Help with turning lead

[mmayo]

I saltwater fish and there is a trolling plug called a cedar plug. I use a 4 ounce lead egg sinker to fashion the head of the cedar plug.

Here is the before and after of the sinker.

These are brass ferrules for the tail end.

I turned the sinker between centers and used a carbide pen tool with a flat surface.

How would you complete this task? Any suggestion to make it repeatable or better. Thanks in advance for your help.

 

[Akula]

What is your goal/project?

I do lures and have friends that do them.

 

[Ed McDonnell]

If you are just going to make one or two more, then I would just do what you have already done.

If you are going to make dozens to sell then I would forget the turning and switch to cold casting. I would buy some metal shot / powder, mix it with a resin (PR or Epoxy) and cast it in a home made rubber mold. Actually, I might use stainless steel or brass instead of lead to avoid problems with shipping these into places like california. You wouldn't necessarily have to make the exposed part any bigger to get the same weight, but you might have to extend the tang further into the body. You might have to fool around with it to keep the action the way you want.

If you are going to try and take over the fishing world and make millions, I would make some contacts in Chiwan / India and outsource it.

Have fun.

Ed

 

[mmayo]

What is your goal/project?

I do lures and have friends that do them.

My goal was just to make a couple for myself and now I have orders for more. I would like to know how to be more precise and efficient. This is the first metal I have turned on purpose. The bushing don't count as a positive.

 

[KBs Pensnmore]

As a different approach, have you though about casting them, as in bullets? Have a look at a bullet mould, I used to cast my own 30 years ago, (so things might have changed), 2 at a time, using a pliers type. It shouldn't be to hard to get someone to make a mould in aluminium to the shape required.
Kryn

 

[mredburn]

I would turn a master(s) out of Delrin and use a liquid Silicone product to make a mold and cast them in that. There are several high temperature silicone products that will handle the heat. You could make a single mold or multi cavity mold and pour several at once. Lee Load all makes a lead melter that pours out the bottom. It would be much faster than turning them in a production environment.

 

[mmayo]

Thank you very much!

Those are great ideas that are completely different from my "lathe centered" mind generated. I will definitely try to make a perfect Delrin sample or two and then find out about silicone molding.

If I have Delrin masters, is anyone interested in making a mold?

Today's work (last one not turned) and all have yet to get BLO/CA finish.

 

[mredburn]

You could make a mold out of the pvc board found in Lowes Or Home depot. Or use a cutting board made from plastic, Smooth on, and Alumilite have silicone mold making materials. Its not hard to do. IF you dont have a vacuum pump get the kind that doenst need vacuuming.

 

[Ed McDonnell]

I believe that melted lead will be too hot for the silicone rubbers that are sold to the "at home" molding crowd. The highest I've seen are rated lower than the melting point of lead. Higher temp rubbers I've seen for molding require a lot of pressure and heat to cure them.

You could use pewter instead of lead and cast that in silicone rubber, but I think I would go the cold casting route with lead first. No metal fumes. No burn / fire hazard. Less equipment needed. No visit from the California EPA Swat team kicking in your door to find the source of lead contamination their satellite detectors picked up (ok maybe this one is a stretch, but we are talking about California :wink.

If you are determined to cast melted lead, then you might browse the bullet and lure making sites. There are a wide variety of aluminum molds sold for casting bullets and lures. You can probably find one that would be close enough to what you need.

Ed

 

[Akula]

Are you going back and drilling to insert wire?

 

[mredburn]

I have someone I know who used Smooth On 945, coated the inside with mica powder, any color, and cast 750-800 degrees on his molten metal. He would recommend platinum silicone from Raw materials. (They are in California) over Smooth On from his experiences

 

[Wood Butcher]

This may not translate to what you're doing but here goes anyway; I used to cast bullets for black powder firearms. I used a cheap ladle and a propane torch when I started but progressed to an electric pot to speed it up a bit. I used a steel mold and a mold release made for the process. I can envision you making a mold from steel by drilling to different size holed so you could reduce the amount of turning time and speed the process. Pouring lead can be dangerous in several ways so do the research if you intend to melt lead. Fumes will wreck your health, do it outside. Water hitting molten lead will explode, really, explode and throw lead all over you and anyone near you. Even a drop of sweat will do that. PM me if you want more, I have supplies and tools I am willing to sell if you're interested.
WB

 

[hanau]

I might be able to put you in touch with someone who makes aluminum molds. Don't know what it would cost or if he would be willing to do it or not.

