Minwax Wood Hardener

[Jarheaded]

I bought some of this stuff and put it in a pressure pot with a bunch of blanks. I made sure that there was enough to cover the blanks once they sunk. I kept the pot under 80# of pressure for 4 days and then took all the blanks out of the pot and put them on some cardboard to dry up. Does anyone know how long I need to let them dry before I can use them? I have a second batch in the pot now and had to buy 2 more bottles of the hardener to refill it, so they are sucking up a lot of this stuff. I like to learn as I go, but these are some really nice blanks and I don't want to waste them. Thanks for any help with this question.

 

[Dario]

It will harden soft/funky wood blanks to workable level but not as hard as CA will do it. Don't expect it to fill voids either.

From experience, a cheaper and better alternative is making your own by melting some plexiglass with acetone. Better because you can make it a bit thicker. JMHO

Assuming they are not bunched up and there is good air circulation all around the blank, air drying for 5 days should be good.

 

[Dario]

By the way, about melting plexiglass in acetone...it takes a few days.

 

[Proud_Poppa_of_2]

Originally posted by Dario

From experience, a cheaper and better alternative is making your own by melting some plexiglass with acetone.

Dario, have you got a source for inexpensive plexiglass that you wouldn't mind sharing with the rest of us?

 

[Dario]

Your best bet is finding a company in your community that uses it and sells the scraps for cheap (or even give it away).

I bought some CLEAR strips from an eBay seller and the cost was almost just same as my shipping (flat rate box). Give it a try but if you cannot find some, let me know and lets see what we can work out.

 

[Mudder]

Might I make a suggestion?

I cur my blanks a bit oversize in length and drill them out before putting them in the tank. My philosophy is why would I want to waste the expensive wood hardener on wood that I plan on drilling out anyway? Secondly, it allows the stuff to penetrate from both inside and outside.

 

[Dario]

Scott is right but there are times when you actually need to harden the wood before you can even drill it properly.

As I said, it is not that great so I only use it when the wood is soft/punky so I can work with (drill) it. After drilling, I still treat the hole with thin CA. That is how I do it anyway.

 

[goose]

jarheaded,

try melting acrylic with acetone,can buy sheet's at home depot or lowes.
only cover it with acetone just above broken layer in mason jar.then add another inch of acetone above that.

take the minwax,pour into mason jar/then add your melted acrylic to the mix.

you just added molomer's an polymer's to the mix.

the acetone,dry's leaveing a very solid an stable blank.

see-ya
steve


instead of ca glue to fill hole's or inperfection's...you can use the melted acrylic base.

also make's for a great top coat finish.

 

[alamocdc]

When I'm in need of plexi, I stop by a few glass shops and ask them if they have any scraps. I haven't paid for plexi in a while now.

 

[sbell111]

This conversation is one of teh very few that makes me want to glance over a MSDS.

 

[Dario]

Originally posted by sbell111

This conversation is one of teh very few that makes me want to glance over a MSDS.

I agree, know the chemical you are dealing with. As most of what we use...these need to be handled with care and in well ventilated areas. Preferably with appropriate masks too.

 

[Jarheaded]

Thanks for all the advise on this. I will try using the plexi mix with the next batch. I guess the batch that I already did use the hardener on will have to wait a few days before I will know if I wasted some real nice blanks or if they are going to be usable. They are box elder and hopefully they will take the hardener as easy as it takes dyes. In the future, should I use a pressure pot or should I use a vacuum pot? I have read too many different views on the subject. Also, is it okay to cast the wood with Alumilite after hardening it?

 

[Dario]

Using the hardener won't hurt the wood. If ever, you just waste the hardener.

I tried vacuum and the acetone just boiled and basically turned into gas and got vacuumed out. Never tried pressure so cannot comment. I know I applied both thin and black CA on hardened wood and that works. Not sure about Alumilite is compatible with it.

