King Canada 1218 VS Lathe - Any information?

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aldjmc

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I have been searching everywhere for reviews on the King Canada 1218 this lathe, but have come up with zilch. (other than they are made in Taiwan).

Anyone? Anything? For $600 Canadian bucks, it looks good online, but so do a lot of other things....
 
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Curly

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Another Canadian recently fried his contoller after cleaning and lubricating his tail stock. Find the thread and message him for his opinion, before cooking that is.
 
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That lathe is the same as this one at PSI https://www.pennstateind.com/store/KWL-1218VS.html , which is also the same as this shopfox one Woodstock SHOPFOX 12in x 15in Benchtop Wood Lathe W1836 32% OFF And, had that shopfox been that price a month ago, I would have bought one, but it was around $435 . I then decided on a Rikon, which I am sure glad I did. Sorry I cant help you more, but the reviews for the two I mentioned would apply to the King one as well ( interestingly enough, the model number on the Turncrafter from PSI is KWL1218VS, the same as the King model number!)
 

Lucky2

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Run don't walk away, personally, I wouldn't own anything with the King name on it. They make junk, and they don't want to stand behind their warranty. I write this from experience with King tools, not a lathe, but other power tools.
 

monophoto

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Other than the color of the paint, it looks just like my PSI Turncrafter 12x18.

I've had the red version for three years - very happy with it.
 

Pens By Scott

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I've got a Delta Midi Lathe 46-250, picked it up at the big Orange store, I believe. had something similar to the one you mentioned... from the Canadian Blue store (Ron...ah). Hausmann, I think the brand was.... truly a piece of .... garbage. Thing basically broke itself while turning... they tried to convince me to have it repaired... went to the vendors repair shop here in Calgary... the guy behind the counter quietly suggested I ask for my money back... Total waste of time.

The two Deltas i have, love them! been solid, no issues, no fancy LCDs, just turn on and go.
 

aldjmc

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Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan, Canada
Here is a discussion on someone recently searching a new lathe in Canada http://www.penturners.org/forum/f14/need-help-choosing-decent-wood-lathe-146920/

Thanks, I read that discussion thread, but it didn't give me much on the King lathe.

My dilemma is this: I don't have a tool shop in my city, so I either drive to "big city down the road" to shop, drive to "big city to the north" or take my chances online and pay ridiculous shipping charges.

I found a local guy in town who is willing to sell me an old (unknown model #) Beaver lathe (plus some tools) for about $225. He thinks it is MT1, if it even has an MT, which I understand is not desirable. He has only used the lathe for faceplate turning, and from the looks of things, it has been a number of years since the lathe was used. I don't even know if I could turn a pen on it. So, do I risk the $225 or do I look for something better...

"Big city down the road " has a store that sells King tools, and the salesman tells me how great everything he sells is. I can probably do $600 plus extras to get me going, but not if it is a piece of shite.

"Big city to the north" has a Lee Valley and Rikon lathes. The 70-220, at $900 plus tools, plus accessories isn't going to fly with the much smarter and much prettier half of my marriage. The 70-100, at $549 is the right price, but it seems like a light weight compared to the others.

So there you have it - I am clearly suffering from a case of Paralysis by Analysis. :befuddled:

Thanks for all the replies.
 

jttheclockman

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I do not see it as a problem. You ask the question here and got an honest answer to avoid that lathe. You can take the suggestion or gamble or make a trip and have a day out. Telling you which lathe to buy is not in the cards. Look up each lathe and check the reviews of them and that should give you some indication of what to look for. Not much more to say except good luck :):)

By the way Rikon, Delta, Jet are all good lathes to seriously look at. Maybe you can get the wife interested in pen turning too. That would surely help. Some members here it has happened.
 
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Curly

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In the "Big city to the north" there is another tool place you can check out called Canadian Woodworker. The have a few lathes but it's been a year or so since I went in for a look around. I think as a member of the turning club I get a 10% discount.

If you go to the 'Big city down the road" to the turning club meetings you should be able to get some help with selecting a lathe.

The quality difference between the King and Rikon is worth the extra bucks. My wife asked me to show her how to make a pepper mill. I told her to turn some pens to learn on. Look where that led us. She only turned one pepper mill too.

