gun stock finishes

[Tonto]

Has anyone tried products meant for gunstock finishes? As I read product descriptions it seems that these might be great for wood pens as well. Hard, impervious and quick drying....wonder if anyone has experience and recommendation before I dive in. Thanks...

 

[Dario]

Check with Frank (Rifleman).

 

[jwoodwright]

I bought a kit at Wally World. I followed the steps and it was a three day process. Turns out to be an oil finish. Was finally dry about a week later. Buffed out well.

So, I went back to Russ Fairfield's Friction Polish Formula... (It's on his site, DNA, BLO and Shellac)

 

[Sfolivier]

A friend of mine really is into WWII guns restoration. Most of the finishes we talked about were BLO based. Although there are different mixes (some of them very secret ), they all seem to be oil based. We tried one of the BLO gun blend on a slimline and it didn't turn out too well. It probably wasn't designed for small objects.

 

[RussFairfield]

All gunstock finishes are an oil of some kind, usually Linseed Oil that has been modified. You will have better luck with an oil finish like Waterlox or a Poly finish because the added varnish resins will make a harder surface that will buff to a higher gloss than the gunstock oils.

Like all oil finishes, they will darken the wood.

A good way to use them on a pen is to sand the blanks to 12,000 Micro-Mesh, soak them in the oil finish for an hour, remove, wipe off the excess, and let them sit for a week to cure.

Buff with steel wool to make sure the oils are cured. If a white powder comes off, they are ready for buffing. If they are gummy, wait another week. Check again, and then buff with Tripoli and White Diamond on Bealle or similar buffing wheels.

It is a fairly easy finish that looks good, but it is spread over a week or two. That kills it for most folks.

 

[jwoodwright]

Thanks for clearing that up Russ. I've learned so much. I appreciate you sharing.

 

[Rifleman1776]

The "hard and durable" finishes seen on modern guns are more of a plastic than anything else. I hate them. The time proven oil finish has been around for centuries. Use only top quality boiled linseed oil a/k/a BLO. The best available is Birchwood Casey's Lin-Speed. I don't know what they do to it to make it better than others but it is highly regarded as the best. Period. An advantage of the oil finish is that more can be rubbed in at any time. That means 'any time' over a period of years and centuries.

 

[edstreet]

WW2 was the turning point in gunstock finishes. Pre-ww2 it was BLO based and took forever for it to try. started with ww2 onwards it was more of a tung oil based which dries faster but you can add things that will force it to dry faster. Products like danish oil is also good stuff to use. Personally I would stay away from the Birchwood Casey products.

Also worth mention is the black powder era used aquafortis on maple to bring up the flame with stunning details.

One of the best dressings I have seen to date is a equal blend of turpentine, bees wax and BLO/tung oil. heat it up and blend it and apply like shoe polish while warm and pliable as when it hardens it's like a brick. It will give the wood item a glow unlike anything else.

Ed

 

[Rifleman1776]

Originally posted by edstreet

WW2 was the turning point in gunstock finishes. Pre-ww2 it was BLO based and took forever for it to try. started with ww2 onwards it was more of a tung oil based which dries faster but you can add things that will force it to dry faster. Products like danish oil is also good stuff to use. Personally I would stay away from the Birchwood Casey products.

Also worth mention is the black powder era used aquafortis on maple to bring up the flame with stunning details.

One of the best dressings I have seen to date is a equal blend of turpentine, bees wax and BLO/tung oil. heat it up and blend it and apply like shoe polish while warm and pliable as when it hardens it's like a brick. It will give the wood item a glow unlike anything else.

Ed

We come close to agreeing on most of what you said. I'll stand by Tru-Oil as a favorite of many, if not most, gunstockers.
Dilute nitric acid is still used by those who build traditional style rifles and it works just fine. Takes patience but results can be stunning.
The WWII era oil was probably not the 'boiled' linseed. And, yes, it often stayed sticky for life as will low quality ones to this day.
The general formula you gave for the beeswax finish is popular and has variations. In a few days I'm being given a 5 gal. bucket of beeswax and will make some of my own finish. And, maybe a little to trade or sell.
See below for an example of what the acid can do with curley maple.

 

[Hello]

ok, so the question is.....where do I get bees wax?

 

[Sfolivier]

What do you mean by nitric acid? Just as a way to bring the figure up before finishing, or part of the finish?

