen for it. Works in both our favors that way.

 

[dexter0606]

Since the original post was about instruction issues for perfume pens, I figured I would post a solution to this issue. I sell a lot of perfume pens and since people can't remember everything they hear at a show, it helps to include this card with their purchase. The vendors do not include instructions but at an additional charge I'm sure they would be happy to. I personally prefer to make my own. here is what I include with every perfume pen sold for the customers ease of use.



They were relatively cheap to have a thousand made up and have my regular business card on the other side, they have helped me sell more pens as these are very popular around here.

As far as people wanting to change the perfume in the pen, I tell them it can't be done and sell them another pen for it. Works in both our favors that way.

For a buck ninety five you can get 4 replacement tips so it's easily changed. On the few that I sold I just included an extra tip

 

[wolftat]

Since the original post was about instruction issues for perfume pens, I figured I would post a solution to this issue. I sell a lot of perfume pens and since people can't remember everything they hear at a show, it helps to include this card with their purchase. The vendors do not include instructions but at an additional charge I'm sure they would be happy to. I personally prefer to make my own. here is what I include with every perfume pen sold for the customers ease of use.



They were relatively cheap to have a thousand made up and have my regular business card on the other side, they have helped me sell more pens as these are very popular around here.

As far as people wanting to change the perfume in the pen, I tell them it can't be done and sell them another pen for it. Works in both our favors that way.

For a buck ninety five you can get 4 replacement tips so it's easily changed. On the few that I sold I just included an extra tip

I also give extra tips with the pens, but they hold perfume all the way up not just in the tips, any different perfume will just be a mix of what was in there before. If you want to sell one pen for all, I'm okay with that, I would rather sell many pens...Just my opinion.

 

[Joe S.]

Joe S. the thing to remember the ones that have a problem are always more vocal than the ones that have no complaints.

Good point, I didn't think of that. But this is the first time I've heard of a retail store. I might try to stop by there some time.

 

[raar25]

Wow what a thread. It is unfortunate Mr. Levy has stayed silent, but I guess I understand why. To sum it all up most people including me have had customer service issues with PSI and I too have never received return e-mails from PSI. Their shipping is also hit or miss. Some days I get it in 5 days and some days it doesnt leave their place for 5 days. I have ordered thousands of dollars from them in the last 1.5 years since I started this little hobby/business and wish they were not usually the lowest cost for many of the items they sell. Since part of the equation is profit, cost does play into it. But the differences are so close the recent change they seem to have made getting rid of the $5 coupon for reviews now adds $5 to every order and in some cases that is as much as 20% (not insignificant) considering shipping costs. I am looking at all of the other venders including buying direct from China to keep cost down.

But at the end of the day PSI needs to remember this forum is populated with the most dense collection of his customers and he needs to answer to his customers or lose the business.

Also I would also second the comment, I never have a bad exerience or slow shipping from Ernie at Bear Tooth Woods.

Oh and to the comment you cant expect a large company to have as good customer service as a small one, bull ! My real job is working for a multi-billion $$ company and my customers expect faster and more responsive service because they pay so much for our products and we respond accordingly.

The customer may not always be right but we are never wrong and we do go away!

 

[penhead]

wow..this is an older thread...hmm, just remembering that of all the thousands of dollars i have spent since this thread, that I have 'not' ordered from PSI again..oh well...

...on another note, after PSI owner's reply, i was able to finally search and find my hard copy of what use to be on the PSI website of the correct way of removing the perfume orginally placed in the perf pen, and replacing it with another/different smelling perfume..

...and not everyone wants to purchase a different perf pen for every perfume...

...just my thoughts, and I am happy for those of you who have never experienced negative issues with PSI support...

Well, I have been away from the computer for several days participating in a show for several days and then recovering and turning items to replace some of the inventory sold. I had almost forgotten about this thread until I realized that I needed to put in an order for replacing kits that were sold and building even more inventory for the holiday season.

I must say, with all respect, that I really am not sure how to respond to your post and I almost just allowed it to fade away into obscurity...however, since you have stated in your post that I was confused, and have inferred the lack of intelligence on my part, I feel the need to not defend myself, but rather...to show the very exact point of my original post.

First, you are correct. The tech support person DID explain how to fill the perfume pen, and yes, he did state the instructions were on the website. Not only did I agree with him on that statement, but also chided in the fact that I have that information on the instructions that come with every kit.

I see also from your post in response to mine, that you have spoken to your (sharp) tech person and he has informed you of what information he provided...and I find it very admirable on your part that you choose to stand by your employee.

HOWEVER, if that had been the question of how to fill the perf pen..then all would have been fine, and you are correct that I would feel like an idiot.

BUT...AFTER I explained SEVERAL times that was NOT the information I was looking for, your (sharp) tech person chose to hang up the phone while I was still speaking..!!

The question was 'not' how to 'fill' the perf pen with perfume.

**The question was: that the customer has filled the perfume pen with one type of perfume, and now wishes to change the type of perfume to a different brand/smell. What is the procedure for that..?..ie, the customer has filled the pen with 'stinky perfume #1' and now wishes to remove that perfume, and fill the perf pen with 'skunk smell #2'..??

I am not sure how to explain that statement more clearly. I did try explaining that question several different ways (until I was hung up on). And, that information DID use to be on available on your website, I simply could not find it, which is why I called for your support.

And now here is the leadership of the company belittling me, the customer, without bothering to contact or find out what the issue really was...ie, customer support.

I personally believe that speaks loads.

