Adjusting pen balance - International Association of Penturners
     International Association of Penturners
Pens for Service Members
 
Support The IAP

Go Back   International Association of Penturners > Community Forums > Advanced Pen Making
  Forgot Password
Register FAQ Members List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
Advanced Pen Making Kit-less construction; designs and challenges beyond those normally associated with kit pens.


Logged on members can hide ads!

Welcome to penturners.org!

You've found the home of The International Association of Penturners. You are currently viewing our site as a guest, which gives you limited access to view discussions, photos, and library articles.

Consider joining our community today. You'll have full access to all of our content, be able to enter our contests, find local chapters near you, and post your questions and share your experience with our members all over the world.

Membership is completely free!!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-13-2019, 11:00 PM   #1 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: Colorado
Posts: 4
Photos: 0

Default Adjusting pen balance

So, I'm new to pen turning and was not able to find existing threads discussing this question (though some may exist)... and while I am new to this, I figured the collective Advanced forum would be the group to answer this.

Of the dozen pens I've made most (if not all) are top heavy and I'd like to how to move the balance towards the nib/paper. I'm aware I could make the lower barrel thicker and/or longer than the upper, but that aesthetic is not always desired. So,...

Does anyone know of a way to add mass inside the lower barrel... thereby affording me the freedom to make the exterior as thick/thin as I'd like? It'd be great to come up with solutions for the various types: ballpoint, rollerball, fountain pen. It'd also be nice to know if, then where, suitable materials might be obtained. Thanks all!
Likes: (1)
jelevy is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old 03-14-2019, 12:48 AM   #2 (permalink)
 
jttheclockman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: NJ, USA.
Photos: 104

Default

Welcome to the site. If you could include your name we would be able to better refer to you. Now to answer your question you will have to explain a little more as to if you are referring to kits and if so what kits are you using?? If you are referring to custom one of a kind kitless pens then show us an example. In fact we would like to see some of your work.

if you are talking about kit pens with two pieces, (cap and Nib ) then the easy answer is leave off the cap when writing with. There many pens that are non-postable. If you are talking of kits like cigar pens they are basically well balanced because the cap end tapers as well as the nib end as long as you stay away from bulbous portions. Do a bushing to bushing turning and you should be fine. After that as I said we need more info.

I should add many of those gimmic kits sold by PSI are terrible to write with and are just that gimmick pens and to me just should sit on the desk for show. Not a fan of their designers for pens. Most of their kits are top heavy.
__________________
John T.

My Photo Album

Last edited by jttheclockman; 03-14-2019 at 12:52 AM.
jttheclockman is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old 03-14-2019, 10:00 AM   #3 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: Colorado
Posts: 4
Photos: 0

Default

Thank you, John, for taking the time to reply.

So far, I've used kits; moreover, I've made 11 slimline pens, 1 slimline pencil and 1 "classic elite 2" fountain pen. I've added a few pics as you requested.

Thanks again for any and all advise.
(Sorry some of the pics are rotated)
Attached Thumbnails
20190302_191519.jpg   20190126_133753.jpg   20190205_000600.jpg   20190208_211130.jpg   20190310_101540.jpg  

__________________
Jay
jelevy is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Advertisement
Old 03-14-2019, 10:36 AM   #4 (permalink)
 
jttheclockman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: NJ, USA.
Photos: 104

Default

Well Jay thanks for posting some of your work and I have to say well done. But to me I am confused because all pens you shown are relatively light weight pens. There are many kits that do get heavier because the are a larger kit but mostly are capped pens and as I say just leave the cap off when writing with and the weight is far less. The pens you show use a transmission but that basically is centered in the pen when assembled. Maybe tipped a little toward the top. I suggest you do a balancing act thing and see if you are really seeing a top heavy situation or just a grip thing. Many times people can not grip thin pens well because they do not have the finger pressure. Lay the pen on your finger and try to balance it or lay it on an object where you can balance it and see if it tips toward the cap or the nib and by how much. I bet you will be surprised it will not be much if at all.

Now if it is a grip thing or there is a slight inbalance you can always change the profile of your turning in that make the bottom portion more bulbous in shape and that will add some weight to the nib or vice versa if the cap needs more weight. You see many people do this for people who have a hard time gripping a pen and this makes it easier. There are many examples throughout here and maybe others can post photos because I do not do this type turning. Good luck.
__________________
John T.

My Photo Album
jttheclockman is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old 03-14-2019, 10:47 AM   #5 (permalink)
 
monophoto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Saratoga Springs, NY
Posts: 1,388
Photos: 0

Default

This is an interesting topic. I don't have a lot of experience with slimlines - I've made a few, but I abhor ballpoint pens so I've never actually used one for any length of time But my limited experience with them has been that they seemed fairly balanced.


