Belt / Disk Sander

[RustySocket]

I'm slowly acquiring equipment for my penmaking and other small woodworking projects.

I now have my lathe and a small bandsaw. Up to this point Ive been using trimmers in a drill to square my blanks and it works well for the most part.

I have had a couple of incidents where I got too aggressive and the trimmer ripped wood rather than cut. Also I am starting to want to try some resin / acrylic blanks.

I think Im at the point where I'd like to get a disk/belt sander combo. I do realize I could get a PSI plate and jig for my lathe but I'd like to be able to have a dedicated piece of equipment for other projects like small boxes.

I am comfortable with a budget around 150$

I can get one from Harbor Freight for around 60$ and I do have a local store to inspect it at as I know quality can be hit/miss.

I have a coupon for this one 4 x 36"

I also am looking at a WEN 6502 from Amazon which runs about 110$. Both Rikon and Rockwell make ones that are nearly identical but I like the belt guard on the WEN better.

I know I also need to make or buy a jig to mount on the sander to square the blank.

I'm not brand loyal so I'm interested in what others are using and if I should be looking at anything else feature wise. It wont be put to hard use but I don't want junk. I'm leaning towards the WEN at this point due to the more powerful motor, higher rpm, and safer looking belt guard.

Let me know your thoughts and opinions.

 

[jttheclockman]

For sanding blanks, using the lathe as many here including me do is the way to go and is true. if you go the sander route, stay away from the units that have plastic knobs and levers. Go with a disc/ belt bench top sander. Not a fan of the Wen. I have an older Delta. What is on the market today I would very very leary to even recommend one. Do not like HF. for power tools. To me as i said sanding on a lathe for pen blanks and for a disc sander I prefer a jet floor model.

The units I would suggest are pricey starting with the Jet and then the Rikon. Good luck.

 

[RustySocket]

So far I've received nothing but good advice here. Such as drilling on my lathe. In regards to sanding blanks is the psi lathe kit the only way to go?

 

[southernclay]

http://www.penturners.org/forum/f172/custom-made-penturning-tools-accessories-92501/

Rick Herrell's sanding jig is what I use. Turn your lathe into a disc sander with a faceplate and scrap wood. I love it. Not trying to dissuade you but it works well for me. I have a small combo grizzly belt/disc sander that I rarely use and would sell if I ever got around to it. I wouldn't mind getting a larger more expensive combo set up one day but for now I love using the disc setup on the lathe. For what it is worth I have actually heard really good things about Harbor Freight's dedicated disc sander, good reviews etc. Never personally used it though. If you go Rick's route go ahead and spend the rest of the money you save on tool rests and pin chucks :biggrin: You'll like anything you get from him.

 

[mecompco]

http://www.penturners.org/forum/f172/custom-made-penturning-tools-accessories-92501/

Rick Herrell's sanding jig is what I use. Turn your lathe into a disc sander with a faceplate and scrap wood. I love it. Not trying to dissuade you but it works well for me. I have a small combo grizzly belt/disc sander that I rarely use and would sell if I ever got around to it. I wouldn't mind getting a larger more expensive combo set up one day but for now I love using the disc setup on the lathe. For what it is worth I have actually heard really good things about Harbor Freight's dedicated disc sander, good reviews etc. Never personally used it though. If you go Rick's route go ahead and spend the rest of the money you save on tool rests and pin chucks :biggrin: You'll like anything you get from him.

I second this. I made my own disc out of a piece of shelving--the stuff with the hard white coating and a nut that fit my head stock (fining the 1.5" nut was the toughest part of the job). Did quite a few pens just sanding in the center, but Rick's jig works so much faster--well worth the $40 odd dollars.

 

[Edgar]

I'm another fan of Rick Herrell's offset sanding jig for sanding the ends of blanks. I also use his sanding mill to fine tune the trimmed ends.

I already had a 5" sanding disk pad for my electric drill & I managed to pick up an MT2 Jacob's Chuck pretty cheap, so I use that as combo for a dedicated lathe sanding disc. Otherwise turning your own disk is a good, cheap way to go.

I did buy the Ryobi equivalent of that WEN 4x36 sander at Home Depot last year when they had it on sale for a little under $100. I'm satisfied with it for the things that I do - a better quality 6x48 sander would really be nice, but I don't do enough flat work to justify the additional cost.

 

[Fish30114]

Another fan of Rick Herrels jig, but I'll tell you, I have a 2x72 belt sander which is awesome, but given that I've been considering the Rikon 1x30 belt with a disc on it. It's $105 on Amazon and I have had good luck with my Rikon tools, they are good stuff IMO. I would recommend picking one of them up in a heartbeat.

 

[Charlie_W]

Okay "Rusty", You asked for thoughts and opinions so I will share mine.