 

[loglugger]

I have never used pressure, have always used vacuum for stabilization and use minwax poly fast drying mixed with about 30% to 50% acetone, pull a vacuum and let it off slow 4 or 5 times I do it untill there is no more air comeing out of the blanks. Will take a week or more to dry.
Dario, I think the boiling you were seeing might be the air coming out of the wood.
Bob

 

[TowMater]

Johnnie,

I have stablized some spalted maple and spalted pecan blanks using minwax. I very carefully drilled them, then put them in a large mason jar with the minwax for 24 hours.

No pressure or vacuum. I don't think with the minwax you need it. Now the plexi/acetone stuff might be/probably is a different story.

Todd

 

[Dario]

Originally posted by loglugger

Dario, I think the boiling you were seeing might be the air coming out of the wood.
Bob

Bob,

I thought so too initially but no way the blanks can have that much air...bubbles as big as pennies coming out continuously.

I was told that because my pump is a deep vacuum one that it boils the liquid (acetone in this case) and forces it to evaporate. Even with an open shop the smell of acetone is overwhelming. I stopped that practice and now just soak them in.

 

[sbell111]

Originally posted by loglugger

I have never used pressure, have always used vacuum for stabilization and use minwax poly fast drying mixed with about 30% to 50% acetone, pull a vacuum and let it off slow 4 or 5 times I do it untill there is no more air comeing out of the blanks. Will take a week or more to dry.

I use a very similar method. I think the only difference is that I keep the blanks under vacuum in the mix for a day.

 

[sbell111]

Originally posted by Dario

Originally posted by loglugger

Dario, I think the boiling you were seeing might be the air coming out of the wood.
Bob

Bob,

I thought so too initially but no way the blanks can have that much air...bubbles as big as pennies coming out continuously.

I was told that because my pump is a deep vacuum one that it boils the liquid (acetone in this case) and forces it to evaporate. Even with an open shop the smell of acetone is overwhelming. I stopped that practice and now just soak them in.

You are likely pulling too high of a vacuum. Do you use a vacuum guage on your pot to monitor how much vacuum you are putting the blanks under?

 

[Mudder]

Originally posted by Dario

Originally posted by loglugger

Dario, I think the boiling you were seeing might be the air coming out of the wood.
Bob

Bob,

I thought so too initially but no way the blanks can have that much air...bubbles as big as pennies coming out continuously.

I was told that because my pump is a deep vacuum one that it boils the liquid (acetone in this case) and forces it to evaporate. Even with an open shop the smell of acetone is overwhelming. I stopped that practice and now just soak them in.

Acetone boils at 133 degrees F at Sea level and much lower under vacuum. Without a doubt I believe that Dario was seeing his acetone boil.

 

[JohnU]

I find the blanks almost to hard to turn after I soak them in minwax wood hardner. Now I glue and turn them down to size and dip them in it before sanding, but it still plays hard on the sandpaper, but gives me a hard surface for the pen.

 

[Fred]

If you think it is air simply put some acetone in a bottle all by itself and start pulling a vacuum. The acetone will "boil" since the surrounding pressure is reduced.

A better way is to pressurize the bottle and let it sit for a bit. Re-pressurize until the blank sinks. It may take a long tine, but it will sink sooner or later.

I have also tried this method and it helps cut the time a bit. Using a double boiler filled with water and heated on a HOT PLATE, I put the blanks into a bottle with the acetone mixture and then put the bottle into water that is quite hot and let the acetone solution get hot. Then I seal the bottle and let it cool down all by itself. This creates a vacuum inside and the blank absorbs the acetone mixture. Remove the lid, repeat the heating process, reseal, and let it cool down again. Repeat until the blanks sink.

This way the acetone does not boil off anywhere as quickly as with a vacuum and the fumes are still there but not as bad either. Ventilation is a must. Don't stand there and watch the process and breath the fumes ... that would be very foolish to do.

