Buffing System??

[btboone]

I ordered material from MSC at 8:00pm. They said it would be here tomorrow. I love those guys! In all the years I've ordered from them, they almost always have stuff in stock, and I (being in Atlanta near their hub) always get things the next day. If anyone hasn't checked them out, they need to. They have a huge warehouse, probably over 500,000 sq feet with stuff stacked to the ceiling. Milling machines are stacked 5 high on the shelves. Pretty impressive.

I'll hack some out with Fred as my mentor and I'll put them on a secret page on my site where they can be ordered using any of the payment forms.

 

[Fred in NC]

Hehe, Bruce.. mentor? more like tinkerer!!!!

 

[GregMuller]

OK i will can the router motor and i will take a pair of the mandrels.

 

[RussFairfield]

UHMW?? CNC?? Wow, you guys are getting high tech about these things. I made mine from a piece of old closet rod the fit the roller and stuck the roller to it with RTV.

 

[btboone]

Yes, nothing but high tech all the way. An all titanium version is available for the hard core turners. []
I'll try to have some by this weekend. I'll send my first ones to Fred so he can test them out. (My lathe doesn't have a morse taper, so I don't use normal mandrel systems.)

 

[btboone]

Hey Fred, The mandrels are in the mail. They look like they should work OK.

 

[btboone]

Here's a pic.

 

[Fred in NC]

Wow! Bruce, that is great, I can't wait to test it! Thank you very much. I will let you know as soon as I test the parts in my lathe. Looks like they will work just fine.

 

[btboone]

Fred, You should have seen the lathe as they were turning. The plastic gets all wrapped around the part as it turns. I have to stop the program 3 times to clear the huge ball of plastic strands. It actually tripped out the lathe a couple times on the first runs. I made a couple and dialed in some dimensions. I have my secret page on my website all ready to go.

 

[Fred in NC]

Bruce, I have turned UHMW in a metal lathe. I had to cut the strands with a knife! Nylon is about the same, and so is PVC. There must be a better way, but I don't know it.

 

[woodpens]

Originally posted by btboone
<br />Fred, You should have seen the lathe as they were turning. The plastic gets all wrapped around the part as it turns. I have to stop the program 3 times to clear the huge ball of plastic strands. It actually tripped out the lathe a couple times on the first runs. I made a couple and dialed in some dimensions. I have my secret page on my website all ready to go.

Okay, where is your secret? []

 

[btboone]

The secret page: www.boonerings.com/htmpages/buffmandrels.htm

Knock three times and use the secret handshake.

 

[woodpens]

I just placed my order. I figure I will give it a shot. I hope to learn more about how people buff and what type of finish they apply before buffing.

 

[Scottydont]

I just ordered a set Bruce. Thanks!

 

[btboone]

Thank you guys. I hope they are worthy. You are the masters of this stuff. I'm just getting started.

 

[PenWorks]

Bruce, I'm impressed [^] You work faster than your CNC machine []
You have the parts cut, the web page up, you probablly cast 100 resin blanks allready and still manage to keep your ring business going []

Makes me want to throw away my Beall buff and get a FRUSS buff. []

Nice work, take a break. [] Anthony

 

[btboone]

yup. Time for sleep. I's hard to get out of "GO MODE" sometimes. I got a few tension set rings done that I was shooting to complete. Monday's a mail holiday so I wanted stuff to go out later today.

I am still waiting on my casting resin though... I ordered all the color tints. []

 

[Fred in NC]

Originally posted by btboone
<br />Here's a pic.

I just received the parts from Bruce, and they look just like the pic!
Very nice fit and workmanship!

 

[Randy_]

Not to take anything away from Bruce; but I am wondering......?? Everyone who purchased the "kit" from Bruce presumably has a lathe of their own?? Why not turn your own buffing mandrel?? I took a 13" piece of scrap 2x4, turned a taper on one end and cut it down to the ID of a paint roller.....looks sort of like a one handled rolling pin?? Took me all of 15 minutes and works like a charm!!