For me, the issue has been with pens with a removable cap - many pen designs are proudly promoted as 'postable', and I agree that if the cap is posted for writing, the result is almost always that the pen is top-heavy. So I don't post the cap. In theory, the risk is that if you don't post the cap, you could lose it - - but I haven't lost one yet.
__________________
Louie
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
http://monophoto.deviantart.com
Instagram: @louie_powell_photo
monophoto is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old 03-14-2019, 11:10 AM   #6 (permalink)
 
chartle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Pgh, PA
Posts: 1,141
Photos: 0

Default

I don't think making the wood or other material on the lower section thicker is going to add any appreciable amount of real weight. It may look heavier but only add 10ths of grams.

I've never really thought about balance but the only way I can think of is add something heavy in the lower tube. Like a cylinder of lead. Or depleted uranium
__________________
Cliff
chartle is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old 03-14-2019, 09:27 PM   #7 (permalink)
 
BSea's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Little Rock, Arkansas
Photos: 49

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jelevy View Post
Thank you, John, for taking the time to reply.

So far, I've used kits; moreover, I've made 11 slimline pens, 1 slimline pencil and 1 "classic elite 2" fountain pen. I've added a few pics as you requested.

Thanks again for any and all advise.
(Sorry some of the pics are rotated)
I completely agree with jttheclockman on pens with postable caps. While many people seem to like them, I almost never write with one posted unless it's just a short note. I'd bet the fountain pen you made is the pen that bothers you the most from a balance standpoint. When I 1st got into pen turning I carried many postable pens, but now I carry a Euro as my daily carry pen. But it is basically just a longer slimline with a heavier cap, so if you think a slimline feels top heavy, I doubt a Euro would change your mind.

Since you are new, I'm guessing most of the pens you used in the past were inexpensive plastic pens. These pens are much lighter overall than even a slimline. I noticed that when I 1st started, every pen I made was heavier than the pens I normally used. Could it be that the weight of the slimline pens is what you're noticing, and that they aren't actually top heavy? The reason I say this is that I don't think I've ever heard anyone say a slimline was top heavy.

However, I think you're going to be a great addition to this forum. Especially if you get into doing custom pens which are basically a pen made from scratch not using a kit. Balance becomes part of the challenge because every pen is unique, and it's good that you think about these things already. Most of us are our own worst critics, so don't stress about it too much.

BTW, those are some nice pens.
__________________
Bob

Central Arkansas IAP Chapter Member
BSea is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old 03-14-2019, 10:19 PM   #8 (permalink)
 
gtriever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Paducah, Kentucky
Posts: 1,023
Photos: 3

Default

I think the guys are on to something here. There's a big difference in feel moving from the throwaway bics to a "good" reusable pen. Postable caps (not a favorite), body material, hardware size, all play a roll in how the finished product will perform and fit the customer's expectation.

This summer I'd like to try going kitless, or at least working with some modded kits to see what turns up...
__________________
Pull up a chair and visit a while :

https://www.facebook.com/thestatepen/
gtriever is online now   Reply With Quote Top
Old 03-15-2019, 12:09 AM   #9 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: Colorado
Posts: 4
Photos: 0

Default

Thanks for the comments thus far, all. It is the fountain pen that is the primary "offender".

Considering these comments, I suspect you've all touched on aspects I haven't considered (e.g., the way we hold pens, familiarity with the Bics of the world, etc.). I think you guys are right with respect to the slimlines; regarding these, I'll just keep the thought in my back-pocket if ever I find myself concerned again.

This does leave the fountain pens unresolved. This particular FP kit uses a 10mm brass tube for both barrels. I noticed other kits use a larger diameter tube for the cap which would change the weight and shift the balance some (perhaps, insignificantly). Additionally, I don't have much experience with using fountain pens so I'm beginning to suspect experience with more varieties could help level-set my expectations.

BSea, it's interesting that you mention custom/kitless pens. It didn't take much considering the balance question before I started thinking about custom pens. I think the bespoke is too advanced for me right now... but I see myself going there in the future And thanks for the compliment!

Again, thanks for the input guys. In the short term, I'm still interested to learn of ways to shift the balance on the capped pens... if a solution is out there.
__________________
Jay
jelevy is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Old 03-15-2019, 08:11 AM   #10 (permalink)
 
chartle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Pgh, PA
Posts: 1,141
Photos: 0

Default

[quote=BSea;2018939]
Quote:
Originally Posted by jelevy View Post
I completely agree with jttheclockman on pens with postable caps. While many people seem to like them, I almost never write with one posted unless it's just a short note.
Once saw an add for a very expensive non postable pen where it was pointed out that in an important meeting you would place the cap on the table in front of to show you had good taste and were a very important person.

Yes it was a very nice cap.
__________________
Cliff
chartle is offline   Reply With Quote Top
Related Content
Logged on members can hide ads
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
balance , top heavy , weight , weights

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:30 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0

Content Copyright © 2003-2019 by Penturners.org, LLC; All Rights Reserved
Terms Of Service   Acceptable Use Policy