eastbay
Member
just curious about pentracyl stabilization. has anyone used. Please some opions. Thanks josh
pentracyl
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Dario
Member
As I undestood it, pentacryl will help prevent cracking/checking. A different type of stabilization compared to what pen blanks are usually treated. Normaly it is impregnated with some type of hardener coupled with pressure and/or vacuum when done commercially.
Fred
Member
Ditto to Mr. Dario's remarks. Most here have experienced a bit of a problem when "trying" to apply a finish to woods that have been treated with Pentacryl. It is apparent the the chemicals used in Pentacryl are not well suited for many finishes at all.
A question, just what are you trying to accomplish by using Pentacryl?
Many here will probably agree with my opinion and advise against using it. There is a GREAT difference in true stabilization processes when compared to Pentacryl. IMHO there is so much difference that I would easily say they are completely different and the use of the word "stabilized" is very misleading. Pentacryl is recommended for preventing the cracking caused by rapid drying of fresh cut GREEN WOOD.
True stabilization of wood makes the wood impervious to just about everything, i.e. oil, water, dirt, etc. Acrylic stabilization impregnates the entire cell structure of the wood with the acrylic resin through and through. Pentacryl impregnates the wood as well, but causes so many problems that I refuse to allow it in my shop.
If you were to hold two pieces of wood in which one was commercially stabilized, and the other treated with Pentacryl, you would instantly see, feel, and smell the difference. I think a better descriptive word to use for wood with Pentacryl would be "treated" and definitely not "stabilized" which denotes, to me at least, that an acrylic resin has been used.
In a few words - I do not like Pentacryl. There is no comparison in the end product of the two processes as they have completely different end results.
GO ACRYLIC STABILIZATION and avoid all the Pentacryl pitfalls. Pentacryl has is place, but not in my place! [
]
A question, just what are you trying to accomplish by using Pentacryl?
Many here will probably agree with my opinion and advise against using it. There is a GREAT difference in true stabilization processes when compared to Pentacryl. IMHO there is so much difference that I would easily say they are completely different and the use of the word "stabilized" is very misleading. Pentacryl is recommended for preventing the cracking caused by rapid drying of fresh cut GREEN WOOD.
True stabilization of wood makes the wood impervious to just about everything, i.e. oil, water, dirt, etc. Acrylic stabilization impregnates the entire cell structure of the wood with the acrylic resin through and through. Pentacryl impregnates the wood as well, but causes so many problems that I refuse to allow it in my shop.
If you were to hold two pieces of wood in which one was commercially stabilized, and the other treated with Pentacryl, you would instantly see, feel, and smell the difference. I think a better descriptive word to use for wood with Pentacryl would be "treated" and definitely not "stabilized" which denotes, to me at least, that an acrylic resin has been used.
In a few words - I do not like Pentacryl. There is no comparison in the end product of the two processes as they have completely different end results.
GO ACRYLIC STABILIZATION and avoid all the Pentacryl pitfalls. Pentacryl has is place, but not in my place! [
]eastbay
Member
What is the name of a acrylic stabilizer that is easily purchased and readily avaliable. cheers
wdcav1952
Activities Manager Emeritus
Josh, unfortunately, you might have better luck trying to get Coca Cola to share secrets with Pepsico!
Commercial grade stabilization methods and materials are kept rather secret. Try a search using the search function here on the site, and you will get some ideas for home stabilization.
Commercial grade stabilization methods and materials are kept rather secret. Try a search using the search function here on the site, and you will get some ideas for home stabilization.
The traditional professional stabilizers are EMA (ethyl methacrylate), MMA (methyl methacrylate) and PMMA (polymethyl methacrylate). Here are some sources. http://www.ides.com/generics/MM/MM_suppliers.htm
Fred
Member
Those good folks that do the professional stabilization WILL NOT ever discuss their trade secrets as that would undermine their money making business. Like "Cav" says above, you would be better off getting Coca-Cola to share their trade secrets with Pepsi or anyone else for that matter!
Having been previously involved with the running of several successful ad campaigns for Coca-Cola I can tell all that their trade secrets are so closely guarded that it is impossible to determine their contents.
To do their method of stabilization would require the spending of $100,000 dollars or so to put together the proper equipment, to obtain the proper chemicals, time, and knowledge, and sit back and 'hope' that the process would render the same results. These folks have a very close and tight network of professionals and none of them are talking.
Do a search here on the IAP Forum for "stabilization" and read each and every article and reply. Eventually you will begin to understand that this business of acrylic stabilization is complicated to say the least. Home based services are quite possibly out of the reach of the majority of us. Besides, I had much rather spend my time turning and let the professionals do the hard and dirty work.
Also, go to Google.com and do a search on "acrylic stabilization processes" ... read everything that even hints as to how it is done.
Do another Google.com search for "luthiers" and meander through the information for those that do their own in-house stabilization. The information is there, you just have to read through all the descriptive "stuff" to learn.
My one complaint in this topic is the way many continue to say, "I stabilized my wood using Pentacryl!" or words to that effect. I for one turned do not think that Pentacryl treated wood is stabilized in any way, shape, or form when compaired to woods that have been professionally stabilized.
IMHO, Pentacryl = "Treated" against cracking of green wood, and Acrylic Stabilization = "Stabilized" against far more problems. Just read all the search findings you get here and you will soon realize this has been talked about for many hours.
Having been previously involved with the running of several successful ad campaigns for Coca-Cola I can tell all that their trade secrets are so closely guarded that it is impossible to determine their contents.
To do their method of stabilization would require the spending of $100,000 dollars or so to put together the proper equipment, to obtain the proper chemicals, time, and knowledge, and sit back and 'hope' that the process would render the same results. These folks have a very close and tight network of professionals and none of them are talking.
Do a search here on the IAP Forum for "stabilization" and read each and every article and reply. Eventually you will begin to understand that this business of acrylic stabilization is complicated to say the least. Home based services are quite possibly out of the reach of the majority of us. Besides, I had much rather spend my time turning and let the professionals do the hard and dirty work.
Also, go to Google.com and do a search on "acrylic stabilization processes" ... read everything that even hints as to how it is done.
Do another Google.com search for "luthiers" and meander through the information for those that do their own in-house stabilization. The information is there, you just have to read through all the descriptive "stuff" to learn.
My one complaint in this topic is the way many continue to say, "I stabilized my wood using Pentacryl!" or words to that effect. I for one turned do not think that Pentacryl treated wood is stabilized in any way, shape, or form when compaired to woods that have been professionally stabilized.
IMHO, Pentacryl = "Treated" against cracking of green wood, and Acrylic Stabilization = "Stabilized" against far more problems. Just read all the search findings you get here and you will soon realize this has been talked about for many hours.
eastbay
Member
Thanks to all for the info. Cheers Josh
eastbay
Member
I purchased some prentracy and used it in some very green claro burl. Once the pentracyl seemed dry I wax the end grain to slow the process and waited another month. I heard of a tip that if you apply some acetone rite before the finish is applied there will be no problems and I tried 3 finished and they all took. The finishes were hut crystal coat, master gel clear finish, mylands wax. I also tried the finished with out the acetone for a cleaner and 2 would not take.
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