Pen kit cost

[jttheclockman]

I did not want to take anything away from the question that is being asked about slimline pens so I thought I would start another thread for the fun of it. Within the other question I asked the question about cost of the slimline kit and it probably will be overlooked by many.

But I will ask it here. With the perception of a slimline kit being the lower end of our pen turning kits chain it is understandable why beginners choose to start with that kit. It is fact that these kits sell for a lesser price than most any other kit available. Now I am not getting into name brands or vendors sellers or anything like that please avoid that. My question is if the manufacturers of kits can make a slimline kit for as cheap as they do, why can't they do the same for other kits??? Such as the sierra or the Zen and many other examples.

The plating aside, there are more parts in a slimline than a Sierra kit. Just because they are smaller, does that make a difference?? Pens that do not use transmissions should be cheaper in price such as a Zen. Is it a volume sales thing?? So all the vendors or people in the know here maybe you can answer this simple question and I may just be overlooking some obvious answer. If they can make a slimline pen kit for as little as they do why can they not do the same with other kits???

 

[SteveG]

My view: with some slight adjustment for ACTUAL component production cost, sellers of kits could offer other kit styles at prices based on actual production costs, and that price would be considerably lower that what we all encounter in the pen kit marketplace. Same comment applies to the variation of plating offered within a single kit line: on an actual production cost basis, plating cost should not cause much of a difference in the sell price of a kit.

So why not? I believe the simple answer is that the majority of pen turners are willing to pay at the inflated price structure. Part of that willingness comes from the fact that a bigger finished pen (or more "blingy" pen), will elicit a higher price at retail.

The obvious question is this...why is there not a marketplace competition going on that results in a NON-inflated price structure across the range of available pen kit styles (with the caveat that we are talking comparable quality alternatives)? My best guess is that the "Big Boys" in the kit manufacture world like the inflated price structure, (much more profitable), and "Little Guys" cannot compete at the level needed to succeed. This defeats the marketplace competition.

 

[Edgar]

I don't know anything about the pen kit manufacturing process & costs or pricing practices, but I suspect slim kits are produced in a higher volume than any other style kit which is probably a factor in the price differences.

There are also a couple of things about slims vs other kits that may be a factor in the production costs:

1. There is no threading on any slimline parts
2. All the slimline parts are very simple - the cap, center band & tip all seem to be very simple to manufacture to fairly consistent specs. Even the clips are pretty simple & generally thinner, requiring less material than other kits.

While most slim kits use rather inexpensive platings like 24k gold, chrome, etc, you can also get them in higher end platings like Black Ti, Gold Ti and Rhodium.

 

[JimB]

My answer is just a guess because I don't know anything about the manufacturers.

Slim lines have been around for ever. Every manufacturer probably makes them so there is a lot of competition. Other styles of kits, especially newer ones, are made by fewer manufacturers so less competition and therefore higher prices.

I'm sure volume also plays into this.

 

[larryc]

Probably the old standby - Supply and demand. More people start out with the slimline and so more manufacturers make more of them.

 

[tjseagrove]

Dyacom wholesale prices on available to anyone who wants to go look. If a vendor gets one customized for themselves, that most likely would put up the cost a bit as it becomes a custom run. Who wants to put up the cash for the volume our vendors purchase of a certain type and plating? There is even a vendor who purchased CNC machines to produce custom designed stainless steel component sets here in the USA.

Overall I believe we get good value from what we pay. The price we pay also includes great support and a quick fix if something is not right. They deal with Taiwan or China.

Just my 2 cents...
25

 

[TonyW]

FWIW, here in the UK Slimline kit prices have been going up whilst Sierras in particular have been coming down. Rather than this being by the manufacturers it seems to be driven by the retailer's however. Until the recent fall in exchange rates for the GBP it was cheaper for me to buy Taiwanese kits from
Timberbits in Australia for example! Mind you, he has always been a good bloke to do business with.

TonyW

 

[CREID]

I agree with Edgar.

 

[jttheclockman]

If they sell so many more slimline kits than any other kit than answer me this Batman, why is the Sierra kit the most copied kit in the market??? Every body and their brother has made a version of both the standard Sierra and the elite sierra. Yet the price of a sierra is almost twice as much. Maybe Edgar is onto something about the threading portion of the equation. I just do not know but something is out of balance. Yes we put up with it because our choices are limited. One of the other threads mentioned that it is the public that drives prices and kit selection drives kits being made. That is only true to a point but not completely.

 

[edstreet]

I do have some knowledge on the manufacturing processes, also other aspects on this subject that I will not go into.

first question:

why beginners choose to start with that kit.

Beginners start with that kit because they are told, incorrectly, that slimlines are the easiest and best kit to start with.

slimline kit being the lower end

Lower end in terms of manufacturing timeline yes indeed. Material cost, Machine time and Labor hours it takes the least of all the kits.

why can't they do the same for other kits

They do. A quick look at other kits nets the following in China

Black Ti slimline $1.64
Black Ti polaris $3.20
Black Ti sierra $4.47
Black Ti euro $2.09
Black Ti cigar $3.80
Chrome Gent Jr $5.80

Cost of transmission has already been discussed. However Labor time, not labor HOUR (huge difference) has not. Broken down to cost of goods to manufacture per hour nets you the following differences

cost to manufacture pen kits
slimline 1 unit per kit
polaris 1.95 units per kit
sierra 2.73 units per kit
euro 1.27 units per kit
cigar 2.32 units per kit
gent jr 3.54 units per kit

...

Slimline with stylus 1.71 units per kit.

** The term 'UNIT' here denotes the sum of the following: Cost of materials, Labor hours, Labor time, Specialized equipment needed, Equipment maintenance cost, Labor training cost (time and money). Plus a slew of other expenses that I do not care to mention.

If my math is correct then it is very much safe to say that a shop can produce 3.54 slimline kits in equal times to make one gent jr kit.


Now lets spin ahead to logistical values:

Things such as shipping, stocking, warehouse, delivery to your door and all that overhead need to be looked at. As does cost differences between China and the United States. Currently as of this posting there is approx a 200% - 400%, or more, increase between the two nations in terms of cost of living.

So taken each kit and adding 200% and 400% costs will net you the following.

$1.64 slimine = $3.28 (200%) $6.56 (400%) retail cost
$3.20 polaris = $6.40 (200%) $12.80 (400%) retail cost
$4.47 sierra = $8.94 (200%) $17.88 (400%) retail cost
$2.09 euro = $4.18 (200%) $8.36 (400%) retail cost
3.80 cigar = $7.60 (200%) $15.20 (400%) retail cost
5.80 gent jr = $11.60 (200%) $23.20 (400%) retail cost
2.80 slim w/ stylus = $5.60 (200%) $11.20 (400%) retail cost

A quick check from PSI and CSUSA and Berea shows that the cost differences is 260% for sierras to 380% for euro's.