Arizona Silhouette Customer Service

[karlkuehn]

Listen, I know there's some controversy out there about Bill's 'people skills', but lemme tell ya - I've ordered $50 worth of stuff, and I've ordered $1400 worth of stuff (just now), called him both times, and received the same service on both occasions. Short and to the point, and off the phone again, with me being able to sleep comfortably, knowing that everything's gonna be okay. I think he said about fourteen words to me in all, and they were all perfect. Nice thing is, I don't have to spend the next half hour airing smoke outta my as..uh...nether region. []

I'm fully confident that I won't even have to check the kits when the box gets here from this group buy. Bill's the man, I don't care what you say!

After managing all the orders, building the spreadsheet, and doing the whole group buy unsung hero dance, I realized this morning that maybe the insurance wouldn't be a bad idea on an order that size. So I called him, and lo and behold, he'd paid the insurance out of his own pocket. So, those of you that hopped on board my little group buy, we all owe Bill about $1.50 each.

It's that kind of foresight and customer care that keeps me heading back there. Between Bill and Ernie, it makes me wonder if Berea requires a dealer to ace some sort of customer service I.Q. test before they get to be distributors.

I won't neglect to count the insurance into future orders, but for Bill to get my back on this over-(or under)-sight of mine, I mean, really, it's just amazing.

Next person that posts something negative about Arizona Silhouette will probably get an earful from me, and I'm pretty good at giving earfuls. [}]

Thank you Bill!

 

[Reb]

Everything I'v order has been right and talk about fast shipping. Wow And I'm a newbe

 

[ones]

I just received my first order and got extra goodies. Fast and accurate.

 

[maxwell_smart007]

It's too bad he doesn't ship up here, as he sound like he runs a pretty tight ship! Glad the group buy went well!

 

[IPD_Mrs]

Bill is very good at what he does. As for being short and to the point there are a couple of considerations that folks not in the mail order business need to understand.

If you are calling an 800 number it costs the vendor much more than what you would pay if you call them direct. The time that a vendor spends on the phone being chatty is keeping that line busy and preventing a possible order from coming in.

All of the orders I have plased with Bill has been via his web site. It is a pain in the rear as his shopping cart is antiquated, but it works none the less. Due to Bill's reputaion on here I have never worried about getting a flawless transaction. If I have any special instructions on my order I put it in the note section. He has never responded to the notes but has ALWAYS followed through. The big difference between Bill and CSUSA is that Bill does not have the errors like they do.

Karl good job in pointing out the quality of service. It is folks like Bill that have earned and deserve our support.

Mike

 

[ed4copies]

The last order I received from AS had a notice inside, telling me to CHECK everything (including the pen kits) and report any missing parts within 6 days.

This may be fair, but if you are ordering a lot of kits make sure you take the time to do it -- kits HAVE been known to have missing parts.

Bill DOES ALWAYS include some FREE "eye candy", so you CAN consider that the "in case" payback. All depends on your point of view.

Just a FWIW!!

 

[Geo in Winnipeg]

I used to order from him quite often before he stopped shipping outside the US. He always provided excellent service and whenever I phoned he was great helping with any questions I had.

 

[toolcrazy]

Mike,
AS uses Zen Cart, but he has it intergrated his old site into the program. Which, in my opinion, makes it hard to navigate. But, if you know what you are looking for, the search function works great.

I have never delt with AS on the phone, but I have oredered plenty off the site. I generally get a goodie and the orders have been perfect, every time. Can't ask for better than that.

 

[Jarheaded]

I like the way Bill deals with people. He is blunt and to the point, with no BS. Reminds me of my father.

 

[rlharding]

This homage to Bill seems to appear almost every month. Two things come to mind for me.
1) I wonder if Bill has instigated the thread.
2) I wonder if buyers like the freebies more than they like Bill.

I'm a straight talker, I welcome it in others. I find Bill not to be a straight talker but rather down right rude to the point of being offensive.

