Ever heard of Post Hypnotic Suggestion ?

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Dalecamino

Dalecamino

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How does it work ? Can it be reversed ? A friend of mine , says he remembers the Neuro surgeon tlking to him when he was recovering from spinal surgery . (Laminectomy) Apperently , there is possible litigation involved . He says , the DR. was telling him ,that when under interigation , he will become confused , and will not be able to remember details . I know this guy to be pretty sharp , before this . He was given Sodium Penethol (so called truth syrum) during surgery . He is the hardest working man (next to me ) I've ever met . God fearing , devoted father of three , Grandfather of five girls . I cannot question his integrity . He can't be making this up . I just thought I'd ask our membership here . HE's a really good friend . And I care ! Thanks for your in-put and your time !
 
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I cannot comment with any kind of authority on this subject that you are asking. However, I can relate an incident with me and some with a few other people that I know had similar problems.

I had knee surgery 30 years ago before orthoscopy became common practice. Laying my knee wide open and 3 major slits caused considerable pain. AFter the surgery and release from the hospital, I returned to work (minister) preaching and in the church building work immediately. The doc gave me some pain pills. I was able to think reasonably clear, evidently, but I did take a pill a day for a week after being released from the hospital. In that first week after getting out of the hospital, a cousin came and stayed with us for 3 days.

A few days after he left, some church members commented on my cousin. I asked them how they knew him. They looked at me like I was crazy. LOML and the group convinced me to call him. Yes, he had been there, and he left a gift for me that I had, so obviously he had been there. This was during the week after being released from the hospital. I had no memory of that. And I was told that I had taken him (he drove) to different member's houses for visits, but for me - no memory of the first week out of the hospital and I worked on crutches as though normal. I remembered the few days in the hospital and people that came to visit, but not the week after release. (The one side effect was that people said my messages were astounding that week). [:I] [:o)] Over the next several months, I would go through spells of just being "foggy" for days at a time. Church members would jokingly ask me if I had taken any more pain pills.

I have visited quite a few people over the years who were hospitalized and who had surgery or were heavily medicated for a while. Most people did well, but it became obvious to me that some people react differently to drugs and some have long term (months) effects from these.

My wife had a hysterectomy here in Japan, and while her Japanese language learning did not suffer, for several months, she went around saying she felt like she was in a fog. The "edge" that made her sharp and "who she was" was gone. It was about 6 months before she was her normal self, and she did not take any medicines for more than a week after leaving the hospital.

I am not saying that this applies to the friend for whom you are concerned, but this does happen on occasion from medicine effects on a few people.
 
I don't think your friend has anything to fear. Most, if not all, investigators agree that hypnotism requires the willing (at some level) cooperation of the participant. The truth is people cannot be compelled to do things against their will using hypnosis; it can put them in a different state of mind than they would normally be in, but they have to go along with it.
 
The only time I have ever heard of Sodium Penothal being used was by the spooks during interigations and interviews. Oops, and once by a dental assistant when her boyfriend came in to get some dental work done. They aren't together anymore.
 
For my own reasons I am not a fan of Hypnosis.

I've been a recipient of sodium pentethol and from my experience it likely relays your true thoughts, which can be kind of scary. This happened to me when I had my wisdom teeth cut out at 20 years old (42 years ago), and I related to those there (including my Mom), things I wished hadn't been related--but I am also a fan of the truth--so let the truth be known.
 
Thanks Hank , Bob , Lou & Johnnie . Very interesting . Lou , thanks for the link , I will read this . Too bad for the guy in the dental office !
 
Thanks for the input Tom !
Originally posted by Tom McMillan

For my own reasons I am not a fan of Hypnosis.

I've been a recipient of sodium pentethol and from my experience it likely relays your true thoughts, which can be kind of scary. This happened to me when I had my wisdom teeth cut out at 20 years old (42 years ago), and I related to those there (including my Mom), things I wished hadn't been related--but I am also a fan of the truth--so let the truth be known.
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Chuck,

My brother is a neurosurgeon, and I have a hard time imagining the senario you presented. Having had a very major surgery about 2 and a half years ago in which half a lung was removed and I spent some time doped to the max in ICU, I speak with some minor authority. I was screwed up for a while!! After my recent knee surgery, I am tired all of the time, which may be tied to the anesthesia.

I would tend to believe your friend is having after effects from the anesthesia rather than the victim of some nefarious hypnotism.
 