 

[Jarheaded]

Frank, I have a good sized collection of weapons and I have nothing with that caliber of finish. That is a beautiful stock. Any chance that it might be for sale or is there a way to make another one? That would look great on my antique side by side 16 gauge that is hanging on the wall but is still very usable(but won't be used).

 

[Rifleman1776]

Originally posted by Hello

ok, so the question is.....where do I get bees wax?

Uh-Oh! [:0] Was that a straight line?
Lemmee put it this way: not from cows.
Seriously, I get it from beekeepers. See your county extension agent and ask for the names of beekeepers in your county and start calling. Many consider it a nuisance by-product of producing honey. What they will give you, or sell very reasonably, must be cleaned. That is done by CAREFULLY melting and skimming dross off the top. I mean carefully because it is highly flammable stuff when melted.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Originally posted by Jarheaded

Frank, I have a good sized collection of weapons and I have nothing with that caliber of finish. That is a beautiful stock. Any chance that it might be for sale or is there a way to make another one? That would look great on my antique side by side 16 gauge that is hanging on the wall but is still very usable(but won't be used).

I'll contact you, off forum.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Originally posted by Sfolivier

What do you mean by nitric acid? Just as a way to bring the figure up before finishing, or part of the finish?

I think nitric acid can be bought at large hardware stores. It is used for cleaning concrete. You will have to check around.
Enneyhow...the technique is simple but laborious. When your stock is finished and sanded, dilute the nitric acid quite a bit. No set ratio, whatever works for you. Apply to the wood and wait a bit. The stripes will darken a little. Continue applying, each time the stripes will darken some more. When the desired degree of color is achieved. Rinse with a neutralizer. Of course, you have wet the wood and will need to sand again. However, the stock you see was wet, sanded, wet again, sanded again numerous times. Each wetting raised 'hairs' which had to be removed. Some old time makers use broken glass and rub/scrape the hairs off to achieve a final smooth surface. Many-many hours can be invested in a project like that.

 

[Hello]

Frank, why nitric acid for making the grain pop that way? why not a sanding sealer? what do you dilute the nitric acid with?

 

[Dario]

Originally posted by edstreet

One of the best dressings I have seen to date is a equal blend of turpentine, bees wax and BLO/tung oil. heat it up and blend it and apply like shoe polish while warm and pliable as when it hardens it's like a brick. It will give the wood item a glow unlike anything else.

Ed

Ed,

Interesting. Happens that I have a few beeswax cakes, Tung Oil and Turpentine so this should be an easy experiment.

One question...is it usable only shortly after making the blend or will it store for long? I surely don't want to make/blend each time I need some.

Thanks.

 

[ranchonodinero]

What about "tru-oil"? I've used it for a guitar neck with great results and of course on gunstocks-seems like it would be very durable but would require several coats in order to build up the finish.

 

[edstreet]

Originally posted by Dario

Ed,

Interesting. Happens that I have a few beeswax cakes, Tung Oil and Turpentine so this should be an easy experiment.

One question...is it usable only shortly after making the blend or will it store for long? I surely don't want to make/blend each time I need some.

Thanks.

It is mostly a 'dressing' and it will harden up like bee's wax when you get it. Each time you use it you will have to heat it up to a paste form and add stuff as needed.

Bee wax can be purchased at any craft store.


Rifleman1776, I figured the tru-oil comment would draw fire from some. I say if it works for then then superb and keep it up. Where most people go wrong with BLO or tung oil is in the hand rub part, they fail to generate adequate heat from their hands when rubbing it in. that is how/why it dries. It will feel slightly oily for the first day after application but after that it's dry.

Acid is well known for maple and you will get some stunning effects from it. It is the best treatment I have seen to date, somewhere is a board of test blocks. I will see if I can find it to post. I saw it on the muzzle loading forum a few ago.

Ed

 

[Rifleman1776]

Originally posted by Hello

Frank, why nitric acid for making the grain pop that way? why not a sanding sealer? what do you dilute the nitric acid with?

