Air Compressor Troubles

Signed-In Members Don't See This Ad

Crashmph

Member
Joined
Dec 15, 2008
Messages
1,515
Location
South Riding, VA
I really need some help with my Air Compressor.

I bought a Black Friday special and got a Husky 60 gallon air compressor model #VT6314. The documents state that this unit runs on 2-pole 230V power and requires a 15A circuit.

I have it wired up to a two-pole 220v 20A outlet/breaker dedicated to this tool. The wiring is 12 gauge wire size.

The AC will run for about 10 seconds and trip the breaker. I have checked for grounds in the wiring and found none. I have tried the outlet dedicated to my table say and lathe (same outlet type as the outlets for the tablesaw and lathe), but the AC trips those breakers as well.

Per the manual, I have turned the pressure valve down to the lowest setting, still the same breaker trip.

I have even tried using the outlet to my Clearvue Cyclone. It is a 30A 220v with 10 gauge wiring. It trips that breaker as well. Sometimes trips the limit switch on the motor itself, but most of the time the breaker trips first.

Does anyone have any suggestions of what to look at next?

Thanks,
Michael
 
Signed-In Members Don't See This Ad

shippy

Member
Joined
Apr 9, 2012
Messages
15
Location
Seattle/Tacoma Wa
Spin it by hand to be sure it's not mechanically bound up, if not, use an ohm meter and check for shorts to ground. Double check your wiring on the unit, including the motor, might be a multiple voltage motor.
 

Crashmph

Member
Joined
Dec 15, 2008
Messages
1,515
Location
South Riding, VA
Oil... Check. That is all good.

I will have to get an amp/ohm meter, and then remember how to use the thing. LOL.

I will check to manual movement tomorrow.
 

ctubbs

Member
Joined
Sep 12, 2010
Messages
3,588
Location
Murray, Kentucky
Check to make sure you have the 2 hot wires to the correct terminals and the motor is wired for 240V. Check the name plate on the motor for correct wiring and current draw. Does the compressor actually spin or is it locked up? check that the motor is single phase and not 3 phase.
Charles
 

jttheclockman

Member
Joined
Feb 22, 2005
Messages
19,083
Location
NJ, USA.
Unit is under warrenty. Bring it back why mess with it??? Many things can be wrong as has been mentioned. If a dual voltage motor it could have been factory wired wrong. Plug the unit in and have the switch in off position. Does it trip the breaker?? If so then you have a ground somewhere. Open air tank before turning on. Should be no air. Could be misalignment thus stalling the motor. Is the belt on properly. See if you can spin by hand, make sure power is off or unplugged. Take belt off compressor and try the motor. If that trips breaker you know it is somewhere from the motor back. Good luck.
 
Last edited:

frank123

Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2012
Messages
613
Location
Colorado
Try running it with the valve open to see if it trips without a load on it as well as with a load on it.

But assuming your circuit is good and doesn't have a problem, I'd suspect a defective compressor. Don't tinker with it, you may void the warranty.
 

PTsideshow

Member
Joined
Dec 26, 2011
Messages
1,033
Location
Macomb County Michigan
If you got it at Home Despot, take it back and shop somewhere else. As the local one had a rebuilt they were selling as new when I pointed it out to the manger he said tough sh*t, you aren't buying it. They will put problem big ticket tools back on the store sale floor that are returned. According to one of the help there. The main office just gave me the run around phone tag when I called. They hope that the people buying the non working ones will follow thru with the factory warranty.
:clown:
 

Crashmph

Member
Joined
Dec 15, 2008
Messages
1,515
Location
South Riding, VA
I may end up taking this thing back to HD. It was a great deal at $300 as it was the floor model, and it was "Black Friday" weekend (bought it on Sunday).

Here are some pictures to go with what I have done to get this working. I am not an electrician, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express once... I will not be offended, so please anyone with the knowledge, please tell me what I am doing wrong here.

Here is a video of the motor getting turned on and then tripping the breaker after a few seconds. AC tripping breaker. - YouTube You can even see the breaker trip in the upper right corner of the video. Also, I removed the belt connecting the motor to the pump just to remove the pump from the equation.

AC Remote Breaker Panel.jpg
Remote Breaker Panel for the AC. For some reason this picture is turned sideways, but you can still see it for what is needed.

AC Motor Plate.jpg
Motor Info... This is a bit of conflicting information. The manual states that this unit will ONLY run on 240V, and there is sticker on the motor wiring cover that states 230V (you can see a little of this sticker in the next photo).