 

[Fred in NC]

Randy, I posted pics of my homemade wood mandrel earlier in this post. It is a 2 piece set like Bruce's.

What you are using is the same Russ' idea, with a different mandrel. As long as it works !!!

So there is a choice, make or buy!

 

[PenWorks]

Well Randy a couple of things come to mind [}]

1. Bruce needs the work to provide for his wife & family [V]

2. He makes more money making 15.00 parts than 600.00 rings []

3. Or some of us just have to have the latest in hig tech CNC machined caps to put on our paint rollers []

Sorry, just in one of those moods [}] Have a great day []

 

[Fred in NC]

Anthony, I vote for # 2 above.

 

[btboone]

#4; I love the ball of chips that come off the lathe. []

Randy, you certainly have a valid point. For those wanting to save money, the 2 x 4 mandrel is best. For those wanting to save time or have very precise machined ones, they pay for that option. I thought that there would be others with those interests in mind, so I created some. Judging from the response, I would say I was right about that. It's not really about the money (one crash of the machine would certainly negate any potential profits,) it's about having the good stuff. It's a niche, and really is more of a philosophy.

I have come to adapt the philosophy of getting the best equipment you can afford at the time. This came after being burned by a very expensive machine that wouldn't make the parts I had bought it to make. It was close to a half million dollars and payments were something like $6000 per month. [] I was eyeing a much better machine that cost a little more and would have done the job, but instead I settled. It wouldn't make the parts I bought it to make. Doh! I lost my shirt on that one, having to sell it back to the company for a huge loss, and I vowed to never do that again. I now always strive to get the best "stuff" I can afford whether the perceived difference is big or small. I don't even question it anymore. Doing that is always dependant on the financial situation at the time, which changes constantly and is certainly different for different people. I just wanted to offer a precision option to those who want it. If I did mandrel work, I know I would want one.

 

[Randy_]

For me, there are always more "wants" than there are dollars to acquire them so I have to watch my pennies pretty closely. I started this thread looking for an alternative to the Beall buffing system which would have cost me right at $100. My new buffing system....a la Russ & Fred.....will run me about $20. I'm guessing there will be very few if any folks who will be able to tell whether my pens are buffed on a Beall or a FredRuss. Eighty bucks is a lot to pay for a name and no apreciable difference in performance. That's $80 I will have to spend on a tool where the extra money WILL get me a "better" tool!! For those who chose an alternative solution to the problem, different strokes for different folks!!! []

 

[Fred in NC]

Well, Randy, THANKS !!!!!!

One more IAP invention.. the FredRuss...

Bruce, what shall we call the UHMW ones you are making?
PolyBruce?

 

[btboone]

Randy, I certainly agree that yours was money well spent. A rotating shaft is a rotating shaft. During my rant, I was reminded of another manufacturer of rings that buys the cheapest used lathes and converts them to CNC for probably less than a thousand bucks. That's fine for saving money, but it does limit him in the long run. By getting a better lathe, each and every ring I make is faster and has a much better surface finish than was possible before. This saves me tons of time and allowed me to expand my line and persue markets that I couldn't have otherwise. While yes, the payback time is longer, I feel it's worth it to get the very best tool that my livelyhood depends on. The pens are yet another unforseen benefit of getting the better lathe than what I anticipated at the time. I was agonizing at the choice of lathe when I got it. I could have gotten a used one, but I knew that the technology wasn't the same and I'd kick myself for doing it. It stored 16 programs, the one I got stores thousands, and I have written thousands of them. I also looked at one that was twice the cost because it was bigger and had live tooling. I probably would have gotten it if it didn't take 160 amps at 220 volts and I'd need to remove part of my door to get it in. The decision fell in my lap, and I'm glad I chose the lathe I did. When the cost is all divided down, the payments I need to make are something like $80 per month. Chump change in the scheme of things. The increase in capability was worth more than a hundred times that. Boone's law: when buying a piece of equipment that can matter for your future, get the best you can afford. You might be surprised at how little it costs.

