Renaissance was vs. TSW

[jb_pratt]

Over the past several months I have been using Renaissance wax after I have finished my pens. I have been pleased with the results. After getting together with one of the other members on this site and reading a great deal about TSW I have decided to give it a try.

As usual I have a few questions for you finishing experts:
Do I use TSW first and Renaissance wax on top of that? Or do I use TSW in place of the Renaissance wax? One last question, I have applied the Renaissance wax after the pen was assembled and have used it on both the wood and the metal fittings, do I do the same with the TSW?

 

[swm6500]

I have noticed that Old Griz has been using both TSW and Renaisannce Wax, maybe he will tell us how he uses them together. He really puts out some quality work.

 

[Old Griz]

On the occassions that I use TSW it is applied first and then the Ren wax is applied as a top coat protectorant.... Sometimes I will apply 2 coats of TSW, but do them one day apart so the first coat has a chance to cure... you can get a real high gloss with TSW IF you follow the directions..
EDIT IN -- I will use the TSW over a CA finish also to get a really high high gloss.. just make sure that the CA finish is at the highest gloss you can get.. I use Hut or Novus Plastic polish to get there before the TSW
The pics below are TSW and Ren Wax.. The pink ivory set is one coat of TSW and the Curly Koa in the same pic is 2 coats.. the Bottom pic is also 2 coats... you can see a difference...

 

[jdavis]

Second the beautiful work Griz puts out. He has the finish tech. down to perfection.

 

[jb_pratt]

Amazing work Griz! This is exactly the advice I was looking for. Thanks for your help

 

[emsmith]

Beautiful pens!

 

[Old Griz]

[:I][:I][:I]Jack, I wouldn't go that far... you don't see the stuff that never makes it out of the house... [] There have been a whole load of pens that I have had to finish 2-3 times on the lathe.. and I am sure there will be a load more.. [xx(]

 

[ed4copies]

Tom,

How do you remember what finish you used on which pen, I can't remember what species they are. Turn, label, inventory (gotta remember which comes first). As always, beautiful work.

 

[Old Griz]

It's easy.. there is so much space between my ears not being used something occassionally sticks up there... []

 

[Leather Man]

Beautiful pens Tom. I really like the bottom one.
Ben

 

[mikes pens]

Sorry to veer off line but I need to ask Tom this (I am sure he has answered this before for someone). How do you get such beautiful pictures to turn out. That second picture is absolutely amazing. My pictures don't usually show that kind of detail. What's your secret?

Mike

 

[swm6500]

I have to agree with Mike, Griz turns out some awesome pictures of his awesome pens. Those are beautiful Griz.

 

[arehrlich]

Not only great looking pens, but great looking pix as well. You certainly have the knack with the CA finish. Someday.....[8)]

Alan

 

[JimGo]

Are you guys kidding? Secrets? Tom has no secrets! That's one of the things I really admire about Tom; he's always willing to share how he did something! Check out the Pen Photography forum (http://www.penturners.org/forum/forum.asp?FORUM_ID=21 )for tips on pen pics, including my latest acquisition, a "photo booth" from a white trash can. Did a great job for me!

 

[DCBluesman]

There is a new formulary for TSW which will be reaching Pens of Color shortly and which is already available through Jim Lambert. The changes are: 1) TSW can now be power buffed on the mandrel 45 seconds after application; 2) second and subsequent coats may be spaced at 12 instead of 24 hours; 3) the softening agent has been changed for faster evaporation and at a lower temperature; 4) it has been tested with Behlen's, Mylands, Enduro and Shellawax--all with excellent results (make sure your build coats are cured); and 5) the finish is now even harder, due to the addition of another rainforest plant extract. You may notice that the coconut smell is less pronounced.