AC Motor Wiring.jpg
Wiring on the motor... Everything was wired up like this when I bought it, and I have verified that it looks like this in the manual too.

AC Switch Wiring Overhead.jpg
Switch Wiring Overhead view... I know I have a conduit grommet on there for the wiring pass through; it was what I had laying around at the house. If I can get this working, I will replace it with a proper wire grommet. The screw on the left, just above the pressure release valve is the pressure adjustment screw for the switch. Per the manual, this screw being set too high could cause the breaker to trip so I have it turned all the way down to the bottom at its lowest setting.

AC Swtich Wiring Sideview.jpg
Another view to see the wiring a little more cleanly.
 

Crashmph

Member
Joined
Dec 15, 2008
Messages
1,515
Location
South Riding, VA
Michael, looks to me like the lable says 120 volts, this may be your problem?
Agree that this could be an issue but then there is this on the Wiring Plate cover that states 230V Only
AC wiring cover plate.jpg


Been following your thread on this. Trace your wires coming into the remote breaker back to the main panel. Where is this white wire connected in the main panel?

Here is what the Sub Panel in the garage looks like. Some background on the this sub panel... It is a 100A panel fed from the main in the basement of the house. I have dedicated runs to every outlet in the garage for the 220V outlets and only two outlets to each of the 20A 110V breakers.
Garage Subpanel Marked.jpg
I edited to photo to put labels to see what I am talking about... Remember, I am not an electrician, but I can follow instructions most of the time.
Each of my 220V two-poll runs use 12/2 wiring and the white wire has electrical tape every other inch or so to label it as HOT and not neutral. The Dust Collector has a 30A breaker with 10/3 wire. The AC is on the bottom right with 10/2 wire. I was lazy and did not put black tape on there, will have that fixed later.

And here we can see the new not working next to the old still working AC.
AC new and old.jpg
 

PenMan1

Member
Joined
Jul 8, 2009
Messages
6,380
Location
Eatonton, Georgia
Simple "black box" trouble shooting, remove the belt and see if just running the motor with no load trips the circuit. Do this AFTER you have verified (with meter) that you have 230V.

If the breaker still "kicks" you have a motor wiring problem. If not the problem is likely with the compressor head.
 

frank123

Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2012
Messages
613
Location
Colorado
What kind of plug did the compressor come with?

120 and 240 should be using different plugs that won't plug into one another and the motor plate does seem to say it is a 110 motor on it. I'd trust the motor id plate before I'd trust an instruction manual.
 

NewLondon88

Local Chapter Leader
Joined
May 15, 2008
Messages
5,077
Location
Claremont NH
I'd take it back.. (Campbell Hausfeld discontinued that motor)
That motor can be wired 120 or 240, but should be marked the way
it was wired. (not marked 120 and wired 240) so you're not really
sure what is going on yet. I wouldn't monkey with it
 

Crashmph

Member
Joined
Dec 15, 2008
Messages
1,515
Location
South Riding, VA
Simple "black box" trouble shooting, remove the belt and see if just running the motor with no load trips the circuit. Do this AFTER you have verified (with meter) that you have 230V.

If the breaker still "kicks" you have a motor wiring problem. If not the problem is likely with the compressor head.
In the video linked in a previous post of this thread, I have the motor running without the belt connecting it to the pump to remove the pump from the equation...

If you click on each picture, you will see the letters on each of the connections. Each of the connections were measured with a multimeter...

AC Motor Wiring lettered.jpg
A + B = 122V
A + C = 123V
B + C = 246V

AC Remote Breaker Panel lettered.jpg
A + B = 246V
A + C = 123V
B + C = 123V
With the breaker switched ON
E + F = 246V
D + E = 123V
D + F = 123V

AC Switch Wiring Overhead lettered.jpg
A + B = 246V
A + C = 123V
B + C = 122V

Garage Subpanel lettered.jpg
A + B = 246V
A + C = 123V
B + C = 123V
 

frank123

Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2012
Messages
613
Location
Colorado
Tried to find the motor on the Marathon site but is doesn't seem to be working. Maybe try giving them a call tomorrow about the voltage?
 

Crashmph

Member
Joined
Dec 15, 2008
Messages
1,515
Location
South Riding, VA
I'd take it back.. (Campbell Hausfeld discontinued that motor)
That motor can be wired 120 or 240, but should be marked the way
it was wired. (not marked 120 and wired 240) so you're not really
sure what is going on yet. I wouldn't monkey with it
There were no plug wires with the AC when I bought it. I have it plugged directly to a remote breaker panel.
 

