Skew Grind

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tipusnr

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May 15, 2004
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Reynoldsburg, OH, USA.
Right now I am using a straight grind but after watching Alan Lacer's DVD and getting to talk to him when he was in Columbus, I am going to convert one of my older skews to see what I can to with it. Most of my pen work is done with a skew.

He has a handout on making a radius skew on his website www.alanlacer.com
 

tipusnr

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May 15, 2004
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Location
Reynoldsburg, OH, USA.
I didn't know the skew attachment created a radius grind! Their video shows the attachment doing a traditional straight grind. Are you doing something different?
 

J. Fred Muggs

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Sep 28, 2004
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Location
Easley, SC, USA.
I'm straight grind all the way. But my skew never touches a grinding wheel unless I drop it point down on the concrete and really booger it up. I sharpen it only by hand on a diamond stone. Lay the stone a on table or bench or table at waist height and support the handle of the skew under your forearm and push/rock forward with your body. Keeps a very consistent angle and sharpens great. If only I coulda done this with my bowl gouges, I coulda saved all that Wolverine jig and slow grinder money.[:(]
 

Randy

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Jan 17, 2004
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54
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Arlington, Texas, USA.
For planning cuts on pen blanks, I believe that the radius cut is the way to go. It is alot more forgiving and easier to learn how to use. If I cut deep Vee's then I like the straight cut. It seems easier to plunge into the wood to make beads. If you are leading with the point, the straight cut seems to cut quicker and easier than the radius grind. But then again, I believe that whatever you are more comfortable with, is what you should be using.
 

woodpens

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Feb 15, 2004
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894
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Webb, AL, USA.
I have found that I can make quicker cuts with the straight grind. It is less forgiving if you stick a blank, but it is the more sure cut that I like. A light touch goes a long way.
 

woodpens

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Feb 15, 2004
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Webb, AL, USA.
Originally posted by woodscavenger
<br />So in other words, nobody has too strong of an opinion......
Anybody who would use a radius grind is an idiot!



Ducking and running....
Now are you happy? [8D]
 
M

Mudder

Guest
Originally posted by woodpens
<br />
Originally posted by woodscavenger
<br />So in other words, nobody has too strong of an opinion......
Anybody who would use a radius grind is an idiot!



Ducking and running....
Now are you happy? [8D]

Well..... Guess I'm an idiot then.

I was never able to make friends with the skew until I did a radius grind.
 
G

Guest

Guest
I don't even know if I'm using it correctly but all I ever use is a diamond stone on the skew. I normally don't need to start sanding with anything coarser than 320 grit.
Sometimes out of guilt I'll use 280.
( I have found that sometimes the faster something turns(grinding wheel)the faster I can screw an edge up)
Thing about it.When they sharpened Guillotene blades during the French revolution,did they use a wolverine jig and an electric grinder or were they honed by hand?
 

tipusnr

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May 15, 2004
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Reynoldsburg, OH, USA.
Take a look at Alan Lacer's design. It leaves the long point and a straight edge for a large part of the with of the skew with a radius grind removing the short point. With it he makes some amazing cuts both on his DVD/Video and in person.

A download on his website talks about the advantages and disadvantages of both grinds.
 

woodscavenger

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Jan 16, 2005
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Boise, ID, USA.
I realized that I am such a clutz when I sharpen by hand that I create a radius grind when I was really trying for a straight grind. Does that mean that I have the best of both worlds?
 

Rifleman1776

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Dec 18, 2004
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7,330
Location
Mountain Home, Arkansas, USA.
I just hold mine on a blue 80 grit wheel at 1750 rpms, it shaves hard and soft woods beautifully. Is that right or wrong? Am I doing the 'idiot' thing? BTW, it is a 1" skew and part of a set of five tools I paid a total of $20.00 for. I've often wondered what you get with those $80.00 tools besides and empty pocketbook. And, Oh, yes, it holds and edge a long time.
 

RussFairfield

Passed Away 2011
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Feb 10, 2004
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Location
Post Falls, Idaho.
The short answer to the question is that it doesn't matter. The results are what is important, and we use the tool profile that we are most comfortable with. There is no one edge, or angle, or shape that is better than the other.