 

[JimGo]

Gee, I guess I'd better get busy...I just got some from POC! Can't wait to go through it all so I can order more! []

 

[Old Griz]

The only thing done after the pic it taken is to run the Auto Color, Auto Levels and Auto Contrast setting on my photo editing software after I crop the picture to size... on the spalted red elm Baron I did blur the support wood a bit as an experiment...
Mike has been up to the shop (HA HA a generous name for the garage) and has seen all my stuff.. he can verify the accuracy of how the pens look...
I am still not a big fan of digital photography, or at least won't be until SWHTM let's me buy a Nikon Digital body for all my lenses [][], I still think that film takes the best photos in a properly set up environment.. but for out purposes digital is fine..

 

[RPM]

I have had the pleasure of trying the new TSW formula. Having gone through a container of the original and being sold on it, the new formula blew me away. Much harder, very nice feel in the hand and seems to build better.
Richard

 

[melogic]

Thanks Lou for the NEW TSW! I love the old stuff, so I guess I will admire the new stuff. [^]

 

[swm6500]

If you all keep it up, I will have to try the TSW.

 

[timdaleiden]

Originally posted by swm6500
<br />If you all keep it up, I will have to try the TSW.

Some people may not be surprised that I am not completely sold on TSW.

I have two reasons for this.

1: This is a relatively new product. The long term durability and usefulness has yet to be determined.

2: We have little information about its composition, so guessing at its long term durability is difficult.

Having said that, there have been many testimonials, including some by very experienced pen turners, that short term usefulness seems quite positive.

As for the Renaissance Wax, we do have numerous long term testimonials. Please visit the following links.

http://www.woodfinishsupply.com/RenWax.html

http://www.restorationproduct.com/

Please no flaming.

 

[wayneis]

Tim I don't know why anyone would flame you as you are just stating an opinion and backing it up with facts. I happen to agree with you.

Wayne

 

[woodpens]

My opinion could easily be presumed biased as I am now selling TSW. However, I have used two containers of TSW, and have just started on the latest formula. I like the previous formular enough to stop using Ren Wax at all. I used to use it on all of my pens. I now use TSW on top of another finish, either CA or Mylands friction polish. Both Ren Wax and TSW will protect the wood and hardware from smudges and finger prints. TSW also has a UV inhibitor. Applying Ren Wax seems more like applying a grease film to the pen than a finish or polish. I liked using Ren Wax. It certainly gave the pens a better look and feel than they had without it. TSW is even better in my opinion. I have not yet used enough of the latest formula to see a big difference. The reduced curing time will certainly be a plus. All I can do is suggest that you try TSW and compare your pens with and without it. I may be stepping out on a limb here, but if you buy TSW from me and find you are dissatisfied, I will buy it back minus shipping.

 

[RPM]

As a pen turner that is interested in the best possible products for my work, I can only say, given the testimonials for TSW, if you don't have a pen in your pocket every day checking out the new stuff yourself, I've got some buggy whips for you. Not a flame and not saying what product is better, you owe it to yourself and your customers to test it yourself. Don't wait for me or the others to test it. If you have not checked yourself, you have not checked it. This is true for Ren wax, TSW or Super Pen Slime 3000. The comments you see here, if consistent, should prompt you to get some, try it and make your own determinations. I think that in the context of this forum, being a naysayer is only appropriate if you have directly experienced a negative result. Please no flames, just a suggestion. We as a collective body have a unique opportunity to do some large scale testing of products among ourselves in a rapid manner. This is for the collective good and should not be subject to prejudices or product loyalties. Thank you for putting up with my comment.
Richard

 

[wdcav1952]

Richard,

That sound you hear is me giving you a standing ovation! Excellent post [^] [^] [^]

 

[timdaleiden]

Originally posted by RPM
<br />As a pen turner that is interested in the best possible products for my work, I can only say, given the testimonials for TSW, if you don't have a pen in your pocket every day checking out the new stuff yourself, I've got some buggy whips for you. Not a flame and not saying what product is better, you owe it to yourself and your customers to test it yourself. Don't wait for me or the others to test it. If you have not checked yourself, you have not checked it. This is true for Ren wax, TSW or Super Pen Slime 3000. The comments you see here, if consistent, should prompt you to get some, try it and make your own determinations. I think that in the context of this forum, being a naysayer is only appropriate if you have directly experienced a negative result. Please no flames, just a suggestion. We as a collective body have a unique opportunity to do some large scale testing of products among ourselves in a rapid manner. This is for the collective good and should not be subject to prejudices or product loyalties. Thank you for putting up with my comment.
Richard

