Special orders zapping the fun out of shop time

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J

Justturnin

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When I first started turning I did it for me, heck for the longest time my wife only thought I made pens but was not sure. It was fun and relaxing, I turned what I wanted to when I wanted to and if you wanted to buy something I made you can. Since about Christmas everything I have turned has been a special request. Don't get me wrong, I like the commissions and such but it seems to be taking the fun an turning it into work. I am not really branching out so I figure once my friends and families orders are complete things will go back to normal.

Does anybody agree :good: or am I a baby that needs to quit whining:crying:?

Didn't make it a poll because I fear the results:biggrin:
 
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Chris,
The same thing happened to me when I flew model airplanes. I start to work for a Magazine called R/C Report. My hobbie became a job and it wasn't fun anymore. I haven't flown in over three years now. I don't work for the magazine anymore and am starting to miss flying. Maybe one day I'll have time.
That's why I really admire the people who can make a good living at making pens. When I feel that the orders and requests are becoming too much, I'll finish those but won't take any new ones for a couple of months.
 
I do find commision work is usually just making more of turnings I have done before. Commisions provide the biggest chunk of my pen turning revenues, but it is not very interesting turning work. A mixed blessing.
I try and mix in some "play" turning time to keep things interesting and to help hone my turning skills.
Occasionally I get a request for something I have not tried before. I ususaly quote these projects very low because I know the work will be fun. I end up working for pennies an hour on these projects, but the fun factor is priceless.
 
You aren't alone Chris - I have been a wood worker for many years. At one time I loved making furniture for other people and family members. I made dressers, entertainment centers, sleigh beds and night stands, all because I enjoyed the challenge of design and implementation. When people discovered what I did they started asking could I make this or that and my hobby all of a sudden had deadlines and picky customers. So I quit making furniture and started turning. I'm sure I'll channel back to furniture at some point but now I enjoy making pens for me, learning new techniques, like "kit-less" pens. I still get tremendous satisfaction when I see something that I've made being used and being part of someone's life, doesn't matter if it is a nice sleigh bed or a slim line pen. Hobbies are suppose to be fun! Let it be fun!
 
You are 100% correct. That's why I do not do special. The special things I make are available to anyone. This is my hobby and I need to have fun, not pressure. In another life I learned how to bowl for money and it was no fun at all. Just another job! So when someone asks me to make something for them, I am willing to find someone for them.:tongue:
 
Commision work/special orders often take us out of comfort zone but they also provide a challenge to both our talent and patience. Some of the nicest pens I have made resulted from a challenge from cuustomers. While customers can be trying they are the reason we are selling.
 
I agree withy you completely. Whenever I have a special order, especially with a tight schedule, it drains the fun right out of it. I'm with you. I turn for fun and enjoy surprizing friends and relatives with special gifts, but if I sell a few here and there, that's fine as it offsets the cost of my hobby.

Jim Smith
 
Chris - There is nothing worse than working on a piece of material that you do not really care for and while you are turning look across the room to see that awesome block of wood you are dying to dig into. The only way to make it any better is charge a little more for consignments to make you look forward to it or stop doing them. That is one of the things I don't like about most pen in the hats. I hate being told what I have to make.
 
gbpens said:
Commision work/special orders often take us out of comfort zone but they also provide a challenge to both our talent and patience. Some of the nicest pens I have made resulted from a challenge from cuustomers. While customers can be trying they are the reason we are selling.
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I wish I could agree with you but it is not my case. What they are ordering is keeping me in the box. I look at my scroll saw and all the neat materials I have been building up that I sit and wonder what can I do with these, then I have to sit them down and turn a set of 20 trim lines using Black Ash Burl. I want to cast something, chop it up and put it back together all out of whack, stabilize, dye segment, scallop........

The IAP continues to challenge me and I want to Stand up and answer the challenge......right after I finish this Cutlery set:biggrin:
 
Chris,

I've been down that road and now I turn what I want to turn. I have found that custom orders are not much fun for me because it's not my idea or bent.

I always remember the story a potter friend told me about a craft fair she was vending at. The potential customer was admiring a piece and asked if she had it in blue. When told that everthing for sale was on display the person commented " I've been to craft shows before, can you take a look in the back? "

I just tell folks i'm not interested in a special order or I have too much on my plate right now.
 
I got caught up in accepting special orders and found out it took the fun out of my hobby. Now I am back to doing what I want when I want. If someone likes something I have done I will sell it, or give it. Now I am back to having fun with my hobby and not being in business.
 
Fun or Mon

If you aren't having fun and you don't need the money, don't take the commissions. I decided early on not to turn for money. I'll give them away and occasionally sell one if a person asks but the turning is my way of having a little relaxation.

Same with building cottage furniture, I started building it to save me some money and because it looked like fun, Now I have a lot of it in my house and people often ask if I could make a piece for them. I just tell them "I don't do that." and give them the name and location of a store that sells it. In fact, I'm going to buy a piece myself, because I don't want to make it, I could but it's just too big a piece for me to deal with comfortably in my shop.
 