First, let me say, I understand you have a budget in mind......however....
I am a firm believer in " if you want quality, you need to buy quality".

I feel the sander you are looking will not ultimately have what you are looking for in a belt/disc sander.
My thoughts:
The 6" disc will only give you about 2" of usable sanding area. The back 3" are rotating up off the table, the center will not effectively sand and about the first 1" near the center is not only turning slower but will clog or dull more quickly as there is less sanding material there. I think it makes a nice pencil sharpener or if you are doing tiny work, it would suffice.

As for the belt, it may be harder to accomplish squaring the end of a blank unless it has a good table and miter guage when used in the upright position.
Also, a belt will float in front of the platen and only be tight against it when you push your pen blank into it pressing it flat. I feel this will not give you a true square end on your blanks.
A disc sander with the psa adhesive backing sticks flat against the disc and will give you a more true sanding cut.

As for size and power, I would go no less than 12" for a disc sander. More powerful motor and more abrasive with the larger disc plus the larger usable disc area. I have a 12" Delta disc sander and like it. It has the cast iron table with a miter slot.
My belt sander is a traditional handheld belt sander.

I would suggest going with the sanding on the lathe route or saving and buying a better disc sander. It will be a tool you will have around for decades.

Good luck on your quest.

 

[RustySocket]

So again, my purpose of starting this thread was to learn and get me thinking outside of the box.

As when I initially started I could only envision one way of drilling blanks and in my mind that required a drill press. I soon learned that while indeed a drill press was an option there was a better option using the lathe, which I already had.

In that process I learned that rather than buy a dedicated pen chuck that was limited to pen blanks my money would be better invested in a 4-Jaw chuck. It was hard to swallow that financial pill in that the chuck cost as much as the lathe, but after seeing the versatility it offered it was justified. I then purchased a 2mt Jacobs chuck and drill all my blanks on my lathe.

I do wish I could have afforded a variable speed lathe, but that combined with a 4-jaw chuck and all the other "extras" I would have never gotten anything and would not be making pens at all. That's just the reality of it. I didn't understand that I would quickly have a thousand dollars tied up in this hobby. That's fine I can do it a couple hundred at a time. It makes it easier to swallow. I wish I could just write checks but I cant that's the way it is. I don't resent it, I have fun and I can change the speed of my little HF lathe in less than a minute. I accept the limitations of my budget and my equipment and at least Im making pens and having fun.

I see now that I really only want a sander, I don't really need a sander and that since I have a Jacob chuck already I can get a sanding disk and use my lathe for a small investment. Something I hadn't really thought of a few hours ago.

Of course that is why I asked the question to begin with, to learn.

Thanks everybody, keep the ideas coming.

The ultimate goal of this thread is the need to square ups some tubes on acrylic blanks

 

[Dave Turner]

I have the Harbor Freight belt/disc sander you are looking at and it is one of the better investments I've made. Mine is about 5 years old now.

First of all, I don't use the disc sander part of the sander at all, only the belt sander. I find it is a great way to quickly and safely hog off material from the end of the blank to bring it down to the level of the brass tube. No worries about chipping like I frequently got with a pen mill. The table and miter gauge (I use that term loosely here) that come with the sander are adequate to get the end "close enough" to square. I do my final squaring after I'm done turning down the blank to it's final diameter using this arrangement on my lathe. The belt sander is also great for knocking off the length-wise corners of acrylic blanks to make it easier to round them on the lathe, especially some of the more brittle acrylics.

I bought my HF belt/disc sander for $50, and I've gotten several times that value in its use so far. It's quick and convenient to use and doesn't take up much space on my workbench. I hook my shop vac up to it using a home-turned adapter for the hose. Also be sure to pick up a Sanding Belt Cleaner while there. I find it indispensable in keeping the belt clean after using a lot of these exotic woods on it.

 

[TimS124]

I have the style of belt/disc sander you posted and I also have another style that I've found to be far more useful (the belt part is really handy for some antler pieces I've made that wouldn't work well on the lathe). Here's the style of belt/disc sander that I find much more useful for pens and a variety of other shop tasks (and it's within your budget):

Buy Rikon 1" x 30" Belt, 5" Disc Sander Model 50-151 at Woodcraft.com

 

[JimB]

I have a similar setup to Dave's for squaring blanks.

View in Gallery

 

[RustySocket]

I have a similar setup to Dave's for squaring blanks.

View in Gallery

Jim,

So It appears as though you must just be getting it close initially when the blank is square, turning it down and then squaring it up at the finish. I see this doesn't eliminate the slow speed near the center but it must get the job done? what are you using to hold the blank in the chuck. Is that a drill? That may be just the short tem solution I am looking for.

How does the blank not being flush with the brass tube affect the bushings as they wouldn't have a flat surface to mate to when your first starting?