Fred, how about calling them YooMoo. Kinda like UHMW but easier to say. []

 

[Fred in NC]

Good, Bruce.... the YooMoo Buffing Mandrel is born !

 

[btboone]

Or they could be called the Buff Studs. []

 

[Randy_]

BOONEBUFFS??? [][][]

 

[btboone]

[]

 

[Fleabit]

Originally posted by GregMuller
<br />OK i will can the router motor and i will take a pair of the mandrels.

Acually you can put a speed adjuster on the router. You can dial in the RPM's to almost nothing. I use one on my router. Real cheap from harbor frieght. Just make sure you don't bump the dial while buffing [B)].

 

[woodscavenger]

I am kicking myself for not seeing this thread a few days earlier. I too was looking for a low cost alternative. I have an old cheap spindle lathe collecting dust so I bought a length of 5/8" threaded rod, a few wachers and nuts, and a couple of buffing wheels at Home depot (total cost ~$20) I put one end in and old self centering metal chuck, sandwiched the wheels between the nuts and washers, and drilled a small pilot hole in the other end for the tailstock center and there you go. My version of the Beal system, but looking at yours, I thing I might have to try the paint roller system.

 

[Fred in NC]

Shane, please don't kick yourself too hard !!!

First of all, your setup is probably as good as the Beall, it all depends on the buffing wheels you got. I am sure it will work just fine.

Second, cloth wheels are great for polishing and buffing. But none that I have found are as soft as the wool paint rollers!
The WOOL paint roller is ideal for the final buffing. I put TSW on the barrels and the resulting shine is incredible!

I have actually put TSW on finished pens, and buffed them with the wool roller. CAUTION! If you do this, make SURE you hold the pen securely with BOTH hands. Otherwise you will create an IFO.

 

[Guest]

HEy Boone!
Now that you got the hi tech paint roller buffer ends to put Beall out of business how about an affordable Collet chuck,MT2 taper with adjustable fingers for under $50.00?

 

[btboone]

Eagle, you're killin' me! [] I wonder if MSC might have something?

 

[btboone]

Eagle, MSC does have the ER-20 and 25 collet series chuck available for MT2, but at a higher price. They also have the double angle DA 100 series collet chuck. The nut and split collets would be the problem for me to make. Here's something that could actually work assuming you can use a retracting bolt: http://www1.mscdirect.com/CGI/NNSRIT?PARTPG=NNSRAR2&PMPXNO=1807865

 

[Fred in NC]

Bruce, I had already suggested that to Eagle.

www.littlemachineshop.com has the same kind of collet in several sizes, for about $12 !!! It has the thread for a 3/8-16 rod drawbar. I have a couple of them, they work fine.

Personally, I think Morse tapers are not a good substitute for the tapers that were designed for collets, which have a steeper angle.

 

[Guest]

Here's the deal
Inorder to save a lot of aggrivation and get a nice fit I have found I have to drill a shell casing DEAD center to make the casing pens the way I make them.
I know a turner on another site who suggested the Beall collet system.
When I explained that funds were short,he guided me through making a "chuck" to hold the casings for drilling.(It kind of looks like the "cup from the cupa and ball game without the ball)
It has a Morse taper and a "barrel" that is turned and the I cut 8 radial kerfs on after drilling out the center for the casing.
The results have been decent but I can't help but think they would be even better with the Beall becase of the 12 jaw chuck.
I have in the past tried a Jacobs chuck with 3 contact points but wound up denting the tube.
I have seen machine collets that might work and are much less expensive that hte beall,but I don't know enough about machine tools to figure out how to attach it to a jet lathe.

 

[Fred in NC]

Eagle, the collets that Bruce and myself have pointed out to you just go in the Morse taper, and you close them with a rod thru the spindle. They will work fine with the shell casings.

 

[Guest]

You don't think 3 point contact will marr the brass?