Several IAP members have mentioned experiencing this behaviour and also saying they will not shop with AS again.

Having a 1-800 # is a business tool, it is not inherent that one has to be short, sharp, and blunt.

Karl my friend, getting an earful from you is not what I desire, neither do I wish to have my opinion of Bill as being treated as any less than yours and other posters.

 

[karlkuehn]

Near's I can tell, Bill has no idea that I posted this. As far as freebies go, the last group buy I did, there wasn't a freebie in sight, so that's not my motivation either.

Basically, what I really appreciate is the fact that he didn't waste a bunch of time calling me on the phone to tell me I should've insured the shipment, he just took care of it himself. Had I not thought about it, I probably would never have known that he'd done it.

I just like his mentality of going the extra mile for the customers whether they know it or not. It's like the way he packs his boxes. I swear he must use a gallon of glue making sure that they stay sealed up and safe.

I value your opinion as well as my own Ruth, you know that! I'm just sick of seeing the "I don't do business with AS" statements that get made without an explanation.

As far as Bill's abrupt attitude any rejection or hurt that I've ever received from him has been far outweighed by the warm fuzzy feeling that I got after talking to him today and knowing that he just took care of my needs, even without me knowing that they were needs.

I really sorta freaked out when I thought about what would happen to my business account if a $1400 box of kits got ran over by a truck and I was held responsible for the contents. Bill just took care of me, and it was nice to be able to relax about the shipment.

There's your earful! Who else wants a little!? [] hehe

 

[GBusardo]

Seems to me everyone has their favorites. I have never talked to Bill, but whatever I have ordered came as I ordered and came quickly. Some of his pricing is low, some high but his freebies are nice. I get some personalized notes and freebies from other vendors also. My biggest pet peeve is that I cannot seem to buy all I need from one vendor. For example, I need 150 dollars worth of supplies, I need to go to three vendors.

 

[hunter-27]

Originally posted by GBusardo

Seems to me everyone has their favorites. I have never talked to Bill, but whatever I have ordered came as I ordered and came quickly. Some of his pricing is low, some high but his freebies are nice. I get some personalized notes and freebies from other vendors also. My biggest pet peeve is that I cannot seem to buy all I need from one vendor. For example, I need 150 dollars worth of supplies, I need to go to three vendors.

Very true, I was glad to find AS as a source however for most of what I "normally" need.
As far as Bill----Awesome businessman IMO. Opinions are what they are and as frequently shows up on IAP I quote: "If you don't like what I say or do, don't look or listen. You always have an option." end quote.

 

[RonSchmitt]

Originally posted by GBusardo

My biggest pet peeve is that I cannot seem to buy all I need from one vendor. For example, I need 150 dollars worth of supplies, I need to go to three vendors.

AMEN!!! If I could get the Jr Gent II at A S or BTW, I would be in heaven

 

[pipeyeti]

I wasn't going to weigh in here but, what the heck. My first experience with AS was kind of strange and put me off a little I got the ruff and gruff Bill on the phone. I decided what the heck and went ahead and ordered online although I would prefer to order over the phone. The order went fine. A few days later placed another. Fine again plus freebies, cool. Placed a rather large order for kits somewhere around 50 or more. They all showed. Did I inventory every single part? No, my mistake. Found about 2 weeks later that one of the kits was missing the nib but had 2 tops in it instead ( carbera kit). I placed another order about $500 and also called Bill to explain the situation told him what had happened and was told that I had five days to report it and that since it was outside that time he would not take care of it. Like I said I wanted things to work so I continued with my 500 dollar order and just kind of hoped he would go ahead and make it right. When the order showed everything I ordered was there but not the missing part.There was also about 6 or 7 freebie blanks. I thought what the heck why send free wood and not just send me the part I needed? I called Bill and spoke with him about it. His response was that he adds freebies for every order over 50 bucks. Ok. I asked why not just send me another kit it would have been less money than the wood at his cost. He said that he only gives 5 days because there is alot of dishonesty in this buisness and that he would go broke if he fixed everyones mistakes. Implying that I was lieing about the missing part. I explained that I would not be placing anymore orders with him because of this, his responce was that I should shop with CSUSA because in his words "they have deeper pockets". All I wanted was what I had paid for. How many of you inventory every piece of every kit you order? If you are ordering 50 to 100 kits at a time as I do that sure is a pain. I'll do my shopping with suppliers who trust me and stand behind thier products. Not only do I make and sell pens and tampers but I run a bike shop as my full time real job. If I treated my customers this way I would be out of buisness. I refuse to do buisness with people who do not provide me with reasonable customer service. Now before anyone gives me an earfull these were my experiences and I did try to work it out with Bill before ranting here.