Richard,

If you had read the links I provided, you would have noticed that all of the waxes prior to Ren Wax were based on either beeswax, or Carnauba Wax. Here is a direct quote:

"How, RENAISSANCE Wax,
the "Perfect Wax" was created:
Prior to 1950, the only polishes available were based on beeswax and carnuba wax. Unfortunately, these natural, saponifiable products could cause damage when acids arose spontaneously through oxidation or hydrolysis."

Short term results mean little to me.

This is another quote from the same site.

"no "polish smell;" no added fragrance to endanger substrate material."

http://www.woodfinishsupply.com/RenWax.html

I noticed the "new and improved" TSW description has this notation.

"You may notice that the coconut smell is less pronounced."

I still am not sold on TSW. I don't think that I want to submit my finished work to experimentation at this point. After all, if this stuff was so good to start with, why was there a reformulation?

I will stay with Ren Wax for now.

And Wayne,

To answer your question as to why I was expecting flames to my post...the last time I questioned something about TSW, somebody had a major meltdown, announced that he was leaving for a while...and the town lit up like I was the last witch in the neighborhood.

That was not at all what I expected. I own a business myself, and I am always more than happy to answer any question about what I make, or how I conduct my business matters.

 

[hobby_dale]

Tim,

Thanks for being honest in your thoughts and suggestion. "Lit up like I was the last witch"... still has me laughing...

Dale[]

 

[RPM]

Tim,
I respect your opinion. My main point is that we should remain open minded when new things come along. And, no I'm not suggesting abandoning the tried and true. I guess I can best make my point by imagining the uproar in 1950 when someone suggested that polishes don't have to be based on "beeswax or carnuba wax". Additionally, I don't see an ad for Ren Wax as an extremely objective source of information that justifies the subjective negative comments about other products. I would feel differently and would remain silent if you were posting comments about bad experiences that you have had with these products rather than posting maybes, mights and could bes. Again, I respect your opinion and am only commenting on my thoughts with regard to making product reviews within this forum more useful to all.
Have a good one,
Richard

 

[woodpens]

Originally posted by timdaleiden
I noticed the "new and improved" TSW description has this notation.

"You may notice that the coconut smell is less pronounced."

I still am not sold on TSW. I don't think that I want to submit my finished work to experimentation at this point. After all, if this stuff was so good to start with, why was there a reformulation?

I respect your opinion, Tim. What you choose to use is based on your experience and perceptions. I suspect the coconut aroma was reduced when some customers voiced that they don't like coconut. Personally, I love the smell as well as the results of the finish. One thing I can assure you is that TSW is not simply Ren Wax with a coconut smell. If people didn't continue their efforts to improve products, we'd be in sad shape. I hope Lou continues his efforts to make TSW even better than it already is.

 

[Thumbs]

The only reasonable, equable, and final long term answer and solution to this question of the better wax compound; its longevity; ease of use; and general overall quality; is to submit both substances to an unbiased comparative test regimen and routine uncomplicated by source acquisition economics and end user qualifications.

[}]In short, send me a large, free sample of both. I'll tell you which is best!

Use pretty jars, cans, or bottles, you never know what might provide the last bit of data I might require to tip those bitter but honest scales of justice to decide one way or the other. I must, also honestly, say that while wrapping bills of various denominations around those same containers for shipping protection might be frowned upon by some testing agencies; we here, at <b>YostLabs</b>, try to show every consideration to all interested parties no matter how overzealous "others" might consider them.

So while all of you are anxiously awaiting the results of our study, remember we're, anxiously, awaiting "free", "large" samples!