I checked with my tech support guy Jerry who took this call who is a very sharp guy (but does speak with an accent) ... He specifically told you what our instruction sheet states (yes it IS published on the Web site) and both explained and referred you to these instructions ................
___________________________________________________________________
Loading the Applicator with Perfume
• Dip the applicator tip while in the pen, into the perfume bottle and hold it for one minute. This will soak up the perfume.
The white applicator tip will swell and stay in place when filled with liquid.
• Before refilling the pen, clean applicator tip by soaking it in household type alcohol.
______________________________________________________________________

You appear to be upset since your were either confused by these instructions or upset that we don't give a "handout" about this refilling process. We DO respond to requests of this type but apparently we've never had this request and consequently couldn't possibly anticipated a request like this (yes we DO respond to requests when we feel it would enhance our products). Normally the fellow selling the product will explain the process to the customer or publish his own instructions if necessary ... or the recipient is familiar with this type of product.

I'll sand by our tech, our instructions, and our company on this one and dispute this gentleman's representation of the event.
Ed Levy
VP and GM
Penn State Industries

 

[Jgrden]

The moderators erased my last comment about PSI's service in an order placed 6/22 and delivered 7/6. Moderators said my comments were classified as a "complaint, so you are on your own.
I think their products are reliable but service is questionable.
John

 

[glycerine]

Wow what a thread. It is unfortunate Mr. Levy has stayed silent, but I guess I understand why. To sum it all up most people including me have had customer service issues with PSI and I too have never received return e-mails from PSI. Their shipping is also hit or miss. Some days I get it in 5 days and some days it doesnt leave their place for 5 days. I have ordered thousands of dollars from them in the last 1.5 years since I started this little hobby/business and wish they were not usually the lowest cost for many of the items they sell. Since part of the equation is profit, cost does play into it. But the differences are so close the recent change they seem to have made getting rid of the $5 coupon for reviews now adds $5 to every order and in some cases that is as much as 20% (not insignificant) considering shipping costs. I am looking at all of the other venders including buying direct from China to keep cost down.

But at the end of the day PSI needs to remember this forum is populated with the most dense collection of his customers and he needs to answer to his customers or lose the business.

Also I would also second the comment, I never have a bad exerience or slow shipping from Ernie at Bear Tooth Woods.

Oh and to the comment you cant expect a large company to have as good customer service as a small one, bull ! My real job is working for a multi-billion $$ company and my customers expect faster and more responsive service because they pay so much for our products and we respond accordingly.

The customer may not always be right but we are never wrong and we do go away!

The original post is almost a year old and Mr. Levy DID respond the very same day.

 

[penhead]

True..Mr.Levy 'DID' reply, and same day...

however, was totally inaccurate as to what the question and/or customer request/issue really was. Instead of checking/verifying with the customer as to what the problem was, and possibly could be resolved..Mr.Levy chose to belittle the customer over an issue he was totally inaccurate on understanding.

There was no reply from Mr.Levy after that.

Why not just let this thread die and go away...there is no fixing 'any' customer support if it doesn't want to be fixed...if it does get fixed, then there should be no complaints. I solved my own issue, not by complaining..but taking my money elsewhere.

Wow what a thread. It is unfortunate Mr. Levy has stayed silent, but I guess I understand why. To sum it all up most people including me have had customer service issues with PSI and I too have never received return e-mails from PSI. Their shipping is also hit or miss. Some days I get it in 5 days and some days it doesnt leave their place for 5 days. I have ordered thousands of dollars from them in the last 1.5 years since I started this little hobby/business and wish they were not usually the lowest cost for many of the items they sell. Since part of the equation is profit, cost does play into it. But the differences are so close the recent change they seem to have made getting rid of the $5 coupon for reviews now adds $5 to every order and in some cases that is as much as 20% (not insignificant) considering shipping costs. I am looking at all of the other venders including buying direct from China to keep cost down.

But at the end of the day PSI needs to remember this forum is populated with the most dense collection of his customers and he needs to answer to his customers or lose the business.

Also I would also second the comment, I never have a bad exerience or slow shipping from Ernie at Bear Tooth Woods.

Oh and to the comment you cant expect a large company to have as good customer service as a small one, bull ! My real job is working for a multi-billion $$ company and my customers expect faster and more responsive service because they pay so much for our products and we respond accordingly.

The customer may not always be right but we are never wrong and we do go away!

The original post is almost a year old and Mr. Levy DID respond the very same day.

 

[bon]

Hello everybody. First of all, I am asking your indulgence about my english (I'm a frenchie living in Canada).
I'd like to add my comment about the poor service I have experienced today.
Order placed 5 days ago, shipped today. Getting the tracking has been a nightmare in itself.
PSI charged 51$ to ship a 14lbs parcel via USPS which is the most expensive rate I have ever seen in my life. In the meantime I have ordered computer parts weighting 92lbs shipped from and to the same areas. Shipping was 39$.
PSI does not reply to emails. Phone customer service is a joke.
I have asked 15 times the lady to get the tracking.
She was just telling me "There are no tracking available".
"I have paid 51$ and there is no tracking, are you kidding me ?"
"No Sir, there is no tracking".
After 10 minutes, she hanged up the phone. WTF ?
I hope their products are correct.

totally agreed!!!! Now I only purchase from them unless I absolutely can't find anywhere else to buy the kits.

 

[Leatherman1998]

PSI I like there prices but they could sell cheaper like Woodturningzs. The prices may be good but the shipping is horrible they do flat rate shipping that is fine but why is it so expensive. I am about to put an order into Woodturningzs and the shipping is $5.00 for 3-6 day shipping .PSI shipping for $5.00 took a little over 3 weeks. I don't get it.