 

[kenwc]

I can't say enough good about AZ and Bill. I bet he'd actually be fun to hang around with. I wrote him once and told him of some predrilled bottle stoppers I had gotten that the hole was too large for his bottle stopper chuck. I had written him just to tell him this was happening because I had already glued hardwood dowels in place and re-drilled. He wrote me back and more or less thanked me for using my head and not really complaining about it. Also he posted my testimonial on his Norseman Drill Bits on his websire so I'm a little bias.[8D]

 

[Ron in Drums PA]

Originally posted by rlharding

I'm a straight talker, I welcome it in others. I find Bill not to be a straight talker but rather down right rude to the point of being offensive.

Several IAP members have mentioned experiencing this behaviour and also saying they will not shop with AS again

Me for one. I'd sooner quit turning.

 

[hunter-27]

Originally posted by pipeyeti

I wasn't going to weigh in here but, what the heck. My first experience with AS was kind of strange and put me off a little I got the ruff and gruff Bill on the phone. I decided what the heck and went ahead and ordered online although I would prefer to order over the phone. the order went fine. a few days later placed another. fine again plus freebies, cool. Placed a rather large order for kits somewhere around 50 or more. They all showed. Did I inventory every single part? No, my mistake. found about 2 weeks later one of the kits was missing the nib but had 2 tops in it instead ( carbera kit). I placed another order about $500 and also called Bill to explain the situation told him what had happened and was told that I had five days to report it and that since it was outside that time he would not take care of it. Like I said I wanted things to work so I continued with my 500 dollar order and just kind of hoped he would go ahead and make it right. When the order showed everything I ordered was there but not the missing part.There was also about 6 or 7 blanks freebies. I thought what the heck why send free wood and not just send me the part I needed? I called Bill and spoke with him about it His response was that he adds freebies for every order over 50 bucks. Ok. I asked why not just send me another kit it would have been less money than the wood at his cost. He said that he only gives 5 day because there is alot of dishonesty in this buisness and that he would go broke if he fixed everyones mistakes Implying that I was lieing about the missing part). I explained that I would not be doing anymore orders with him because of this his responce was that I should shop with CSUSA because in his words "they have deeper pockets". All I wanted was what I had paid for. How many of you inventory every piece of every kit you order? If you are ordering 50 to 100 kits at a time as I do that sure is a pain. I'll do my shopping with suppliers who trust me and stand behind thier products. Not only do I make and sell pens and tampers but I run a bike shop as my full time real job. If I treated my customers this way I would be out of buisness. I refuse to do buisness with people who do not provide me with reasonable customer service. Now before anyone gives me an earfull these were my experiences and I did try to work it out with Bill before ranting here.

I'll risk it and bite on this. I guess I'll start with yes, Bill could have done as you asked but then again, you could have done as he asked, and checked your order. So far it is an even trade as I see it. Next on the list I guess is you mentioned what "freebies" he sent were worth more than your missing kit(or part) so I guess I'd hush up and order another kit. Besides I'm guessing if you had taken your freebies and smiled a little while posting a request on here, Someone(myself included) probably has an extra nib they would send you for free. The lesson here as I see it is you CHOSE to place the orders. Bill POSTED his policy governing missing parts on the website. You did not comply with his store policy, I see no reason for you to be upset with him. Yes, Bill could have done things differently as well but neither of you DID do it differently so I see it as an even wash of sorts. Now that I've said my piece, I'll go back to being my normally mild mannered self.

