First stars & stripes kit

[Petricore]

I am working on my first stars and stripes kit and have a glue question. When you do the stars it has you use woodglue, but it says to water it down, any suggestions on the amount of glue to water ? Does it matter ?

I must say this kit is way more involved than I originally pictured, but I am excited to get it going.

 

[Texatdurango]

I probably mix 50/50 glue and water. I think the thinner the glue, the easier it is to stick the stars in. After I get all the stars glued in place I thin down the remaining glue a bit more and wash down the entire blank just for good measure.

 

[ed4copies]

They ARE fun to make, but remember how many steps there were when you decide to price the pen. (I did not on my first few!!)

Yes, 50% works. More or less may work, too. Don't think it's critical. Just be careful on the first couple passes when turning, don't catch the edge of a star!!! (80 grit gouge to start is ONE way to improve your odds -- THEN go to tools!)

 

[Texatdurango]

Originally posted by ed4copies

They ARE fun to make, but remember how many steps there were when you decide to price the pen. (I did not on my first few!!)

Yes, 50% works. More or less may work, too. Don't think it's critical. Just be careful on the first couple passes when turning, don't catch the edge of a star!!! (80 grit gouge to start is ONE way to improve your odds -- THEN go to tools!)

You got that right! I only put these kits on the Jr. Statesman kit and raised my price from $75 to $80 because of the labor involved.[]

 

[fiferb]

If you haven't already, I highly recommend you watch the videos in the library.

 

[OKLAHOMAN]

George I'm sure you meant you added another $75-$80 to your price not that you raised your price from $75 to $80 for the pen, if not I'll let you do all mine [}].

Originally posted by Texatdurango

Originally posted by ed4copies

They ARE fun to make, but remember how many steps there were when you decide to price the pen. (I did not on my first few!!)

Yes, 50% works. More or less may work, too. Don't think it's critical. Just be careful on the first couple passes when turning, don't catch the edge of a star!!! (80 grit gouge to start is ONE way to improve your odds -- THEN go to tools!)

You got that right! I only put these kits on the Jr. Statesman kit and raised my price from $75 to $80 because of the labor involved.[]

 

[ed4copies]

Me too, George, you can start your own little EMPIRE, selling flag jr. statesmen!!! At $80 each, you'll get rich (pretty slowly tho)

 

[Texatdurango]

Of course I was just kidding! When I first started making these, the general concensus was that a fair price was around $150 so I price my rollerball at $140 and fountain at $150. I'm happy with that.

Ed, FYI - I'm already rich, making pens is just good clean fun, although I could use a little extra $$ for diesel fuel this summer![]

 

[Petricore]

Wow I was thinking a big higher than 150 for selling it due to the fact that I'm almost 90 in it in parts But it is only worth as much as someone will pay so we will see.
Man this is going to be intimidating but fun. How much material needs to be turned down ? Can I wuss it up for the first one and just sand down to size ? I'm deathly afraid of catching a star or stripe and RIPPING it out.....

 

[kent4Him]

I'm pretty sure that Ed sells them for more than $150. I'm sure Ed will chime in one way or another.

 

[Petricore]

OH, I was also going to ask how to square the blank after I trim it with the sander ? I have built a little sanding rig and was just going to do that, but wasn't sure what the prefered method is. The kit recommends a collet chuck, but I don't have one of those....

 

[ed4copies]

We will, of course, have to kick you our of the "real men" club.

HOWEVER, you CAN put some sandpaper on a piece of corian and use it - it will maintain a consistent distance, so the pen will be ROUND. Just don't tell anyone when you try to sell it

 

[Petricore]

haha, FINE, I'll use a tool, sheesh !
Any suggestions on how to avoid using a disc sander, I dont have one, but am too scared to try to use a parting tool to cut off those ends .....

 

[ed4copies]

Got an exacto knife and a little patience?

 

[Petricore]

Well an exacto sounds better than nothing
Do you guys have any problems with bleedover when sanding, that bleeds the colors in a noticable way ?

 

[cowchaser]

In the library under Ed Davidsons videos (vidoe #10) he shows all they way through making the stars and stripes pen. I watched it even though I haven't made one and thought it was a great video.