Let me know and i will ask him.

 

[mmayo]

I have tried drilling both the recess for the head first and the drill out the hook recess using a pens plus chuck on my nova chuck. This method did not center the tail end well. Then I tried just drill the head, seat it with epoxy, turned the head / blank and drill the hook recess last. I guess I am still not happy. The turned head is not a great object to turn smoothly with the tail unsupported to drill it.

The fun will be when I figure the best solution and it works. So far it is still fun.

 

[mjrbuzz]

just a thought, the egg sinker molds are easy to come buy, may think about turning a peice of aluminum or copper to fit in the mold to take up the room of the material you are turning off of the egg weight, to fit in the sinker mold.

 

[Akula]

This is how I would do a simple plug.

1. Drill the entire length of your blank.

2. Use a step drill bit to countersink the head

3. Turn the blank to shape.

4. Drill out the head for the line.

5. Turn the head to shape and fit tight into the plug.

6. Epoxy the head into the plug.

7. Apply your finish (I like envirotex but there are other choices). You just need it as waterproof as possible. The first fish is going to tear up any pretty artwork (if you wanted to paint) and the clear finish.

8. Decide on your leader material and strength. This is going to be the most upfront cost in your project. I like at a min 130lb (and it will be based off your finished lure size and target fish) but expect $60+ for a spool. On some lures we use wire, it costs a lot less and much stronger.

9. Attach a quality sharp hook to the line, run the line from the bottom to the top, pull tight and finish with the knot of your choice.

 

[KenV]

The wood block will drill out using a set up like Les Elm shows for drilling Antler pieces. Drill first and use the drilled hole in the wood to be the centers. Old concept of making the whole thing fit around the hole.

Kevlar wrap and epoxy will probably be easier and less costly than the brass ferrule. Probably more durable.

I cast 45 an 50 caliber bullets -- how big is that nose?? There are shotgun slugs that run toward 0.700 inches

 

[designer]

What Wood Butcher said.

I would only add that if done right it is safe. Outside like he said. Also heat your mold up so the lead does not solidify too fast. It will leave a smoother finish that way.

Maybe a split mold that will open after the lead is solid to make removal easier. Drill the mold as he suggested. Maybe add a press fit pin if you need internal threads so the hole size is there already. Just the drilled pocket is fine for outside threads. Just be sure to smooth the surface of the mold since the lead will fill any imperfections. Plus the lead will drop out easier.

I used to buy lead ingots at the hardware store when I as pouring my own. I don't even know if they sell it anymore it has been so long.

BTW. His mention of not mixing water or sweat with the melted lead......Lead melts at about 675 degrees F if that gives you a better idea of his warning. Chicken in a skillet on the stove is what 350 or so? At the melting point of lead you need to remember that it is a molten metal at that point. Heed his warning and be safe and it is fun.

 

[mmayo]

What they look like after a month of practice.

I have shipped 20 or so and have 36 in process. Who knew?

 

[H2O]

If it were me, I would check at least the local laws pertaining to lead and water ways. There are a lot of counties, towns, etc. banning lead.
Around this area, people can't even shoot across water while hunting, i.e. streams. It's illegal to shoot across any body of water, but they don't want the lead in the water from hunting.
Some ammo manufacturers are designing lead-less bullets based on legislation of banning lead for bullets.

Just a couple of pennies, spend them how you wish. :wink:

 

[mmayo]

I use these steps to make one

Cuts wood blanks square
Drill recess for head on lathe ( careful to center on blank )
Drill entire length from other end for hook/line on lathe ( careful to center on blank )
Turn between centers to make the tenon for the brass ferrule
Turn lead heads to make even round end for insertion into wood
Epoxy head and ferrule
Turn wood and head between centers
Sand
Finish
Rig for fishing with hook (I swage on 100# mono)

PS - even in eco friendly CA we can still fish with lead