Thank you for your support, <b>YostLabs</b>, an unknown subsidiary of Muppet Labs.[]
[}][}][^][}][}]

 

[wdcav1952]

Hey Thumbs, thought you were asleep at the keyboard or something. I guess the "wood collection" gig didn't work out so now you are offering to test finishes []

BTW, was it you who called the other day and told me I might be a winner at the Publishers' Clearing House? If so, sorry I hung up on you. []

 

[Thumbs]

William,

<b>Bob's Wood Storage Sanctuary </b>is still in service and still eagerly awaiting more specimens for study. (No, I don't want any specimens of that!) However, as a non-profit facility, it certainly has been quite successful! I'm nearly broke![] Thus I'm also quite willing to explore many other venues to support my habit.

I am sorry to report that <b>The Publishers Clearing House</b> has withdrawn its offer to you. You were on the fastrack to becoming our next millionaire and you just blew it! And I was pulling for you, using all my considerable influence, too; but, <u>Nooo</u>, you had to hang up on me when the <b>Chief Publisher</b> was standing by to give you the big award![!] Oh well, such are the wayward winds and fickle wings of fate. [}] <u><b>Better luck next time when you, too, can be our next big winner!</b></u>[][][}][][]

<b>Note: YostLabs disavows any affiliation for claims made by the BWSS or PCH and maintains its full independence from any foreign or domestic influences! Thank you for your support.</b>

 

[jenamison]

Hey is the PCH making any finishes???[]

 

[Thumbs]

<u>Sorry</u>, the <b>CP</b> of <b>PCH</b> said only money no finishes. You're out of luck, too![] <b>Better luck next time!</b>[][]

 

[Rifleman1776]

From an old posting, Tim said, "Prior to 1950, the only polishes available were based on beeswax and carnuba wax. Unfortunately, these natural, saponifiable products could cause damage when acids arose spontaneously through oxidation or hydrolysis." I'm not sure that is fully accurate, synthetics have been with us for a long time. And if I knew what 'saponifiable' meant, I would argue with that too. [][] BTW, I have good luck with plain old Johnsons paste wax.

 

[ctEaglesc]

About Ren wax having no smell,I don't know who they think they are kidding.
It smells just like NEVA DULL which is a brass cleaner and polish.
That being said,I love TSW on everything but my brass casing pens.On those it seems to smudge.It does go on the antler or wood components, Ren Wax on the brass.

 

[wdcav1952]

Eagle, I thought it was just me. A new turner asked me about the two products. I opened both for him and told him I preferred my fingers to smell like coconut rather than petroleum distillates when I was polishing. Neither has an odor (to me) after being used and buffed. Is one better? I don't know, I just like the results that I get with TSW. Now understand, my pens are not valuable works of art, so the risk in using a new product on them is minimal. Just curious, how many years has the use of CA as a finish been researched?

 

[ctEaglesc]

Originally posted by wdcav1952
<br />Eagle, I thought it was just me. A new turner asked me about the two products. I opened both for him and told him I preferred my fingers to smell like coconut rather than petroleum distillates when I was polishing. Neither has an odor (to me) after being used and buffed. Is one better? I don't know, I just like the results that I get with TSW. Now understand, my pens are not valuable works of art, so the risk in using a new product on them is minimal. Just curious, how many years has the use of CA as a finish been researched?

I have read a life expectancy of ten years for a CA finish, but I don't know what that remark is based on.
I have often wondered what prompted the first person to try CA as a finish, and who it was.
I mean it's kind of like the guy that ate the first lobser, what was he thinking?

 

[hobby_dale]

Yeah and what about the person who first put warm, drawn butter on it to improve the taste. Maybe it was the same person who first looked at the lobster and said, "Hey, I think I will eat this!: [][]

 

[ctEaglesc]

yep and what about clams?
I won't even bring up the subject of how hard up the guy must have been the first time a Rocky Mountain oyster was eaten.(Nevr had em can't make a call one way or the other.)
I love lobster and clams though.
Oysters too.
What WERE they thinking?