 

[RustySocket]

I have the Harbor Freight belt/disc sander you are looking at and it is one of the better investments I've made. Mine is about 5 years old now.

First of all, I don't use the disc sander part of the sander at all, only the belt sander. I find it is a great way to quickly and safely hog off material from the end of the blank to bring it down to the level of the brass tube. No worries about chipping like I frequently got with a pen mill. The table and miter gauge (I use that term loosely here) that come with the sander are adequate to get the end "close enough" to square. I do my final squaring after I'm done turning down the blank to it's final diameter using this arrangement on my lathe. The belt sander is also great for knocking off the length-wise corners of acrylic blanks to make it easier to round them on the lathe, especially some of the more brittle acrylics.

I bought my HF belt/disc sander for $50, and I've gotten several times that value in its use so far. It's quick and convenient to use and doesn't take up much space on my workbench. I hook my shop vac up to it using a home-turned adapter for the hose. Also be sure to pick up a Sanding Belt Cleaner while there. I find it indispensable in keeping the belt clean after using a lot of these exotic woods on it.

Dave,

I reviewed your other thread. I have everything I need to do this but what is PSA? hook loop. The only thing im missing is the punch set. It costs me nearly as much to drive to HF as the sander costs so I will probably buy the punches as I need them for disassembly tools anyway I may as well spend the 55$ and get the sander as well

lots of great solutions to my problem here. that's what is wonderful about the internet, lots of solutions to problems I didn't know I had

 

[Dave Turner]

Pressure Sensitive Adhesive to Hook and Loop conversion pad. I used something like THIS . I found mine at a local hardware store. It's found where the round orbital sanding discs are located. This disc has a sticky back and a hook and loop front, so you can stick it on the wood backing plate, then use regular hook and loop sandpaper discs on the front. You really need the hook and loop so you can easily reposition the sandpaper in relation to the transfer punch and get to use the entire sheet.

In answer the remainder of your comments, the transfer punch set at HF is inexpensive and works well. I use them in my sanding set-up and have used them for disassembly without any problems. I've even on occasion had to use one as a transfer punch to mark the center of a hole!

 

[Dave Turner]

For Clarification: The conversion pad provides the "hook" side, and is stuck to the wood backing disc via the adhesive backing. The sandpaper discs have the "loop" side. I now just use the regular 220 grit hook and loop sanding disc sandpaper (the kind with the 8 holes in it for use on random orbital sanders). The sandpaper discs don't have to be centered, you can position them wherever you need to so as to use up all the available sandpaper area. One sheet will last a long time that way.

 

[RustySocket]

Thanks Dave... I'm _squared_ away now.

 

[JimB]

I have a similar setup to Dave's for squaring blanks.

View in Gallery

Jim,

So It appears as though you must just be getting it close initially when the blank is square, turning it down and then squaring it up at the finish. I see this doesn't eliminate the slow speed near the center but it must get the job done? what are you using to hold the blank in the chuck. Is that a drill? That may be just the short tem solution I am looking for.

How does the blank not being flush with the brass tube affect the bushings as they wouldn't have a flat surface to mate to when your first starting?

Most of the time I use a mill to square the ends before turning and then use the jig pictured to re-square them after applying finish. That is what you see pictured. However, I have a few times used the jig to square an unturned blank. I just use a coarser sandpaper. That is a drill chuck in the tailstock with a punch in it from the HF punch set going into the brass tube. It is perfectly square to the blank and has never failed me.

 

[wouldentu2?]

Buy the best you can afford and you will never regret it.

 

[Rockytime]

I use a pen mill with a 1/4" rod chucked up in my tail stock stock with the blank (wood or Acrylic) in a pen jaws. I do not use a proper sized shaft in the pen mill as everything is very stable. I usually square several blanks at a time. Quick and easy.

 

[RustySocket]

I have the style of belt/disc sander you posted and I also have another style that I've found to be far more useful (the belt part is really handy for some antler pieces I've made that wouldn't work well on the lathe). Here's the style of belt/disc sander that I find much more useful for pens and a variety of other shop tasks (and it's within your budget):

Buy Rikon 1" x 30" Belt, 5" Disc Sander Model 50-151 at Woodcraft.com

That is a nice little unit as well. What do you find better about that style. On the belt portion is there a fence behind the belt to press against?

 

[jttheclockman]

Pressure Sensitive Adhesive to Hook and Loop conversion pad. I used something like THIS . I found mine at a local hardware store. It's found where the round orbital sanding discs are located. This disc has a sticky back and a hook and loop front, so you can stick it on the wood backing plate, then use regular hook and loop sandpaper discs on the front. You really need the hook and loop so you can easily reposition the sandpaper in relation to the transfer punch and get to use the entire sheet.