 

[pipeyeti]

Originally posted by hunter-27

Originally posted by pipeyeti

I wasn't going to weigh in here but, what the heck. My first experience with AS was kind of strange and put me off a little I got the ruff and gruff Bill on the phone. I decided what the heck and went ahead and ordered online although I would prefer to order over the phone. the order went fine. a few days later placed another. fine again plus freebies, cool. Placed a rather large order for kits somewhere around 50 or more. They all showed. Did I inventory every single part? No, my mistake. found about 2 weeks later one of the kits was missing the nib but had 2 tops in it instead ( carbera kit). I placed another order about $500 and also called Bill to explain the situation told him what had happened and was told that I had five days to report it and that since it was outside that time he would not take care of it. Like I said I wanted things to work so I continued with my 500 dollar order and just kind of hoped he would go ahead and make it right. When the order showed everything I ordered was there but not the missing part.There was also about 6 or 7 blanks freebies. I thought what the heck why send free wood and not just send me the part I needed? I called Bill and spoke with him about it His response was that he adds freebies for every order over 50 bucks. Ok. I asked why not just send me another kit it would have been less money than the wood at his cost. He said that he only gives 5 day because there is alot of dishonesty in this buisness and that he would go broke if he fixed everyones mistakes Implying that I was lieing about the missing part). I explained that I would not be doing anymore orders with him because of this his responce was that I should shop with CSUSA because in his words "they have deeper pockets". All I wanted was what I had paid for. How many of you inventory every piece of every kit you order? If you are ordering 50 to 100 kits at a time as I do that sure is a pain. I'll do my shopping with suppliers who trust me and stand behind thier products. Not only do I make and sell pens and tampers but I run a bike shop as my full time real job. If I treated my customers this way I would be out of buisness. I refuse to do buisness with people who do not provide me with reasonable customer service. Now before anyone gives me an earfull these were my experiences and I did try to work it out with Bill before ranting here.

I'll risk it and bite on this. I guess I'll start with yes, Bill could have done as you asked but then again, you could have done as he asked, and checked your order. So far it is an even trade as I see it. Next on the list I guess is you mentioned what "freebies" he sent were worth more than your missing kit(or part) so I guess I'd hush up and order another kit. Besides I'm guessing if you had taken your freebies and smiled a little while posting a request on here, Someone(myself included) probably has an extra nib they would send you for free. The lesson here as I see it is you CHOSE to place the orders. Bill POSTED his policy governing missing parts on the website. You did not comply with his store policy, I see no reason for you to be upset with him. Yes, Bill could have done things differently as well but neither of you DID do it differently so I see it as an even wash of sorts. Now that I've said my piece, I'll go back to being my normally mild mannered self.

I don't want to get into a pissing match there is no point but , Like I said my mistake I didn't inventory every single part. I don't make wood pens so why smile at the free wood? Why should I come on here and ask someone to send me what I had already paid for. thanks for you input but I'll place it in the round file. Also I didn't start the post or recommend anyone else not do buisness with Bill I posted my expeirience that all.Take it for what its worth your happy with you service, good for you.

 

[loglugger]

Originally posted by Ron in Drums PA

Originally posted by rlharding

I'm a straight talker, I welcome it in others. I find Bill not to be a straight talker but rather down right rude to the point of being offensive.

Several IAP members have mentioned experiencing this behaviour and also saying they will not shop with AS again

Me for one. I'd sooner quit turning.