Chris, The way I see it many a fine turner who started out just to have some fun in front of the lathe was sucked in by the dark side. I hate using the word greedy or the phrase "hungry for money" but the fact remains that almost every person on this forum was raised thinking that seeking the almighty dollar was why we were placed on this earth. I was fortunate to have a good career and save a few dollars so I really don't need any extra money and yet I still got sucked into making more pens just to see. I do enjoy making pens and trying new and different things but I do have a choice, I can spend 10 hours in my shop making pens or 10 hours on the lake fishing, it doesn't matter which. I think when you get to the point where you can choose what you will do on any given day without worrying about the consequences, you have made it and will be happier!
 
I don't think I'm hungry for money but I do like making this a "no-loss" hobby and if I make a few bucks to buy more hobby stuff, that's even better. I haven't made that many pens, but I'm feeling some pressure too with people asking for pens all of a sudden and some by graduation time. I made a pen for a coworker from a bullet she gave me, then another coworker gave me two bullets (that I messed up terribly, so Sylvanite offered to help fix my FUBAR casings), I got another request for a stone pen (don't think that's going to happen), my wife wants 5 before the teens graduate, coworkers want 4 more...etc. So instead of doing what I want to do: clean the shop, make something else, experiment with segmenting and diff. matl. I am struggling to finish those pens, and be a good husband and father and spend time with the family, so there's pressure and even more so because I'm learning and not 100% confident in my skills yet, (esp after the bullet fiasco, I don't know if I want to do anymore of those)
 
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I started turning pens a couple of weeks before Christmas last year and already I'm getting worn out from turning "specialty" pens. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy doing for others, but it's time to do some turning for my self and my wife. I only have a few more pens promised and then I plan to catch up on my own. :wink:
 
JamesB said:
I don't think I'm hungry for money but I do like making this a "no-loss" hobby and if I make a few bucks to buy more hobby stuff, that's even better. I haven't made that many pens, but I'm feeling some pressure too with people asking for pens all of a sudden and some by graduation time. I made a pen for a coworker from a bullet she gave me, then another coworker gave me two bullets (that I messed up terribly, so Sylvanite offered to help fix my FUBAR casings), I got another request for a stone pen (don't think that's going to happen), my wife wants 5 before the teens graduate, coworkers want 4 more...etc. So instead of doing what I want to do: clean the shop, make something else, experiment with segmenting and diff. matl. I am struggling to finish those pens, and be a good husband and father and spend time with the family, so there's pressure and even more so because I'm learning and not 100% confident in my skills yet, (esp after the bullet fiasco, I don't know if I want to do anymore of those)
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Yep.... the dark side is sucking you in too :wink: Do like the drug posters suggest, just say no! I'm not hungry for money either, I'm just CHEAP! When I see something on sale with $14 shipping I figure I might as well order some more stuff then I feel better about the shipping charge. next thing you know I have lots of stuff then feel compelled to make more pens and the cycle continues, the dark side force is tricky!:cool:
 
I'm not sure it's money

Texatdurango said:
Chris, The way I see it many a fine turner who started out just to have some fun in front of the lathe was sucked in by the dark side. I hate using the word greedy or the phrase "hungry for money" but the fact remains that almost every person on this forum was raised thinking that seeking the almighty dollar was why we were placed on this earth. I was fortunate to have a good career and save a few dollars so I really don't need any extra money and yet I still got sucked into making more pens just to see. I do enjoy making pens and trying new and different things but I do have a choice, I can spend 10 hours in my shop making pens or 10 hours on the lake fishing, it doesn't matter which. I think when you get to the point where you can choose what you will do on any given day without worrying about the consequences, you have made it and will be happier!
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I think you're right about what happens but I don't think money is the reason. Let me use myself for an example. I retired from my 'day' job at 54 - way too young to be put out to pasture, even though my retirement income and my spouses income was enough for us to live in a pretty decent manner.
So - I got a real estate sales license (actually two of them one in NY and one in PA and sold real estate. While doing that I found that I could buy and fix mobil homes and sell them at a profit...so I added that. Eventually I got a real estate brokers license and opened my own office. Which I had for about 4 years. Now I never made a great deal of money in the real estate business...but I did have something to do every day - something I had to do, just like for 32 years I had to go to my job.

We then decided to move to Delaware so I closed the real estate office sold all of the mobil homes I had in process and we moved. Within 6 months I started an online business buying and selling coins. I changed products and venues but I'm still at it. It gives me a reason to get out of bed every morning, and stay out from in front of the boob tube most of the day. There's always something to do. I think I'd do it even if I made no money.
 
Smitty37;1 390008 said:
... It gives me a reason to get out of bed every morning, and stay out from in front of the boob tube most of the day. There's always something to do. I think I'd do it even if I made no money.
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Guess we're more alike than I thought Smitty. I rarely watch TV and thoroughly enjoy my time in the shop which is almost every day.