The why is because that is what was found a couple centuries ago that works on figured maple. How? Ask a scientist, I dunno. Dilute with water. Be careful. If you pour water into the acid, or the other way around, it is dangerous. I can never remember which is right and must look it up each time.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Originally posted by Dario

Originally posted by edstreet

One of the best dressings I have seen to date is a equal blend of turpentine, bees wax and BLO/tung oil. heat it up and blend it and apply like shoe polish while warm and pliable as when it hardens it's like a brick. It will give the wood item a glow unlike anything else.

Ed

Ed,

Interesting. Happens that I have a few beeswax cakes, Tung Oil and Turpentine so this should be an easy experiment.

One question...is it usable only shortly after making the blend or will it store for long? I surely don't want to make/blend each time I need some.

Thanks.

Stores well.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Originally posted by edstreet

Originally posted by Dario

Ed,

Interesting. Happens that I have a few beeswax cakes, Tung Oil and Turpentine so this should be an easy experiment.

One question...is it usable only shortly after making the blend or will it store for long? I surely don't want to make/blend each time I need some.

Thanks.

It is mostly a 'dressing' and it will harden up like bee's wax when you get it. Each time you use it you will have to heat it up to a paste form and add stuff as needed.

Bee wax can be purchased at any craft store.


Rifleman1776, I figured the tru-oil comment would draw fire from some. I say if it works for then then superb and keep it up. Where most people go wrong with BLO or tung oil is in the hand rub part, they fail to generate adequate heat from their hands when rubbing it in. that is how/why it dries. It will feel slightly oily for the first day after application but after that it's dry.

Acid is well known for maple and you will get some stunning effects from it. It is the best treatment I have seen to date, somewhere is a board of test blocks. I will see if I can find it to post. I saw it on the muzzle loading forum a few ago.

Ed

Agreed. Especially the hand rubbing part. It is often an almost ritual, when a buckskinner (reenactor) has just finished, or bought, a new rifle, he will bring it to camp. At night around the fire, the rifle will get passed around. Every man there takes a turn adding and rubbing in some oil. This not only makes a fine stock with a glowing finish, it personalizes the gun for it's proud new owner. The hand rubbing helps/makes the oil penetrate the wood.

 

[loglugger]

I have gotton nitric acid from a swimming pool maintence shop.
Bob

 

[ranchonodinero]

A reputable guitar body/neck manufacturer will warrant their necks finished with tru-oil, but NOT BLO as in their opinion, BLO does not protect nor seal as well as tru-oil. I've also heard complaints that BLO can take too long to dry and is very environment dependent on the drying process. I found tru-oil fast drying and when polished with the included polish, to be very smooth and slick feeling. Has anyone tried the tru-oil polish on a pen?

 

[RHossack]

Originally posted by Rifleman1776
Dilute nitric acid is still used by those who build traditional style rifles and it works just fine. Takes patience but results can be stunning.
See below for an example of what the acid can do with curley maple.

While I've had zero luck in finding nitric acid around this neck of the woods I have come across Chromium Trioxide which is supposed to get similar results.

Anyone familiar with this product?

 

[PaulDoug]

I have absolutly nothing to add, just wanted to say what a great thread! Thanks all for the interesting input. And WOW, that is one of the most beautiful rifle stocks I have ever seen. Got a picture of "The Rest of the Rifle"?

 

[Rifleman1776]

Originally posted by PaulDoug

I have absolutly nothing to add, just wanted to say what a great thread! Thanks all for the interesting input. And WOW, that is one of the most beautiful rifle stocks I have ever seen. Got a picture of "The Rest of the Rifle"?

I need a set for the record. I'll take some and post later.

 

[edstreet]

Frank/Riffleman1776, Get some bitchwood casey plumb brown and look at the ingredience main ingred. 'nitric acid'

 

[MDWine]

Frank, when do we get to see the rest of that smoke pole?

 

[Rifleman1776]

Originally posted by MDWine

Frank, when do we get to see the rest of that smoke pole?

I almost forgot I promised to do this. Hopefully soon. My mower had been out of service and my lawn hadn't been cut yet this season. Got it fixed yesterday and did some cutting. More today. Maybe later.
I'm not familiar with the chromium trioxide process but can make inquiries of those would know, I belong to two muzzle loading and one gunsmithing forum(s).

 

[edstreet]

what is the 2nd muzzleloading forum?

 

[Rifleman1776]

Originally posted by edstreet

what is the 2nd muzzleloading forum?

Muzzle Loading International and
Muzzle Loaders Emporium
both at Yahoo