Had to trade my Jet mini for a Rikon - Rantish

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karlkuehn

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Hey all, just thought I'd let you know the little issue I found with the Jet mini that I bought from Woodcraft a month and a half ago.

When I first bought it, I also bought a keyless chuck for it as well, but when I got home, the chuck spindle taper wouldn't seat right in the Jet's headstock morse. It acted like the chuck taper was swollen on the back part, and after a trip back to the store and much monkeying, I ended up deciding that the chuck taper was mushroomed at the end where they pressed the little threaded fitting into it, so I simply ground the very end of the taper down a little to solve the problem.

Well, recently I purchased a new adjustable mandrel from Bill at Arizona Silhouette, the new ones that he's got that have the allen grub screw that adjusts the mandrel length instead of the standard two big honkin' nuts that we find on the PSI ones. These mandrels are simply awesome, by the way, **highly recommended!**. Definitely worth the few extra dollars over the PSI stuff.

Well, the new mandrel had a longer taper on it like the drill chuck did (somewheres in the neighborhood of 2 3/4"), and when I shoved it into the Jet headstock, I saw the same seating/bad wobble problem, and thought, "Well, @#%&!". I knew it wasn't the mandrel, it's a fine piece of equipment, so I actually got to looking at the headstock. I had assumed that Jet was quality stuff the first time I ran into this, so it never occurred to me to check the lathe.

Well, lo and behold, looking into the headstock morse taper with a flashlight, I saw that the morse taper on the Jet headstock was drilled all wonky. It's like when they milled the taper, the milling bit wasn't running exactly perpendicular to the headstock, and the Morse taper ended up off-center at the very back, with a wobble that was visible to the naked eye when turning the wheel by hand. It was really bad!

Near as I can tell, the only reason that the lathe ever worked at all was because most of my attachments have short tapers; the drive spur that came with the lathe has a really short taper, so the wobble wasn't noticed when using that, but anything long enough to get back into the funky area of the hole (my new mandrel, drill chuck, etc) would wobble like crazy if you could even get it to seat.

So, I called the guys at Woodcraft and they said bring it in for replacement. I hauled the Jet on down there, and they pulled a new one out after we looked at the problem, and we found the same problem on the new Jet! So, they called Jet, asked about the problem, and got a bit of the runaround; the guy said they hadn't heard anything about it. We also checked the display model they had, same problem there, so that's 3 bad Jets in one store.

We went into the classroom at woodcraft and checked my new mandrel on one of the Jet minis in there, and it worked great. It's an older model without the new indexing head, so I don't know if that had anything to do with it.

Anyhoo...they offered me a couple of options: Grind down the taper on my new mandrel or trade the Jet for the Rikon that they have for the same price as the Jet. Well, I ain't grinding down the beautiful mandrel that I got, so I'm now the proud owner of a Rikon, which is a beast, it's like 20 pounds heavier than the Jet, but it works great so far.

The Rikon's got a little bigger capacity both directions, and the belt-speed change is a much better process. I hated having to open two panels to change the speed on the Jet; with the Rikon, the whole outside of the headstock case tips away for easy access to both pulleys.

I was torn when I bought the Jet, because the Rikon was on sale for $199 at the time, but I've heard so much good about the Jet that I was willing to pay the extra $50 for it. Oops.

So, after 2 trips worth of gas and time back to the store which is 45 minutes away, and paying $250 for the Jet instead of $200 for the Rikon a month and a half ago, I now own a $300 Rikon, and I'm finally able to turn some perfect pens! I was getting worried that I'd lost my touch for a while with all the weird wobblies I've been getting on the Jet.

I know that Jet has some loyal fans out there, but I'll never buy another Jet tool. To me, quality control is a big part of building a good tool, and for someone to miss that bad taper on 3 machines tells me that Jet is not on the ball. Time is money to me, and I've wasted a good amount of it so far just to enjoy a new lathe. :(
 
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ed4copies

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First question,

Were they successive serial numbers?

Jet could have shipped a couple dozen bad ones then corrected the problem. The bad ones would likely have gone to the same place and have successive serial numbers. Your WoodCraft store SHOULD HAVE worked this out with JET, YOU should have gotten a new, CORRECTLY done one without any hassle.

But then, I just run a business, this stuff comes naturally to me.[:D][:D]
 

LEAP

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Karl, shame on you! talking bad about the Jets? thats blasphemy! I've had the Rikon for a little over a year and am very happy with it. When I first got it I had to loosen the mounting screws at the base of the headstock and tweak it just a hair to align everything but that has been it. I can't even say that I miss the variable speed since its so quick and easy to change speeds.
 

karlkuehn

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Originally posted by ed4copies
<br />First question,

Were they successive serial numbers?

Jet could have shipped a couple dozen bad ones then corrected the problem. The bad ones would likely have gone to the same place and have successive serial numbers. Your WoodCraft store SHOULD HAVE worked this out with JET, YOU should have gotten a new, CORRECTLY done one without any hassle.