By the way don't tell these guys how big the Big city really is. They will die of laughter. :wink:
 

1080Wayne

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I don`t have a Beaver lathe , but can`t think of any reason why you wouldn`t be able to turn pens on it . It may have a lot more length (3 or 4 feet) than you need , but that just gives you the ability to do other things . It shouldn`t be too hard to check whether it has Morse tapers unless it is badly rusted . Some consider MT 1 to be less desirable than MT 2 , but it will work fine . Cleanliness of tapers is the most important thing . Check to make sure that the head end taper is smooth , without grooves or signs of spalling , which would indicate that a male taper has spun in the female one . That would require some repair work .
 

aldjmc

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In the "Big city to the north" there is another tool place you can check out called Canadian Woodworker. The have a few lathes but it's been a year or so since I went in for a look around. I think as a member of the turning club I get a 10% discount.

If you go to the 'Big city down the road" to the turning club meetings you should be able to get some help with selecting a lathe.

The quality difference between the King and Rikon is worth the extra bucks. My wife asked me to show her how to make a pepper mill. I told her to turn some pens to learn on. Look where that led us. She only turned one pepper mill too.

By the way don't tell these guys how big the Big city really is. They will die of laughter. :wink:

1) Thanks, was not aware of the Canadian Woodworker store. I will have to check it out next time I am there.
2) Both of the "big cities" have a surface area greater than the area of San Francisco, and that is all anyone needs to know!:biggrin:
3) My wife does not like lathes. She got her long hair caught in one when she was in grade 8 - but if she ever does come around, she would do amazing work as she is extremely creative.
 

monophoto

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I found a YouTube video by Speros Pascalides in which he shows how he repaired his Turncrafter version of this lathe. The video is interesting because it shows what the interior of the headstock looks like.

By the way, the problem he was working on was to replace the wheel that is used to lock the spindle into position as part of the indexing system. That's an important point about this lathe - it has an indexing system but it was not designed to be used as a spindle lock while removing chucks or other fixings. I broke my indexing wheel also, but I rarely use it so I haven't bothered replacing it.
 

D.Oliver

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Rikon lathes have a pretty good reputation. Have you considered the Delta 46-460? It also has a pretty good reputation and is comparable to the 70-220, albeit a little less expensive. The 70-100 will be fine for pens, but if you decide you want to turn larger items its size becomes limiting.
 
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John Olynyk

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Other than the color of the paint, it looks just like my PSI Turncrafter 12x18.

I've had the red version for three years - very happy with it.

Can you please tell me the measurement from the bottom of the feet to the spindle? trying to see if I have to cut my bench down to order one.
thank you. John
 

monophoto

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As has been noted, this is essentially the same as the PSI 12" Turncrafter, the ShopFox 1218, and a lathe sold in England by Axminister. An obvious difference between the versions sold by these retailers is the color of the paint, but the King Canada version also appears to have a reversing switch that the other versions don't have (although that's an easy add-on). There may be other minor differences that could come down to the relative age of the lathe (ie, the 'model year'). It's made in Asia (not sure if it's Taiwan or PRC).

I've had the PSI version for about four years and have been very happy with it. It's robust, has enough power for most applications within the 12" swing of the lathe, and belt changing is very simple. You can see the advertised speed range in the specifications, but its also possible to tweak the speed settings to give a wider range if you desire; I have mine set to run down to 50 r/min.

A few things to be aware of:

1. It's heavy - > 100 pounds. That's fine in the shop, but it would not be ideal if you are looking for a traveling lathe for demonstrations. It comes in two boxes, and you have to assemble it. For the most part, assembly is simple and intuitive - the only thing that I struggled with is making the electrical connection to the speed sensor in the headstock. I eventually realized that if you open the maintenance port on the back of the headstock, you can easily reach inside to plug the speed sensor cable (duh).