I guess the point I was trying to convey to Chris was that if you don't want to get sucked into making pens when you would rather be doing something else then just say NO more often BUT.... that is where the ole money thing comes in and we've been taught since childhood...... make more money, never turn down a buck, he with the most money wins, money brings happiness, etc, etc.

It's easy to tell the wife, I'm going to take a break from pens and do some little projects around the house but it gets harder when you get a call from someone who saw you at a show and asks if you could make three bulb fillers using different materials and that price is no object! Then I'm looking at either turning down $900 or making an end table...... which could really wait another few days! That's the dark side grabbing me so I know what Chris is up against!:wink:
 
Texatdurango said:
Smitty37;1 390008 said:
... It gives me a reason to get out of bed every morning, and stay out from in front of the boob tube most of the day. There's always something to do. I think I'd do it even if I made no money.
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Guess we're more alike than I thought Smitty. I rarely watch TV and thoroughly enjoy my time in the shop which is almost every day.

I guess the point I was trying to convey to Chris was that if you don't want to get sucked into making pens when you would rather be doing something else then just say NO more often BUT.... that is where the ole money thing comes in and we've been taught since childhood...... make more money, never turn down a buck, he with the most money wins, money brings happiness, etc, etc.

It's easy to tell the wife, I'm going to take a break from pens and do some little projects around the house but it gets harder when you get a call from someone who saw you at a show and asks if you could make three bulb fillers using different materials and that price is no object! Then I'm looking at either turning down $900 or making an end table...... which could really wait another few days! That's the dark side grabbing me so I know what Chris is up against!:wink:
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I agree that we've been constantly reminded to think money is the be all, end all of our existance. I often wonder though, if we don't sometimes use money as an excuse - and it's really our ego. I have often been tempted to make something for money because I'm flattered that someone could look at my work and want me to make something like it for them and pay me for doing it.

Actually I came from a pretty poor family, my dad was a house painter and that was usually May - September work in our part of the world. He could, hang paper and do inside painting as well but usually wouldn't because he didn't like to. We always had food on the table and the rent got paid and the tythe at church was taken care of...but there were not a whole lot of "extras". But, there was rarely much debt either, we lived within our means...that rubbed off on me so money was never a big issue we lived on what we had coming in -- still do. I suppose that's why I think in my case at least the temptation is more ego than money.
 
Those Michaelangelou and Leonard deVichi guys took on commissions, listened to what was requested, and then did what they wanted, no reason it should not work for you.
 
Texatdurango said:
.. It's easy to tell the wife, I'm going to take a break from pens and do some little projects around the house but it gets harder when you get a call from someone who saw you at a show and asks if you could make three bulb fillers using different materials and that price is no object! Then I'm looking at either turning down $900 or making an end table...... which could really wait another few days! That's the dark side grabbing me so I know what Chris is up against!:wink:
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I don't even know what bulb fillers are but if 3 are $900 I'll take a week of vacation and come and learn from you how to do it! :biggrin: Oh, that must be greed. The dark side?
 
Well, Chris, if you want to be the head cook at the Waffle House, you can't just fry the bacon, you've got to crack a few eggs and grate some hash browns.

If you only want to cook the bacon, because that's what you like to do, don't expect a check from the Waffle House.

:)
 
I've seen it in everything I've done through my life. When I was an auto mechanic, everyone wanted me to work on their cars (for little to nothing) or at least to come by for free advice or borrow tools. When I changed careers and got into computers, everyone wanted to talk about computers and needed some (free, after all they're friend or family) help on something they couldn't figure out. And what everyone thinks will only take a few minutes usually costs you your entire day! Funny how that works...

I haven't seen it quite so much with pen turning yet, but I think part of it is because I'm telling them up front what I sell them for, then they're quick to comment "Well I can get a free one at the bank" or "a whole pack at WalMart for couple bucks" so I let them go get their cheapies and freebies. They didn't appreciate what I did in the other venues for them and as stated by the O.P. it's just not as fun when you're doing something your not into. Plus this leaves me open to give a really nice gift at Christmas, for a birthday, or other special occasion. :wink:

Now this isn't to say I'm only valuing the money or anything like that. But getting a decent fee for what you do has at least a couple of benefits that is in your favor:

  1. It controls how many of those requests you get that keep you from making what you really want to make. (if you still have too many custom requests, then maybe bumping up your prices will help bring the numbers down within reason so you can still get to the fun stuff).
  2. And the money enables you to get more materials so you can make more! Hopefully of what you want to be making!

But you have to find that balance of what "work" you do to be able to do what you enjoy. And if you're lucky enough to enjoy it all, you've reached that plateau where, as Zig Ziglar (or one of the other popular speakers, I forget) has said (and Dave Ramsey regularly quotes): "If you enjoy what you do, you'll never work a day in your life".
 
Justturnin said:
Maybe thats my problem. Doing these for free or at cost.....
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Well DUH...... keep doing that and you'll have a constant supply of new best friends!:biggrin:

When I started turning I gave away 100% of my pens, did for several months BUT... it was at my discretion, once people started asking me to make them one, I started charging!
 
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