PenMan1

Member
Joined
Jul 8, 2009
Messages
6,380
Location
Eatonton, Georgia
Thanks, Michael. I missed the You Tube video.

Two quick thoughts:
1: The old working compressor, next to the new one: Is it functioning properly? Is it also 220? What does the motor tag on this unit say?

2. Is it possible to "hand truck" the compressor over to the 30 amp dust collector connection? If it doesn't work there, I'd almost bet on "bad motor".

As Charlie said, HD did have some compressor motor issues at one point. Maybe this could be one of them?
 

frank123

Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2012
Messages
613
Location
Colorado
I'd take it back.. (Campbell Hausfeld discontinued that motor)
That motor can be wired 120 or 240, but should be marked the way
it was wired. (not marked 120 and wired 240) so you're not really
sure what is going on yet. I wouldn't monkey with it
There were no plug wires with the AC when I bought it. I have it plugged directly to a remote breaker panel.


Wont hurt to give it a short try, so change it over to 120 and see if that solves the problem (I suspect it will since the motor id is for that voltage). If it was a floor model it could have a compromised history and have been rewired by someone at some point, and possibly more than once, which could explain the conflicting voltage tag.
 

AKBeaver

Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2009
Messages
142
Location
Suffolk, VA (Alaska in heart and mind)
The video helps. It is running fine, then you hear clicks then all goes quit, then another click. You have 2caps, one is the start cap and the other is the run cap. I believe that once the motor gets up to speed and the start cap is disconnected and the run cap is brought into circuit, is when the breaker trips.


Check to make sure all wiring connections to the caps and the pressure switch are solid. If everything is good, then I suggest you take it back for a replacement. As stated earlier, the motor is no longer used by C&H, and the parts list on the HD website lists a different motor.

Fyi, The date code in the Marathon model number shows it was made in Sept of '98

Sent from my iPad using Forum Runner
 

AKBeaver

Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2009
Messages
142
Location
Suffolk, VA (Alaska in heart and mind)
Is there a wiring diagram on the inside of the cover plate, with the 230 volt only sticker on it? I would think there would be one to select 120 or 240 volt operation. The owner manual online is for the newer motors, which may be auto sensing for voltage. You have the old motor and you may have to move the motor wires to different taps for 240 volts.

If there is no wiring diagram, go ahead and try to run it on a 120 volt circuit. White to white and black to black at the pressure switch.

If it still trips the breakers, take it back.

Sent from my iPad using Forum Runner
 
Last edited:

Talfalfa33

Member
Joined
Feb 19, 2012
Messages
141
Location
Dallas, Tx
Hello, I agree with Charles. Sounds like you have a hot wire and the common wire switched. Once you figure out witch one is your common, generally it's white, just switch it and you should be good to go.
 

airborne_r6

Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2008
Messages
279
Its a 120V ONLY motor. I don't care what the manual or any stickers say, the motor plate only says 120V, and the diagram of the motor wiring doesn't show on option of 230V. Switch it to 120V and it should work fine. The easy way to do that to check is simply pull the white wire out of the breaker and stick it in the neutral bar. If that works, then you can fix all of the wiring so that it is properly wired 120V. It is not a 120/230V motor, if it were in fact a 120/230V motor the motor plate would look like this showing both voltages:
0003_Motor_Plate_DSC4374.JPG


If it was sold to you as a 120/230V compressor, take it back and quit futzing with it. It is very clearly a 120V ONLY compressor.
 

airborne_r6

Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2008
Messages
279
What kind of plug did the compressor come with?

120 and 240 should be using different plugs that won't plug into one another and the motor plate does seem to say it is a 110 motor on it. I'd trust the motor id plate before I'd trust an instruction manual.

What he said, trust the motor plate.

I'd take it back.. (Campbell Hausfeld discontinued that motor)
That motor can be wired 120 or 240, but should be marked the way
it was wired. (not marked 120 and wired 240) so you're not really
sure what is going on yet. I wouldn't monkey with it

This is wrong, the motor plate does not show a 240V option.

The video helps. It is running fine, then you hear clicks then all goes quit, then another click. You have 2caps, one is the start cap and the other is the run cap. I believe that once the motor gets up to speed and the start cap is disconnected and the run cap is brought into circuit, is when the breaker trips.


Check to make sure all wiring connections to the caps and the pressure switch are solid. If everything is good, then I suggest you take it back for a replacement. As stated earlier, the motor is no longer used by C&H, and the parts list on the HD website lists a different motor.