But then, I just run a business, this stuff comes naturally to me.[:D][:D]

Heh...I wasn't interested in serial numbers, so I have no idea. All I know is that I spent a month and a half going, "WTF?!". The upside is that I've learned all sorts of new tricks for fixing issues with out-of-round wobbly stuff, so I'm all set the next time a bearing cooks on one of my lathes! heh [;)]

I'm sure that if I'd have insisted on fixing the issue, the guys at Woodcraft, who were great through all of this, would've gotten me a good Jet eventually, but I'm in the business of turning pens, not troubleshooting products, and I've got Christmas orders to fill, so I needed an immediate solution. I just went with what would work that day.

Other than the fact that I was never able to produce a good pen on the Jet (aside from shortening my mandrel all the way down to one blank at a time + bare minimum bushings, which actually caused the mandrel to wear into my 60 degree live center a bit, and also shrunk my work space around the blank to the point that I was nicking the knurled nut occasionally with my 1" skew), I was very happy with the overall operation of the lathe, and I'm pretty sure it's a better machine than the Rikon, but you know what? I've turned two pens on the Rikon with outstanding results, and that's enough for me. [:D]
 

ed4copies

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I had no intention of criticizing YOU or YOUR actions. I just marvel at the WoodCraft folks SEEING a problem and not FIXING it!!!!!!!!!!!
 

karlkuehn

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Originally posted by ed4copies
<br />I had no intention of criticizing YOU or YOUR actions. I just marvel at the WoodCraft folks SEEING a problem and not FIXING it!!!!!!!!!!!

Gah! Sorry, Ed, just re-read my post and it sounds terrible! I wasn't trying to be offensive at all, as I know you weren't...heh...I was in the middle of posting about four different directions, and I don't think any of them came off sounding good. [B)]

I think I'll just go turn some pens. [8)]
 

leehljp

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You won't believe this but I had the same problem with the RIKON! I bought my Rikon in February of 2006. Most of the MT2 mandrel tapers I had on hand would work. Then I bought a much higher quality one from Bear Tooth Woods - the longer tapered one. It would not fit. I had to grind the end of the new mandrel down.

It is not just Jet with the problem. I ordered my Rikon from Woodcraft and it was two months later before I discovered the problem. It was also too much for me to pack it and send it back, so I decided to just live with it.

I did not know the real problem, but I did write Ernie at BTW telling him that the more expensive MT2 mandrels would not fit the Rikon unless the ends were ground down. I know that he just probably went "Huh? without a clue as to what I was talking about.

My next pen lathe will probably be a Jet, a fully variable speed one, - and I will get a new one when I retire in about 4 years. [:D]
 

polarbear1

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I love my Rikon, I've had it about a year and made hundreds of pens, bowls and all kinds of stuff. Had a few minor problems with it, a switch fried & another part bent, Rikon replaced them free of charge right away. I'm very impressed with the company
 
M

Mudder

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Hmmm,

I have an older VS jet and have no problems but my local Woodcraft has had 2 of the new units returned for the same problem that Karl mentioned and I looked at one of them. It does appear to me that when Jet changed to the newer model that they went down a little in quality. Fits and finishes do not seem to be the same to me. But then again, what do I know, I'm only the quality supervisor in a machine shop and check stuff like this day in and day out.

Since I live in Connecticut, not too far from Karl, it could be that a bad batch got through and this is a localized problem.However; I do understand the frustration in having work to do and a new machine, or series of them that are not right.

I hope your rikon gives you many years of dependable service. I have a bandsaw that was a real early one and it has taken all the abuse that I could throw at it.
 

Rifleman1776

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Originally posted by toolcrazy
<br />I've read about a morse taper reamer, I'm curious if this would of fixed the problems.

I believe many of the MT problems we see discussed would be solved by use of a taper reamer. Problm is, they are quite expensive and many people are reluctant to spend, maybe $50.00 for one minutes use. One of our members may be offering an affordable model soon. Stay alert. BTW, the straight flute styles are for finishing and would (probably) be the best choice for truing up a cranky MT.
 

Jarheaded

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I have 2 Rikons and 1 jet 1236 in my shop, and the Rikons are always being used for everything. I am getting ready to buy another one for the mobile setup that we are building. The price is great and the service is unbeatable. I have found that the indexing gear floats and needed to be locktited, but that was it.
 

leehljp

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Originally posted by Rifleman1776
<br />
Originally posted by toolcrazy
<br />I've read about a morse taper reamer, I'm curious if this would of fixed the problems.

I believe many of the MT problems we see discussed would be solved by use of a taper reamer. Problm is, they are quite expensive and many people are reluctant to spend, maybe $50.00 for one minutes use. One of our members may be offering an affordable model soon. Stay alert. BTW, the straight flute styles are for finishing and would (probably) be the best choice for truing up a cranky MT.

I agree with you. I figured that was the problem and in the future I will get me one. The real problem, IMO, is that the mfging reaming process only goes the the actual depth of the standard MT. IF the casting is only the length of the standard MT, then there will not be a problem. But if the casting for the MT head is longer for stronger and beefier support or by accident, then the longer reaming is needed. Just MHO in which I might be speaking in ignorance.
 
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