There is no room for very rude in any business, I won't be back. I had order from him and was happy, sent 2 of my brother in laws to him and he was rude to both of then at different times and didn't say anything to me about it. I called anouther order and got a ear full of rude and that was enough. Then I heard from the outher 2, they will not be back.
Bob

 

[Russianwolf]

I was going to post something else, but it could have been considered as rude to some of the other posts.

I'll just say that I've ordered from bill several times and have nothign but good things to say. I like his business as he has much better plating options than most places.

 

[rjwolfe3]

We ordered for the first time from AS and at the same time another order from CSUSA. Our order came super quick from AS and even though there was a problem with our bank, Bill was willing to wait an extra day and rebill our checkcard without any complaints. We did check our order carefully and did find one sheet missing from the MicroMesh that we ordered which Bill sent to us just as quick even though the stuff is packaged for him by the manufacturer. All in all we thought it was great service and will order again.
On the other hand, our order from CSUSA is still screwed up. We only ordered two things but because one was sanding sealer they had to ship UPS ground. At the time of our order they had everything in stock. After 10 days when our order finally showed up, the sanding sealer was not in there because it was back ordered. There was no phone call, email, or letter saying they were out of stock. Their website said it was in stock. Now we have paid $7.98 in shipping for one little bushing kit and waited 10 days for it. The only reason we didn't order it from AS is because he doesn't handle the kit we needed the bushing kit for, which is fine. Long story short, we would much rather deal with a smaller company like AS, rather then a larger company like CSUSA or even PSI (don't get us started on them, still waiting for stuff we ordered three months ago).
That's our story and we're sticking to it!

(PS for those that don't like the shipping policy of AS not shipping overseas, isn't there a way to work something out with another member here in the States. We're not sure if this legal but just our two cents.)

 

[Russianwolf]

Originally posted by rjwolfe3


(PS for those that don't like the shipping policy of AS not shipping overseas, isn't there a way to work something out with another member here in the States. We're not sure if this legal but just our two cents.)

I'll put an offer out there on this. If anyone overseas wants to order from AS, I'll send you my address. You place your order and use my shipping info. When the box gets to me, I'll slap a label on it to you and drop it back at the post. You pay me the actual shipping to you and we're good. I won't open the box unless you request me to check your order.

 

[Jarheaded]

Instead of complaining here about his mannerisms, why don't you just ask him why he is talking to you the way he is. maybe you called while he was just finishing up a bowl that he had been working on for 6 hours and it blew up as he was putting on the finish, I know if you called me at that point, I would probably be a little tense. He runs an internet website store, he does this because he is a turner also and wants to do his work without getting bothered by phone calls. he will answer a question or two, but he doesn't want to explain to everyone that is trying to turn their first slimline how a skew works. Just look at some of the answers to questions that are asked here. How many times do you see something about a dead horse? Do you think that every question that he is asked is the first time he has answered it. I may be way off, but a lot of people that seem to complain about his manners are the same people that don't want to answer a question that is coming from a newbie because they have heard it too many times. Like I said, I like the way he doesn't waste my time by putting me on hold or transferring me to another rep that has no clue either. Personally, I am done dealing with CSUSA because the last 3 orders from them were missing whole kits or just sent the wrong kit or even worse, when I called and placed the order I was not told that they stopped carrying the product and had to find that out when my order arrived minus the kits. I have never had that from Bill, so I will continue to deal with him. If he is rude with me, I have no problem telling him to speak nicer to me instead of just taking it, but I have never had that problem. I guess some of us see rudeness in different levels, I don't want to be sweet talked, I just want to buy some materials. I am assuming that those of you that find him rude have never called the IRS 800 number to ask a question.

 

[thetalbott4]

What I believe Bill was intending by saying that CSU has "deep pockets" is that the money they make off of kit sales is secondary to what they do on tools, lathes, wood, ect, but is Bills primary income. It's unfortunate that enough people try to slip one by that he has to impose the 5 day rule. Kinda like pre-paying at the gas pump. They arent saying everyone is a thief, but that there are enough out there that they have to inconvience everyone.