I did a bit of searching, and there is a lot of discourse on the fact that sodium pentathol (and sodium thiopental) are used (or were used) as the initial stagt of anaesthesia, as they inhibit muscle movement in conjunction with other drugs...:

...medications such as sodium Pentothal (sodium thiopental) or Versed (benzodiazepine) to facilitate flaccid paralysis of the paraspinal musculature. Neurophysiologically, the sedative/hypnotic medications act to increase the threshold of postsynaptic membranes to the action of excitatory neurotransmitters. This results in depression of internuncial neuronal reactions within the spinal cord and affects other key pain areas of the central nervous system: limbic system; posterior hypothalmus; and mid-brain reticular formation. Additionally, the sedative/hypnotic medication depresses skeletal muscle activity by decreasing transmission of neural impulses at the myoneural junction.
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That would make a lot of sense if he was having a lapindectomy, wouldn't it? If the above site is true, then that means that the drug is used to inhibit neurons, which are pretty prevalent in the central nervous system...maybe sodium pentathol is used in those cases to inhibit nerve function while they work on the central nervous system??

And from another site:
A 20ml injection of a 2.5% solution will cause unconsciousness within 15 to thirty seconds, and last from five to ten minutes. Today it has three main uses:

1.

As an induction to anaesthesia. Pentothal is used to put the patient under quickly and easily, and then the more effective (normally respiratory) anaesthetic is then applied to make sure s/he stays under for the duration of the operation.
2.

By itself for short periods of time. This is best for minor operations.
3.

Pentothal also has its uses as an anticonvulsant, which can be used (for example) by people caring for epilepsy sufferers. In this context, it is quick and effective, though limited in duration of action.
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That's the limit of my brief search on google...I'm sure there's a lot more out there if you try yourself...have you asked another doctor?
 
William , I'm sure your brother is a great surgeon . I was hoping I wouldn't offend anyone with this . I was just hoping I could get more about this from some of our members . My senario is based on information given to me by my friend , and not my opinion of neurosurgeons . He may have imagined the Doctor saying these things to him .
I hope your recovery from your Knee surgery is quicker than mine . I had pain for 14 months . It's doing quite well now . Thanks for posting William !
Originally posted by wdcav1952

Chuck,

My brother is a neurosurgeon, and I have a hard time imagining the senario you presented. Having had a very major surgery about 2 and a half years ago in which half a lung was removed and I spent some time doped to the max in ICU, I speak with some minor authority. I was screwed up for a while!! After my recent knee surgery, I am tired all of the time, which may be tied to the anesthesia.

I would tend to believe your friend is having after effects from the anesthesia rather than the victim of some nefarious hypnotism.
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Thanks Andrew ! That's more what I was looking for . No , he has not asked another doctor , YET . And I think I have plenty of information for him now ! Thanks to all who posted ![8D]
 
Chuck, no offense taken at all WRT to my brother. I was simply mentioning that as a fact, not as anything else.

In fact, I just got off the phone with him. He said that sodium pentathol is almost never used in modern neurosurgery. The main use, according to him is to induce a coma to allow healing of a brain injury of some sort or another.

Modern techniques involve the use of short-acting Brevital Sodium to induce quick anesthesia to allow intubation and then longer acting anesthesia for the procedure. He specifically stated that he would never consider using Sodium Pentathol for a laminectomy, a procedure that is commonly used to treat spinal stenosis.

I feel, and my brother agrees, that those of us who feel your friend was confused by his body's reaction to the anesthesia used are most likely correct. My assistant still tells me that I was not properly grateful for the Haagen Dazs ice cream she brought me in the hospital after my lung carcinoid surgery. Although I remember her visiting me in the hospital, I have absolutely no remembrance of ice cream.

Rather than anyone supporting your friend's memory of potentially sinister hypnotism, he needs to discuss this with a family doctor or therapist to set his mind at ease. The malpractice settlement for a procedure that was less than successful certainly would be unpleasant to a surgeon. However, when you consider that the senario your friend feels that he remembers could cost a surgeon their license to practice medicine, it is highly unrealistic that any logical thinking practitioner would even consider such a course of action.
 
William , that is incredible . Thank you for taking the time to talk to your brother and getting the scoop . I'd better have another talk with my buddy over here . Sounds like he may have gotten some wires crossed . Thanks again for the information !
 
A few years ago, I had a laminectomy in conjunction with fusions and miscellaneous implantation of rods and screws. I was a bit foggy for a few hours afterword, and medicated with pain killers and muscle relaxers for some time afterwords. In that situation, I can totally see myself imagining the statements that you describe.

Beyond the fantastic nature of the situation, what makes me not believe it the most was that the doctor supposedly made these statements immediately after surgery during recovery. This sounds even more unlikely because the surgeon would not be spending much time in recovery, if any at all.

One way to check the story would be to simply sit him down and 'interrogate' him. I bet that he won't be fuzzy on details that he should know and will totally not know anything about anything that he shouldn't know. For instance, he would know the answer to 'how long were you in the hospital', but wouldn't know anything about anything that happened within the surgical suite, because he was either unconscious or so loopy that he wouldn't have a reasonable memory of it.
 
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