The long answer to the question of straight vs. curved edge, and the other arguement of flat vs, concave bevels, is that there is a difference, and the answer becomes self evident as we gain experience with the tool. The following could represent a typical path of discovery.

The curved edge is the easier profile for the beginner into "Skewology". It is easier to grind. It is easier to control. And it is easier to see what the tool is doing. This often missed visual requirement is important to the beginner because they are using the tool by "eye" rather than "instinct". That ability to "see" that the tool is riding on the bevel will make it easier for a beginner to roll a curve in one direction than the other.

The beginners skew is less "grabby" and easier to control with a 45-60 degree angle between the bevels. This is because there is a higher cutting force with the thicker tool because it has to wedge the shaving farther away from the wood, and it is easier to work against some resistance. The sacrifice is that the thicker angle will leave a rougher cut because the wood is wedged farther apart to the point of breaking with the thicker tool.

We will discover several things as we learn more about the tool and gain some profficiency with it......

The first discovery is that the skew is a shearing tool, and as such, the sharper the edge the better it will cut. The closer we can get to being able to shave with the tool, the better it cuts.

We also learn that the tool cuts easier and better with a 25 or 30 degree angle between the bevels than with the 45-60 degree angle that was between the bevels from the factory. The smaller angle has less cutting force and the cut surface is better than with the thicker angle because the shaving flows more smoothly off the wood. The sacrifice is that it is more difficult to control and is very "grabby" because there is less resistance to our movement of the tool.

If we like using this thinner sharper tool, We also discover that we cannot grind this thin tool on a grinder without burning the edge, or rolling over a dark blue burr. That leads us to using a stone to dress the edge of the tool, and we discover that is difficult to maintain the sharp edge on the curved profile. So we go to a straight edge and flat bevels that we can maintain with a bench stone or sandpaper on a flat surface.

THEN we discover that the flat bevels are easier to use for a planing cut because we are riding the flat bevel on a flat surface, whereas the concave bevel is less stable because it is riding on a 2-point suspension of the cutting edge and the heal of the bevel. We also discover that the cancave bevel makes better beads because that is the natural direction that the concave surface wants to go.

By this time, the edge profile doesn't matter, we can cut with anything. However, the easier maintenance of a sharper edge keeps us on the the side of using flat bevels with a shallow angle between them, and a straight edge.

Having done all of this, we realize that it is the results that count. We use the tool profile that we are most comfortable with.
 

woodpens

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Joined
Feb 15, 2004
Messages
894
Location
Webb, AL, USA.
Originally posted by Fred in NC
<br />I think Jim Lambert said it in jest ... Since I only put a very slight radius in my skew, I must be a slight idiot!
Jim definitely said it in jest! [:)]
My problem is getting a good straight grind on my skew. I'm having a heck of a time with it. I sure could use that video. Maybe I don't have the accessory I need for the Wolverine. It works great on my gouges, but not for the skew.
 
M

Mudder

Guest
Originally posted by woodpens
<br />Jim definitely said it in jest! [:)]

[}:)] Oh...... Then I guess I should cancel my airline reservation? Thought I was going to have to go to 'Bama so we could "converse" [}:)] [;)]

I know it was in jest. Since the thorzine is working like it should I see things much more clearly now [;)]
 

woodpens

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Feb 15, 2004
Messages
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Location
Webb, AL, USA.
Originally posted by Mudder
[br[}:)] Oh...... Then I guess I should cancel my airline reservation? Thought I was going to have to go to 'Bama so we could "converse" [}:)] [;)]

I know it was in jest. Since the thorzine is working like it should I see things much more clearly now [;)]
I couldn't let this one by...
Originally posted by woodscavenger
<br />So in other words, nobody has too strong of an opinion......
But I suspected I might draw a punch or two from my comment. [;)] If you come to Bama, be sure to bring some nice wood with you! You can cut it with a radius and I'll cut it straight. [:D]
 

woodscavenger

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Jan 16, 2005
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Location
Boise, ID, USA.
Thanks for the insight RussFairfield! I was not expecting an essay but am much better fro it now. I think this weekend I will have to experiement with some spindle work while I wait for my latest order of kits. Thanks.
 
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