 

[Monty]

Originally posted by Petricore

Do you guys have any problems with bleedover when sanding, that bleeds the colors in a noticable way ?

Only when I cut myself with the Exacto knife....[}][}]

 

[lwalden]

So far I've done 10 of Kens "stars and stripes" kits, and I cheat on the uppers. I use a dental pick to "stick" in the middle of the stars, transfer the star to the blank and get it aligned correctly, and then use a punch (by hand) with a head slightly larger in size than the star to put a little pressure on to make sure it seats correctly. Once all 50 stars are in, I'll roll the upper barrel on a flat surface, applying medium pressure, to again make sure all the stars are seated as flush as possible with the blue surface of the upper barrell. I use thin CA at that point, and coat the upper barrel twice- lets it soak in, and bond the stars to the barrel at that point instead of using the 50/50 glue water mix on each star............

 

[Petricore]

I assume the CA works well on the upper barrel ? I was confused by the wood glue, as I felt with as dry as the barrel is that thin CA would work much better !
I might have to try that, so the stars will set tight in there without glue at first ?
Is there any reason I can't glue the barrel in (the instructions say specifically not to) before putting the stars in so they have something to sit on ? Seems like you wouldnt want the stars suspended with air between the stars and the brass tube ...

 

[pianomanpj]

I think Lyle means that he dry fits the stars in the upper barrel with the upper tube inserted without glue. Once all the stars are fit, then the CA is applied to glue tube, barrel and stars all together.
If I've got that wrong Lyle, please chime in!!

 

[lwalden]

Whoops, my bad!! Guess I need to backtrack................
I have a dwindling supply of some great royal blue curly maple, and wanted to use it for the pens (in addition to experimenting with some Lapis tru-stone), so sent Ken Nelson the uppers to do for me where I had already drilled, glued in tubes, and rough turned the upper barrels for 9 pens. Ken was kind enough to accomodate this request, and returned the uppers cut for the stars, with stars out of holly (lower barrell had stripes out of holly as well). As such, the tube was already glued in place, and I guess I forgot that is not the case with Ken's normal kits. Here's a pic of 5 of the 9 I had Ken do........

and I want to say that it only took about 10 - 15 minutes to glue all the stars in the way I mentioned, given that the tube was already in and providing a lot more support. I definetly would not have done it as I mentioned in the earlier post without the tube already in for the additional strength and support. My apologies for the confusion..........and in my experience, the stars do fit tight in there without the glue at first, so I wouldn't rule out the possibility of the version pianomanPJ mentions, dry fitting the stars with the tube inserted but not glued in place, then gluing the tube in place, and coating the exterior with thin CA as well to penetrate from the outside.

 

[tdibiasio]

Guys,

I do not want to seem thick headed, but I am still a little bit confused. I just watched the videos that Ed has in the library, they are AWSOME by the way. But it appears from the video that the tubes were already glued in the upper barrel before he inserted the stars. I purchased my kits from CSUSA and it appears like the there may have been a change to the kits in the fact that their kits do not come pre glued glued with an upper barel. I could be all wrong on this as these kits are the first I have purchased, so I have never seen the kits offered directly from Ken.

So should I glue in the brass tube before inserting the stars, or try inserting parchmet paper between the tube and blank as the instructions say?

I love these kits and dont want to mess up the one I have so any guidance would be great.

Thanks

Tom

 

[laserturner]

Tom and all, The stars and stripes kit has been changed a bit since Ed put together the video. I'm now cutting the stars completely through the upper barrel. I still recommend using thinned out yellow carpenters glue for the stars. The water used in thinning them slightly softens them for an easier fit. They swell slightly from the added moisture and when dry seem to fit a bit tighter which also helps to reduce the black line caused by the laser charring the wood. Its not a big issue. Lyle, who uses CA makes some of the best flag pens I've seen. Also, if you glue the brass tube in first, depending on the type of glue used (I prefer 2-part epoxy) you run the risk of filling some of the star recesses with glue which could cause a problem if the glue sets up before you get a star in there.
Thanks for trying the kits and if you have any input for improved designs or questions regarding assembly feel free to e-mail me directly or call anytime as I don't always catch all the posts here.