No doubt, Bill is not a "people person", but that doesnt matter to me much as I do all of my ordering online. I also check every order as soon as I get it, but I do that with ALL orders or purchases that I make. It's an old habit I picked up as a teenager working in a receiving department. For me, Bills abrasive personality doesnt overshadow the excellent products that he carries.

 

[hunter-27]

Originally posted by Jarheaded

Instead of complaining here about his mannerisms, why don't you just ask him why he is talking to you the way he is. maybe you called while he was just finishing up a bowl that he had been working on for 6 hours and it blew up as he was putting on the finish, I know if you called me at that point, I would probably be a little tense. He runs an internet website store, he does this because he is a turner also and wants to do his work without getting bothered by phone calls. he will answer a question or two, but he doesn't want to explain to everyone that is trying to turn their first slimline how a skew works. Just look at some of the answers to questions that are asked here. How many times do you see something about a dead horse? Do you think that every question that he is asked is the first time he has answered it. I may be way off, but a lot of people that seem to complain about his manners are the same people that don't want to answer a question that is coming from a newbie because they have heard it too many times. Like I said, I like the way he doesn't waste my time by putting me on hold or transferring me to another rep that has no clue either. Personally, I am done dealing with CSUSA because the last 3 orders from them were missing whole kits or just sent the wrong kit or even worse, when I called and placed the order I was not told that they stopped carrying the product and had to find that out when my order arrived minus the kits. I have never had that from Bill, so I will continue to deal with him. If he is rude with me, I have no problem telling him to speak nicer to me instead of just taking it, but I have never had that problem. I guess some of us see rudeness in different levels, I don't want to be sweet talked, I just want to buy some materials. I am assuming that those of you that find him rude have never called the IRS 800 number to ask a question.

That should do it.

 

[rlharding]

Johnnie, Is this what is called a 'slippery slope' opinion, you start off with a bad premise and it just goes down hill from there?

I have asked him why he was getting so worked up, more abuse was all that gained.

Lets not get off track and make this thread about newbie’s questions, & the IRS.

 

[its_virgil]

I'm going out on a limb with this suggestion, but I've been out on lots of limbs. Why not just bookmark this thread. It repeats itself several times a year if not more often. Bookmark it and when one wants to badmouth Bill just go read this thread. I'm tired of this thread's subject being restarted over and over. Nothing new has been said. Let's put this to bed.
Do a good turn daily!
Don

 

[Woodlvr]

I am wondering why this post was started anyway.[:0]

 

[Texatdurango]

Originally posted by Woodlvr

I am wondering why this post was started anyway.[:0]

Because it's that time again![]

 

[Tanner]

I first met Bill on his DVD's. My first thought was, this guy is funny! He was the first to teach me this craft. I then met him at a wood turning seminar behind his wares. We shook hands and talked a bit. What a great guy!!! I have ordered many, many times from him. Every order has free blanks in it. I know it's 190 miles from Anthem, AZ to Yuma, AZ, but I could swear he has someone drive my order over the next day. Seriously, it's sitting at my door when I get home. The mailman leaves my bigger boxes in the large locked mail slot. He's kind of like Santa Claus.

 

[karlkuehn]

Originally posted by Woodlvr

I am wondering why this post was started anyway.[:0]

Uhhhh, because I wanted to say something nice about one of our vendors and thank him for a great transaction?

Didn't realize we weren't supposed to do that. I think this has generated so much negative response that I wish I'd never have posted it. What a shame. [V]

 

[loglugger]

Sorry Karl, not your fault.
Bob

 

[B727phixer]

Karl,
Your point is a good one! Its nice to have as Johnnie says "someone covering your six"
Next time I call AS up I dare old Bil to be rude! I'll clobber him with kindness! Were always quick to complain but rarely do we compliment!