Fyi, The date code in the Marathon model number shows it was made in Sept of '98

Sent from my iPad using Forum Runner

Why worry about the start/run capacitors when its wired to the wrong voltage, also, if its a brand new motor and the capacitors are bad, take it back, don't worry about fixing them.

Hello, I agree with Charles. Sounds like you have a hot wire and the common wire switched. Once you figure out witch one is your common, generally it's white, just switch it and you should be good to go.

Switching the hot and common would do absolutely nothing.
 

jttheclockman

Member
Joined
Feb 22, 2005
Messages
19,083
Location
NJ, USA.
I can not believe you are even doing what you are doing. You will void the warrenty the more you play with this thing. Take it back for Pete's sake. It is under warrenty. Too many want to be electricians here. Do this before you get hurt. If this unit is suspect as I see it is I won't trust it even if you get it running. This is a large tank on there. If it has been damaged or misused being a floor model I would not want that bomb sitting in my shop. Buying cheap doesn't always pay off. Be careful. There is way too much conflicting info on this motor. Buy from someone who knows what they are talking about. I agree about the motor label this to me shows it is a 120 volt unit only.
 
Last edited:

Crashmph

Member
Joined
Dec 15, 2008
Messages
1,515
Location
South Riding, VA
I agree about the motor label this to me shows it is a 120 volt unit only.

I appreciate all of the help on here from everyone. There is just too much wrong with the AC. I called and talked to a local AC and Tool repair shop, and the consensus was that this AC is "tainted". Motor not matching write and other such issues.

Now... anyone want to help load this thing up to go back to home depot? I will by buying non-floor model now.

Thanks for the help everyone!
 
Last edited:

jttheclockman

Member
Joined
Feb 22, 2005
Messages
19,083
Location
NJ, USA.
I agree about the motor label this to me shows it is a 120 volt unit only.

I appreciate all of the help on here from everyone. There is just too much wrong with the AC. I called and talked to a local AC and Tool repair shop, and the consensus was that this AC is "tainted". Motor not matching write and other such issues.

Now... anyone want to help load this thing up to go back to home depot? I will by buying non-floor model now.

Thanks for the help everyone!



If you were closer I would be more than happy to help you get that back to Home Depot and also talk to a manager there for sure. That tool does not belong on the floor again. Reduced or not.
 

Crashmph

Member
Joined
Dec 15, 2008
Messages
1,515
Location
South Riding, VA
That tool does not belong on the floor again. Reduced or not.

Agreed!

Worst part is that I already have it concrete anchored to the floor with the rubber pads and everything. Had to borrow a hammer drill to drill the holes too. Guess I at least have the anchors all ready to go for the replacement.

Since HD has been a little less than honest about this last purchase... I will be getting this Kobalt one instead at Lowes. It is the same series of re-branded Campbell Hausfeld Air Compressor.

Michael
 

jttheclockman

Member
Joined
Feb 22, 2005
Messages
19,083
Location
NJ, USA.
That tool does not belong on the floor again. Reduced or not.

Agreed!

Worst part is that I already have it concrete anchored to the floor with the rubber pads and everything. Had to borrow a hammer drill to drill the holes too. Guess I at least have the anchors all ready to go for the replacement.

Since HD has been a little less than honest about this last purchase... I will be getting this Kobalt one instead at Lowes. It is the same series of re-branded Campbell Hausfeld Air Compressor.

Michael


I just happened to be in Home Depot today looking for some paneling. I happened to stop by the tool department and saw those compressors and every one had a 120 volt name tag on the motor. A Larger unit next to them had a 220 volt tag which I can understand because it was a larger unit. Maybe someone got the booklets mixed up. :confused:

Look at the Lowes one the same way because they look like clones.

May I ask what it is that you do that needs such a unit?? These are noisy as is every oiless unit. I have a CH 20 gal that is oiless but I use it outdoors for spraying lacquers. Filling those tanks and draining them tends to leave alot of water residue and leads to rusting. Make sure you get a water filter. I have a smaller oil filled unit I use indoors in my shop and is enough to power any nailer I need. Have a oiless Dewalt for the portable jobs that come up now and again.


Good luck.
 

PenPal

Member
Joined
Nov 29, 2006
Messages
2,708
Location
Canberra, A.C.T., Australia.
John,

The brief on the compressor said it was an oiler, not oilless therefor unsuitable for etc etc, my experiences with a Durr oilless compressor tells me it is quieter than conventional compressors by a long way. Mind you my compressor twin was from a working Dentistry and peripheral noise is discouraged anyway. A real bargain is rare in hardware especially quality motors.