2. It has an indexing feature that includes a spindle lock. However, the indexing wheel is plastic, and while the spindle lock is fine when used for indexing, the plastic wheel isn't strong enough if you need to lock the spindle in order to loosen a chuck that is stuck on the spindle. The wheel is replaceable, and there is at least one YouTube video showing how to do that repair. The picture of the King Canada version shows a hole in the indexing ring on the headstock spindle that you had use to grip the spindle with a tommy bar, and I've seen similar holes on other versions of this lathe. My version doesn't have that hole.

3. The body is a solid iron casting - very robust and quite heavy. However, the bed ways are very slightly wider than the block in the tailstock casting that aligns the tailstock. The result is that the tailstock can rotate very slightly in the horizontal plane (ie, around a vertical axis through the tailstock). In my case, I have less than one degree of rotation, but that's enough to cause a very slight misalignment between the headstock spindle axis and the axis of the tailstock. This is not an issue for most turnings, but it can be a nuisance if I'm drilling a hole in a piece with the Jacobs chuck mounted in the tailstock, and if the hole needs to be precise. I've learned that to overcome this 'wiggle', I need to cut a small dimple in the exact center of the workpiece, and then align the tip of the drill bit to that dimple before locking down the tailstock.

4. The reversing switch (either as shown on the King Canada web site, or as the aftermarket hack) is useful and can help with sanding a finished piece. However, you do need to be aware that when running the lathe in reverse, there is a tendency for a chuck or other fixing that is screwed onto the headstock to unscrew. Sanding, especially at low speed, generally won't produce enough torque, to cause this to happen, but if you want to run the lathe in reverse while turning (reverse turning can be useful when hollowing), you need to make sure that the chuck is equipped with a grub screw to lock it onto the headstock spindle.
 

Curly

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Other than the color of the paint, it looks just like my PSI Turncrafter 12x18.

I've had the red version for three years - very happy with it.

Can you please tell me the measurement from the bottom of the feet to the spindle? trying to see if I have to cut my bench down to order one.
thank you. John

Which lathe? The King or the PSI? I can'y answer for either but the PSI is going to cost a lot more even with the sale price at the moment when you add in shipping, brokerage, exchange and taxes.

Canadian Woodworker that I linked above closed down the Saskatoon store but Great Western Saw sells King products and have sold a lot of their bench lathes.

My Grizzly 12x20 is about 12 3/4" from centre to bottom without the rubber feet. I think that should be close to yours give or take and inch. Call either of the companies up and as the m to measure it for you.

And welcome to the forum.
 

monophoto

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Other than the color of the paint, it looks just like my PSI Turncrafter 12x18.

I've had the red version for three years - very happy with it.

Can you please tell me the measurement from the bottom of the feet to the spindle? trying to see if I have to cut my bench down to order one.
thank you. John


I think the King and the PSI are pretty much identical. In fact, in trying to compare dimensions to respond to your questions, I noticed that they even have the same model number - KWL-1218VS.

King Canada publishes overall assembled dimensions, while PSI publishes footprint dimensions. When I bought mine, I had an existing bench and didn't have room for anything larger. So in my case the bed length dimension was critical - there was absolutely no way I could accommodate the optional bed extension even though it would be nice to have.

The measured height of the spindle on my PSI lathe is 13.5" from the bottom of the casting. There are rubber feet that can go under the casting. The PSI instruction book is vague about whether the feet are attached for shipping, and I'm pretty sure that I recall that they were included in a bag of loose parts when I received my lathe. I think the feet are mainly intended to keep the lathe from 'walking' across the bench, and I chose to not use them; instead I used lag screws to rigidly attach the lathe to my bench. And unfortunately, I can't measure those feet because I forgot where I put them - but I think they were about 1/2 - 3/4". But I'm sure put them in a safe place!

Incidentally, I found that my bench was actually a little low, so I opted to add a 1.5" spacer (actually, a length of 2x4 on its face) under each end of the lathe - the spacers were bolted to the bench, and the lathe was bolted to the spacers. Not only did that elevate the spindle to the 'sweet spot' , but it gives me more room when I need to clean the shavings out from under the lathe. So the result is that the spindle on my lathe is actually 15" above the top of the bench. But as I'm sure you know - the recommended 'sweet spot' is for the spindle to be at approximately the elevation of your elbow when you are standing in front of the lathe.
 
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