In answer the remainder of your comments, the transfer punch set at HF is inexpensive and works well. I use them in my sanding set-up and have used them for disassembly without any problems. I've even on occasion had to use one as a transfer punch to mark the center of a hole!

Hello Dave

I just read your answer and may I make a suggestion??? It is not a good idea to use the hook and loop setup with sanding pen blanks. You would be better with self adhesive paper. The reason is unevenness when sanding. The blank will indent into the sandpaper and you will sand the outside edges faster and more deeply than the center of the tube. Trust me it happens. Just a suggestion.

 

[jttheclockman]

I have the style of belt/disc sander you posted and I also have another style that I've found to be far more useful (the belt part is really handy for some antler pieces I've made that wouldn't work well on the lathe). Here's the style of belt/disc sander that I find much more useful for pens and a variety of other shop tasks (and it's within your budget):

Buy Rikon 1" x 30" Belt, 5" Disc Sander Model 50-151 at Woodcraft.com

That is a nice little unit as well. What do you find better about that style. On the belt portion is there a fence behind the belt to press against?

I always hate doing this because people are set in their ways. But I highly suggest skip this sander because the 1" sanding belt is very limited. You are better off with a 4" belt. More versatile. I have a Delta in that configuration and it sits under my workbench collecting dust. Been there done that.

 

[TimS124]

I have the style of belt/disc sander you posted and I also have another style that I've found to be far more useful (the belt part is really handy for some antler pieces I've made that wouldn't work well on the lathe). Here's the style of belt/disc sander that I find much more useful for pens and a variety of other shop tasks (and it's within your budget):

Buy Rikon 1" x 30" Belt, 5" Disc Sander Model 50-151 at Woodcraft.com

That is a nice little unit as well. What do you find better about that style. On the belt portion is there a fence behind the belt to press against?

There's a vertical piece of metal behind the lower half (maybe third) of the exposed belt area. The top part does NOT have a backing plate which allows different results depending on which part I use. When I'm shaping antler pen bodies, I use the UPPER part of the belt and press the antler into it which gives a smoother curve to the surfaces I'm shaping. It's a trick I learned from a buddy that makes knives (he sharpens up there so the blade has a slightly convex profile along the edge).

The original belt/disc sander you posted has the belt backed up the entire way which prevents using it like I just described. I've found very little use for the wide belt on my belt/disc sander that's like the first one you posted. But I use the heck out of the unbacked portion of the belt on the style I posted.

I have one of the small, inexpensive ones from eons ago (made by Delta, picked up at Home Depot for about $88)...has a 1" wide belt. I also recently added a beefier one from Jet that has a 2" wide belt (used it on some much wider pen bodies that were also antler).

 

[TimS124]

I have the style of belt/disc sander you posted and I also have another style that I've found to be far more useful (the belt part is really handy for some antler pieces I've made that wouldn't work well on the lathe). Here's the style of belt/disc sander that I find much more useful for pens and a variety of other shop tasks (and it's within your budget):

Buy Rikon 1" x 30" Belt, 5" Disc Sander Model 50-151 at Woodcraft.com

That is a nice little unit as well. What do you find better about that style. On the belt portion is there a fence behind the belt to press against?

I always hate doing this because people are set in their ways. But I highly suggest skip this sander because the 1" sanding belt is very limited. You are better off with a 4" belt. More versatile. I have a Delta in that configuration and it sits under my workbench collecting dust. Been there done that.

I have the Delta in the narrow config and use the heck out of it. The narrow belt is a non-issue since I don't use that for the ends of pens, I use it for shaping the sides when the pen style isn't something I can reasonably make on the lathe.

For squaring the ends, the disc portion of the little Delta (or the Rikon I originally posted) is plenty big enough given that pen blanks are typically 3/4" square and the disc considerably, even when sticking with only one half of it (the side headed down towards the table).

Having had both for many years, I find the little one gets used much more often. Depends of course on what kind of projects we each do.

I've enclosed a couple example of the pens I've done that are easier on the narrow vertical belt's unbacked upper portion (the curved tips make it impractical to turn these on the lathe):

 

[Dave Turner]

Hello Dave

I just read your answer and may I make a suggestion??? It is not a good idea to use the hook and loop setup with sanding pen blanks. You would be better with self adhesive paper. The reason is unevenness when sanding. The blank will indent into the sandpaper and you will sand the outside edges faster and more deeply than the center of the tube. Trust me it happens. Just a suggestion.

Excellent point. I use a light touch when sanding on my rig and have never experienced the rounding you've described. I can see where this might be a problem with heavy pressure and a soft interface. Also, the pad I use has very short hooks resulting in a hard, flat surface that doesn't indent significantly even with heavy pressure. I'll certainly keep an eye out for that potential problem, but the convenience of hook and loop sandpaper for it's easy re-positioning is hard to beat, and so far I've not seen that problem.

Thanks for the heads up.