IMHO the purchaser of the problem unit was duped internally by the firm in the first place all the effort put into this stage substantial and more than fair if the request for a refund takes place. Yes we are all would be tinkerers with electricity especially in the United States where
so many people do their own wiring. Our 240v, 415v three phase and as an Electrician for over
fifty years tells me trying to save on lethal products can have dire results.

I do encourage determining facts however the supplier has an even more serious duty of care in selling potentially incorrect information in this case a warning to me would have been flagged with the unit not having a proper plug open wire at purchase.

Dare say the resulting conversations all prove my point with so much conjecture, imagine if a Doctor were to give out information on do it yourself operations the end result could have been the same or worse than this incident.

A trend on the forum is to seek the highest price squeeze the supplier to multiply the profit
on pens etc as fair game. In this country going down the gurgler follows when specialist suppliers find so many do it your dangerous selfers abide in their customers.

Enjoy a prosperous New Year as well as a safer Xmas period.

Kind regards Peter.
 

jttheclockman

Member
Joined
Feb 22, 2005
Messages
19,083
Location
NJ, USA.
John,

The brief on the compressor said it was an oiler, not oilless therefor unsuitable for etc etc, my experiences with a Durr oilless compressor tells me it is quieter than conventional compressors by a long way. Mind you my compressor twin was from a working Dentistry and peripheral noise is discouraged anyway. A real bargain is rare in hardware especially quality motors.

IMHO the purchaser of the problem unit was duped internally by the firm in the first place all the effort put into this stage substantial and more than fair if the request for a refund takes place. Yes we are all would be tinkerers with electricity especially in the United States where
so many people do their own wiring. Our 240v, 415v three phase and as an Electrician for over
fifty years tells me trying to save on lethal products can have dire results.

I do encourage determining facts however the supplier has an even more serious duty of care in selling potentially incorrect information in this case a warning to me would have been flagged with the unit not having a proper plug open wire at purchase.

Dare say the resulting conversations all prove my point with so much conjecture, imagine if a Doctor were to give out information on do it yourself operations the end result could have been the same or worse than this incident.

A trend on the forum is to seek the highest price squeeze the supplier to multiply the profit
on pens etc as fair game. In this country going down the gurgler follows when specialist suppliers find so many do it your dangerous selfers abide in their customers.

Enjoy a prosperous New Year as well as a safer Xmas period.

Kind regards Peter.


Peter

I am not quite sure what you said but I did go back and read the specs and you are correct in that it is an oil machine so yes it should be quieter. I did not look at the cap that was on the end of the chord while I was in the store. All I looked at was the name tag. I was in a hurry to get out of there. That would have been another clue if it was 120volts. Way too many issues with that unit is the way I looked at it. For a brand new tool not to work rasises questions from the get go. I think I would have tried it before bolting it down but still that should not be an issue to get his money back.

And I agree with way too many people doing their own electrical work when not qualified. I have seen some horrendous fire potential situations in my career. I have said this before on this site and others. When people ask for electrical advice the best I can give them is seek a qualified electrician in their area and pay the person. It is worth it in the long run. Electricity is nothing to fool with. There are times when advice is given but small steps or factors are left out because the person giving them knows but forgets to mention them and they can become lethal.

Thanks for clearing that up. I misspoke on the oil thing.
 

NewLondon88

Local Chapter Leader
Joined
May 15, 2008
Messages
5,077
Location
Claremont NH
I'd take it back.. (Campbell Hausfeld discontinued that motor)
That motor can be wired 120 or 240, but should be marked the way
it was wired. (not marked 120 and wired 240) so you're not really
sure what is going on yet. I wouldn't monkey with it

This is wrong, the motor plate does not show a 240V option.

No, it doesn't. The website says that this a 120/240 motor and can be
wired either way. That's why it doesn't make sense to me. Something
is hinky... I wouldn't trust it.
 

Charlie_W

Member
Joined
Nov 16, 2011
Messages
5,918
Location
Sterling, VA USA
I agree about the motor label this to me shows it is a 120 volt unit only.

I appreciate all of the help on here from everyone. There is just too much wrong with the AC. I called and talked to a local AC and Tool repair shop, and the consensus was that this AC is "tainted". Motor not matching write and other such issues.

Now... anyone want to help load this thing up to go back to home depot? I will by buying non-floor model now.

Thanks for the help everyone!
If you can wait a week or two, I would be glad to help. I am in Sterling. PM me if interested. I do have a trailer.
 
Signed-In Members Don't See This Ad
Top Bottom