 

[DCBluesman]

There is a certain level of rudeness which is a fairly recent addition to this site. When a fellow member makes a positive post, it is extremely rude to then inject your vitriolic comments into the thread. Karl shared a positive experience. If you want to comment on Karl's experience, fine. If you want to post your bile, start your own thread. This is getting ridiculous.

 

[woody0207]

I've ordered several times from Bill. His shipping is fast, the packaging great, and the occasional freebie even gets dropped in the box.

There was one time a small problem occurred with an order. He took care of it promptly. He is clear and to the point with his communications. I don't have a problem with that.

I will continue to support his family-run business. Thank you BB.

 

[wudnhed]

I wasn't going to post but what the heck! I like ol' Bill[}] Altho I have not ordered from him recently, I have done business with him several times, each time was perfect. LOML and I even went to visit Bill at his operation in Yuma a couple years ago. He took us in his house, showed us his personal turning work, took us around to see his turning set up and his business set up. He was VERY personable to us and shared his knowledge of pen turning with us freely.

I'm not positive but I felt he had been in the military because that seems to be the way he runs his business, straight and to the point with rules to be followed. Not a bad approach, IMHO especially if your a small family run business trying to "turn" a profit, employ a few people and keep things running smoothly.

Everyone has different takes on personalities and how people present themselves. I feel if Bill tried to "get to know" alot of his clients, he would be on the phone for hours talking niceities (sp?) instead of getting orders taken care of so quickly.
JMHO

 

[ed4copies]

To call these comments "vitriolic" is a bit much.

Arizona Silhouette is a business. People have given dollars to that business, they have a right to relate THEIR experiences. For the newer members, this can be educational. Isn't that one of the purposes of this site?

Unfortunately, when you have a SMALL business, like Arizona Silhouette (and my copier business, BTW), the owner BECOMES the business. The owner's attitude will establish WHAT people think of the business. As I walk around town, I am known to one and all for what I have said and done over the past 35 years - I am not always proud of that, but "That's the way it is!".

This community is Bill's version of my Racine. You've worked to establish a reputation, now you have to LIVE with it, or try to improve it. Neither is easy.

FWIW

 

[DCBluesman]

My selection of the word vitriolic is with the meaning being "caustic" and I stand by my statement. Here are a couple of out-takes from the thread. I am not singling out the individuals, because I don’t have a problem with either of them or with them expressing opinions and describing experiences. I do, however, think a separate thread would be the more appropriate place for these comments.

Karl my friend, getting an earful from you is not what I desire

In my (never) humble opinion, that is a caustic and sarcastic comment. I understand if others view it differently.

Implying that I was lieing about the missing part

Again, I feel this is a caustic comment. Bill did not imply any such thing. Bill simply stated his company policy and the reason behind it.

Now, regardless of whether or not these comments are vitriolic or bilious, they are inappropriate in the context of the thread. Karl had a good experience. What the hell does it matter who has had a negative experience? Does it relate to Karl’s post. I think not.

Got a gripe? Start your own thread in Casual Conversation. That’s what it’s there for.

As for Karl’s thread, not one person can argue that Karl feels he was treated well.

 

[ed4copies]

Let me start by telling everyone, LOU is a very good friend - we have met in person, spent a few days together and grown to know each other pretty well.

So I take this opportunity to advise him that he is WRONG!!! (With anyone else, I would have phrased it more diplomatically!)

Karl expressed HIS opinion of a company. From there on, this is REPORTING. It's been so long since we saw BALANCED reporting on TV or in a newspaper, we have forgotten what it looks like. We CAN be FORCEFUL (vitriolic is hyperbole, but I'll go along, for friendship sake) in our statements. We MAY even insert a little OPINION in our relating of the facts. But, what we see here is REPORTING!!!

And, I still contend, it helps people who have not done a lot of business make more informed choices.

Now, Mr. Metcalf, I'll shut up if you will - we can retire to private e-mail and "duke it out" (Lou writes a GREAT e-mail!!)