What did I do wrong?

Signed-In Members Don't See This Ad
Status
Not open for further replies.

sandking

Member
Joined
Oct 16, 2006
Messages
217
Location
Hauppauge, NY.
So I setup my HF pressure pot with both pressure and vacuum options.

I tried to put some clear resin from Michael's over a medallion I glued on the top of a bottle stopper. It was about 1/8" thick. After mixing and pouring on top of my stopper I placed it in the pot and pulled vacuum upto -20 for twenty minutes. When I released it it looked horrible. There were bubbles and spider webbing all over the place.

I also mixed some resin and did the same thing without putting it in the pot and it seemed to setup perfect without any bubbles.

Does this mean I wasted money on setting up the pressure pot????
 
Signed-In Members Don't See This Ad

Fred

Member
Joined
Feb 18, 2007
Messages
3,557
Location
N.E. Atlanta, Georgia U.S.A.
Nope, the pot is a wonderful addition to your tool shed.

Look-up YoYospin here in the member list and address this question to him. I believe he is one of the premier casting guru's here on the IAP Forum and I bey he might recognize your problem

My guess is that you may have added to much catalyst and it over-reacted. Just my guess without seeing the "horrible results." [:p]
 

its_virgil

Member
Joined
Jan 1, 2004
Messages
8,124
Location
Wichita Falls, TX, USA.
I use vacuum and pressure to cast my snake blanks. I mix the resin and catalyst and put 16 ounces in a 2 qt jar, place it in the paint tank and turn on the vacuum pump for about 8 minutes. I then remove it, pour into the mold with the snake skins a pressureize the tank to abour 40 psi. I use 3 drops per ounce and leave it in the mold i=under pressure for about 4 hours and often I just leave it overtnight since I cast mostly in the evening. If you used more catalyst than I do, then 20 minutes and it could be into the jell stage whic means it jelled while is was vigorously bubbling under vacuum and will look the way you described. The amount of catalyst used is a function of how thick the casting is. Thicker = more heat = less catalyst. I've watched the resin bubble while under vacuum and it bubbles quite vigorously as the air escapaes. The size of the containter needs to be much larger than the volume of the resin.

Often excellent results can be had with using neither vacuum nor pressure, or just pressure, or just vacuum. Two of us experimented for almost a year with getting rid of bubbles and the process I explain in my snake skin tutorial is what we settled on. We reported our findings of what was working for us and the use of pressure tanks has exploded.
I'll bet HF has sold more in the last two years than they have in the last 10. My local HF only have 1 or two and now I see a stack of 8 or 10 on the shelf. What works in my shop may or may not work for someone else. Heck, it doesn't even work for me 100% of the time.

I'll say this before Curtis gets to: You won't have these problems if you use alumilite![:D][B)]

And I'll say that some experimenting should be done before expecting perfect results on the first try. Read all you can, ask others questions and ....I have two or three 5 gallon cans full of failures... But my success rate is much better than it was the way I was doing it.

From my experience, some things embedded in polyester resin tend to give more problems with bubbles than others. A coin has no air inside that can escape when the resin heats. Other stuff like snakeskin, cloth, and other porous material does. And the heat causes the air to expand and escape getting trapped between the embedded object and the jelled resin. This trapped air can present itself as bubbles or as a slivery lining covering the embedded object or as a crud covering the object and they all look terrible.

Do a good turn daily!
Don


Originally posted by sandking
<br />So I setup my HF pressure pot with both pressure and vacuum options.

I tried to put some clear resin from Michael's over a medallion I glued on the top of a bottle stopper. It was about 1/8" thick. After mixing and pouring on top of my stopper I placed it in the pot and pulled vacuum upto -20 for twenty minutes. When I released it it looked horrible. There were bubbles and spider webbing all over the place.

I also mixed some resin and did the same thing without putting it in the pot and it seemed to setup perfect without any bubbles.

Does this mean I wasted money on setting up the pressure pot????
 

sandking

Member
Joined
Oct 16, 2006
Messages
217
Location
Hauppauge, NY.
Well this morning the resin seemed cured. Unfortunately it seems like there is a layer of air between the medallion and resin in a couple of places. I'll take a picture tonight.
 

dbriski

Member
Joined
Oct 19, 2006
Messages
359
Location
Garden Grove, CA, USA.
Let me preface with I have never done any casting but I speak from what I have read here.

You said you pulled a vacuum and let it set up, but didn't apply any pressure. When you apply vaccum it makes the bubbles bigger and your hoping most will get big enough to float out of the resin before it sets up. My guess is some of the bubbles weren't able to escape. I think you need to pull vaccum to get as much of the air out as you can then pressurize until cured to compress what air is left to the smallest possible form (non visible). I think this is the part you missed to get rid of the rest of the bubbles.
 

BRobbins629

Passed Away Dec 28, 2021
In Memoriam
Joined
Mar 8, 2006
Messages
4,037
Location
Richmond, VA, USA.
To me, the vucuum serves one purpose and that is to degas or remove air from the resin. There are other methods such as ultrasonics, but vacuum will work. This is best done before catalyst is added, giving the air time to get out of solution. Pressure applied during the curing process has the opposite effect - it keeps the remaing air in solution, the same as it does in a bottle of soda and should allow bubble free casts.
 

sandking

Member
Joined
Oct 16, 2006
Messages
217
Location
Hauppauge, NY.
Ok, I decided to forget about the vacuum and pressure pot since the resin I needed was less than 1/4" thick. I ended up just pouring it in and with 4 samples so far no air bubbles.
 

arioux

Member
Joined
Jan 20, 2005
Messages
1,734
Location
Terrebonne, Quebec, Canada.
Hi,

Just one question here, did you pour the resin over a wood bottle stopper?. If so, the vacuum would have pulled air and moisture from the wood that may have react with your resin.


Alfred
 

sandking

Member
Joined
Oct 16, 2006
Messages
217
Location
Hauppauge, NY.
Yes I did Alfred. I think I learned my lesson. First off I should have left the resin and catalyst in the mixing cup and vacuumed that, then poured it and set it with pressure. I think that is the correct way to do it.
 

Fangar

Member
Joined
Apr 27, 2005
Messages
1,837
Location
Wilton, CA, USA.
I find that pressure seems to work best with the casting resin. Don (Its Virgil) is a true pro and gets great results.

If using the Alumilite stuff (Mesquiteman uses this for his cactus blanks) then a pressure pot is a must. I tried it and man was it a nice thought. No Smell and just mix equal weights. I could not get it to set for anything though. Depends very much on your climate. In speaking with Mike (From Alumilite) he said that my issue was likely the small amount I was using at a time for the stoppers.

That being said, in speaking with another pro of the PR (YOYOSPIN), he does not use a pressure or vacuum pot.

Sounds like you might have gotten an air bubble trapped that tried to escape.

Good luck,

Fangar
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom