"Just a woodworker"

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ed4copies

Local Chapter Manager
Joined
Mar 25, 2005
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24,523
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Racine, WI, USA.
Just got a call from someone's customer.

She said she has a fountain pen that "looks just like a Virage". So, she is calling ExoticBlanks because the nib on her fountain pen doesn't write very well.

I asked her if she had contacted the guy who sold her the pen and she said he knew nothing about nibs, he was "just a woodworker".

This got Dawn and I discussing what options the end user has. (She did place an order for two nibs and a converter--she plans to take out the existing nib and replace it herself) I don't know if she ACTUALLY has a virage, so I just told her that the nib and feed work together and they have to fit each other. She wanted to know if she could return the nib if it did not work, I told her we were here to help penmakers--we do not try to support end users.

The purpose of telling you all this is to warn you!! If your customer goes on-line because you tell them you CANNOT or WILL NOT support the pen they purchased from you---that customer will find Exotics. Which will tell them what you paid for all the parts you sold them, as a pen.

Protect your own best interest!!! Learn enough about pens to answer your customers' questions. In this case, have her send you the pen for an "upgrade". If you have the pen in your hands, you should know if a replacement nib will fit. If you are selling fountain pens YOU should know how to clean and replace the front end. You can easily watch YouTubes and learn all you need to know---as well as learning basic nib tuning.

THIS IS A REVENUE SOURCE FOR YOU!!!!

And it will enhance your image with your customer so they think of you as "Their pen guy" ------ NOT "Just a woodworker".


As an alternative, Exotics COULD offer basic nib tuning as a service for you, our customers. Send it to us, we will tune and bill (I'd guess about $50, including any parts we may need to change). You don't need me to do this---but do you WANT me to??

Input encouraged!!

Ed
 
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CrimsonKeel

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Mar 1, 2013
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495
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Royal oak, MI
Ill be honest I'm a noob idiot when it comes to fountain pens and what makes them tick or even what is a smooth nib verses a sort of smooth nib. I did buy a couple pens at an antique market with the intent to dissect them and see how all the parts go together to get a better idea. I guess I just think its something you need to sit down with someone who actually knows about them and have a training session to make you more comfortable till you have that AHA moment. This might be why I havent made more than one fountain pen because your right I want to know how they work myself before trying to sell them to someone else
 

duncsuss

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Jun 29, 2012
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Location
Wilmington, MA
My take on this: it's not rocket surgery. Anyone who can figure out how to power on a lathe and turn a pen without killing themself can figure out how ink gets from one end of the feed to the other and onto the paper. (And there are lots of videos on YouTube about nib tuning.)

Making and selling fountain pens without ever having used one is a bit like being a vegetarian butcher.

IMO, YMMV, etc. :biggrin:
 

PR_Princess

Member
Joined
Jun 1, 2007
Messages
2,384
Location
Sturtevant WI, USA.
I like the "vegetarian butcher" analogy. Hope you don't mind if I use that from time to time!!

Hmmm..there really is such an animal.....Actually a couple of them. But this one has an International flair...

https://www.facebook.com/vegetarianbutcher

There is also a Vegan Butcher, a Yam Chops and.......
A Monk's Meat...:rolleyes::redface:

Who said vegetarians were boring? Pass the Lamb..er Yam Chops please. :biggrin:
 

Smitty37

Passed Away Mar 29, 2018
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Location
Milford, Delaware 19963
Good advice

I have even backed off selling FP kits because I don't know enough about Fountain Pens to be very helpful dealing with problems they might have. And I have made a few that write and look pretty good. I think it's a good idea to not sell what you can't stand behind.
 

duncsuss

Member
Joined
Jun 29, 2012
Messages
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Location
Wilmington, MA
I like the "vegetarian butcher" analogy. Hope you don't mind if I use that from time to time!!
Not at all, Ed -- I probably heard it used sometime in the past.

Hmmm..there really is such an animal.....Actually a couple of them.
Doesn't surprise me -- but I wouldn't ask them for advice on which cut of brisket makes the best tsimmes.

Who said vegetarians were boring? Pass the Lamb..er Yam Chops please. :biggrin:
I would never say they are boring -- in fact some days I get so hungry I could eat a vegetarian.

:biggrin:
 

workinforwood

Member
Joined
Mar 1, 2007
Messages
8,173
Location
Eaton Rapids, Michigan, USA.
My favorite is in the movie "RV". Daughter wont eat the food served by the neighbors because she is a vegan. When one guy hears this, he says, oh...ok i got a dish with no meat you can have...so he goes gets it, she starts eating. Whats in it? Deer guts. :smile-big:

I like the "vegetarian butcher" analogy. Hope you don't mind if I use that from time to time!!

Hmmm..there really is such an animal.....Actually a couple of them. But this one has an International flair...

https://www.facebook.com/vegetarianbutcher

There is also a Vegan Butcher, a Yam Chops and.......
A Monk's Meat...:rolleyes::redface:

Who said vegetarians were boring? Pass the Lamb..er Yam Chops please. :biggrin:
 

Smitty37

Passed Away Mar 29, 2018
In Memoriam
Joined
Nov 23, 2009
Messages
12,823
Location
Milford, Delaware 19963
My favorite is in the movie "RV". Daughter wont eat the food served by the neighbors because she is a vegan. When one guy hears this, he says, oh...ok i got a dish with no meat you can have...so he goes gets it, she starts eating. Whats in it? Deer guts. :smile-big:

I like the "vegetarian butcher" analogy. Hope you don't mind if I use that from time to time!!

Hmmm..there really is such an animal.....Actually a couple of them. But this one has an International flair...

https://www.facebook.com/vegetarianbutcher

There is also a Vegan Butcher, a Yam Chops and.......
A Monk's Meat...:rolleyes::redface:

Who said vegetarians were boring? Pass the Lamb..er Yam Chops please. :biggrin:
Iwill not give my opinion of Vegans here --- this is a family forum. Besides that we are not supposed to talk about religion.
 

Carl Fisher

Member
Joined
Jun 7, 2011
Messages
2,761
Location
Cape Coral, FL
My personal opinion is if you can't take the time to learn about fountain pens, how to use them and how to tune and maintain them, you shouldn't be selling fountain pens. It's really that simple.

It doesn't take much time to educate yourself on the basics enough to have an educated discussion with the casual user and only a bit longer to hold your own with an actual enthusiast. A fountain pen should never leave your booth/website/hands without ever having been written with, tuned and then cleaned. These are all part of the reason we are able to charge more for a fountain pen than a rollerball pen. After all, it's not like the parts are that much more expensive. You're charging for the test and tune along with your knowledge.

Otherwise there are plenty of ballpoint and rollerball pens to choose from.
 

Smitty37

Passed Away Mar 29, 2018
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Location
Milford, Delaware 19963
My personal opinion is if you can't take the time to learn about fountain pens, how to use them and how to tune and maintain them, you shouldn't be selling fountain pens. It's really that simple.

It doesn't take much time to educate yourself on the basics enough to have an educated discussion with the casual user and only a bit longer to hold your own with an actual enthusiast. A fountain pen should never leave your booth/website/hands without ever having been written with, tuned and then cleaned. These are all part of the reason we are able to charge more for a fountain pen than a rollerball pen. After all, it's not like the parts are that much more expensive. You're charging for the test and tune along with your knowledge.

Otherwise there are plenty of ballpoint and rollerball pens to choose from.
I agree, but it kind of goes against history doesn't it?

When I was a young man in the late 1940s and 50s one could buy cheap Waterman fountain pens in the Mom and Pop stores on every other street corner. Buyers were expected to know how to use the pen.
 

Carl Fisher

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Yes, but with a few exceptions.

Fountain pens were standard in the 40's and 50's and kids came up through school learning how to use them. Today they are the exception and many have never written with one and rely on those they are buying from to help them learn the process.

There is also the expectation that you can pick up a mass produced "cheap Waterman" or today a platinum preppy by comparison and expect it to write well right out of the box just like a disposable bic today. If you buy a bottle of ink from Goulet and it comes with a free platinum preppy that has been converted to an eye dropper, you can bet it's been tested and writes well before it is sent to you. And that's a freebie with a $20 bottle of ink.

In this instance you have someone selling a product that is mass produced in China and typically needs a touch of massaging before sending out the door. The person creating this pen with an intent to sell should have these skills or take the time to learn them.

This is my personal opinion, but if you are going to take someone's money for a product that you create, you should know as much about that product as possible or it's a disservice to the customer.
 
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Smitty37

Passed Away Mar 29, 2018
In Memoriam
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Location
Milford, Delaware 19963
Yes, but with a few exceptions.

Fountain pens were standard in the 40's and 50's and kids came up through school learning how to use them. Today they are the exception and many have never written with one and rely on those they are buying from to help them learn the process.

There is also the expectation that you can pick up a mass produced "cheap Waterman" or today a platinum preppy by comparison and expect it to write well right out of the box just like a disposable bic today. If you buy a bottle of ink from Goulet and it comes with a free platinum preppy that has been converted to an eye dropper, you can bet it's been tested and writes well before it is sent to you. And that's a freebie with a $20 bottle of ink.

In this instance you have someone selling a product that is mass produced in China and typically needs a touch of massaging before sending out the door. The person creating this pen with an intent to sell should have these skills or take the time to learn them.

This is my personal opinion, but if you are going to take someone's money for a product that you create, you should know as much about that product as possible or it's a disservice to the customer.
No disagreement with that...

But I think the attitude regarding instructions is a cultural thing.

We even ask for things like instructions on how to drink a glass of water and a warning label if the water in a Restaurant comes from the tap.

We used to assume everyone had, "common sense". We now assume no one (even those with post graduate education) has it and that if we are not specifically told something we are too dumb to know it.

I probably won't be carrying fountain pen kits (I have a few and when they're gone I'll drop them altogether) because I can't have any assurance the the person buying them to sell as finished pens knows how to use/tune/clean them and hence sells a bad one he/she should have fixed and then disses my product because the instructions only tell him/her how to build it, giving my products a bad name.
 

Wood Butcher

Local Chapter Leader
Joined
Jun 8, 2005
Messages
970
Location
Westfield, IN, USA.
I have a fp order that has been in hand for almost a year. I have investigated and researched and bought the "tune up kit" but have not ordered the pen parts yet. The "customer" is a friend who says that I'm not to let price become an issue. I'm not sure I want to get into this because of the comments made here already. If the fp doesn't work well or stops working as expected I don't know if I want to deal with it. Of course this is a little complicated by the fact that he is a friend. Still pondering.
BTW the bumper sticker on my truck says, "VEGETARIAN: an old Indian word for poor hunter."
WB
 

Carl Fisher

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Jun 7, 2011
Messages
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Location
Cape Coral, FL
Actually I would think this puts you in a good situation to have someone you know as a "test subject" so to speak. Write with the pen first. If you feel it writes well then leave it alone and let him provide feedback. If he has issues, work with him one on one to work through them and you'll both learn.

It's selling to a complete stranger and leaving them hanging out to dry that is the concern at hand I believe. Because those people will start searching and possibly come across our vendors as outlined by Ed. I always do my best to make sure a customer contacts me first if there is ever a problem with any of their pens, fountain or otherwise.
 
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