 

[RONB]

Is Lexan the same thing as plexiglas for mixing with acetone?

 

[Hello]

Originally posted by sbell111

This conversation is one of teh very few that makes me want to glance over a MSDS.

acetone scares the poo out of me, and plexiglass tastes funny

 

[wdcav1952]

Originally posted by RONB

Is Lexan the same thing as plexiglas for mixing with acetone?

From my understanding, only plexiglas works by dissolving completely. It seems that there was a thread somewhere stating that other similar products leave a gooey mess.

 

[Jarheaded]

I used the first piece of the wood that sat in the hardener umder pressure for 4 days and it did penetrate all the way through. The turner was slacking a bit so I won't show a picture, but it went to the center. I will try the plexi method next batch anyways.

 

[TowMater]

Let us know how the plexi method works for you Johnnie. I've been thinking about that and wondering if you can add colorants to it so you stabalize and dye at the same time......

 

[goose]

Originally posted by TowMater

Let us know how the plexi method works for you Johnnie. I've been thinking about that and wondering if you can add colorants to it so you stabalize and dye at the same time......

YES YOU CAN...ON,MELTING ACRYLIC WITH ACETONE,(THEN ADD THIS)----THEN THE COLOR..

ON THE COLOR THINK ORGANIC...

SEE-YA
STEVE

I'M GONNA HAVE TO TRY THE PLEXIGLASS,AN SEE WHAT HAPPEN'S..
I'M KINDA LIKING THE ACRYLIC THOUGH.BUT I'LL GIVE IT A WHIRL.

 

[TowMater]

Originally posted by goose

Originally posted by TowMater

Let us know how the plexi method works for you Johnnie. I've been thinking about that and wondering if you can add colorants to it so you stabalize and dye at the same time......

YES YOU CAN...ON,MELTING ACRYLIC WITH ACETONE,(THEN ADD THIS)----THEN THE COLOR..

ON THE COLOR THINK ORGANIC...

SEE-YA
STEVE

I'M GONNA HAVE TO TRY THE PLEXIGLASS,AN SEE WHAT HAPPEN'S..
I'M KINDA LIKING THE ACRYLIC THOUGH.BUT I'LL GIVE IT A WHIRL.

Did you have anything specific in mind on the Organic colorants Steve?

Todd

 

[workinforwood]

yep, first were melting plexiglass with flasks and scales and the next thing you know your off searching for cough syrup! [)]

 

[goose]

Originally posted by TowMater

Originally posted by goose

Originally posted by TowMater

Let us know how the plexi method works for you Johnnie. I've been thinking about that and wondering if you can add colorants to it so you stabalize and dye at the same time......

YES YOU CAN...ON,MELTING ACRYLIC WITH ACETONE,(THEN ADD THIS)----THEN THE COLOR..

ON THE COLOR THINK ORGANIC...

SEE-YA
STEVE

I'M GONNA HAVE TO TRY THE PLEXIGLASS,AN SEE WHAT HAPPEN'S..
I'M KINDA LIKING THE ACRYLIC THOUGH.BUT I'LL GIVE IT A WHIRL.

Did you have anything specific in mind on the Organic colorants Steve?

Todd

yes todd,try useing this..spirt based dye.it was explained to me as organic an will not brake down or goo in the soulution..
here's a link http://www.tandyleatherfactory.com

see-ya
steve

 

[loglugger]

Originally posted by sbell111

Originally posted by loglugger

I have never used pressure, have always used vacuum for stabilization and use minwax poly fast drying mixed with about 30% to 50% acetone, pull a vacuum and let it off slow 4 or 5 times I do it untill there is no more air comeing out of the blanks. Will take a week or more to dry.

I use a very similar method. I think the only difference is that I keep the blanks under vacuum in the mix for a day.

Yes I will leave it over might after the last vacuum, then put vacuum to it again in the moring for a short while.
Bob