Rewiring a JET Mini VS To Run Backward

[Randy_]

I remember seeing an article/tutorial that showed how to rewire a JET VS so it would run backward. Running backward makes for better sanding results.

Not sure whether I saw it here or somewhere else? Anyone out there who can help me find this article??

Thanks!!

 

[ed4copies]

Randy,

You probably already thought of this, but if you turn the lathe around, then plug it into an "outlet strip" with a switch on it, you can turn it off and on with that switch and it is running away from you - so you can sand. (If this is a semi-permanent use of this lathe, it is much easier than rewiring).

 

[JimM]

Randy,
I think the article you are looking for is in pdf format and is available here:

http://www.FrontRangeWoodturners.com/howto.html

 

[Randy_]

Another one of your practical jokes, Ed, or are you just confused??

 

[Randy_]

That is the information I was looking for. Think I may have seen it in a different form; but that is exactly what I needed.

 

[ed4copies]

Originally posted by Randy_

Another one of your practical jokes, Ed, or are you just confused??

"Confused" is my middle name.

But, if a lathe turns toward you, when you step to the other side (back) it is running "away" from you, as viewed from the top.

Try it, I believe I am correct this time (but I WILL test tonight).[?][?][?][?][?][?]

 

[jtate]

I don't get it. If you're using a reasonably portable lathe - like the Jet Mini, whty wouldn't it work to just pick up the whole lathe and turn it around so that the headstock is on your right instead of your left? Then the piece on it would be rotating up toward you and that's the point for the increased sanding ability isn't it?

Better yet, have your lathe on a seperate stand, not the workbench, and then just walk around to the otherside of it with your sand paper in hand.

 

[ed4copies]

Originally posted by jtate

I don't get it. If you're using a reasonably portable lathe - like the Jet Mini, whty wouldn't it work to just pick up the whole lathe and turn it around so that the headstock is on your right instead of your left? Then the piece on it would be rotating up toward you and that's the point for the increased sanding ability isn't it?

Better yet, have your lathe on a seperate stand, not the workbench, and then just walk around to the otherside of it with your sand paper in hand.

If I am wrong, at least now I have company!!!

Thanks Julia!!

 

[Blind_Squirrel]

My Nova DVR XP has forward and reverse on it. I found that the tension nut on the mandrel tends to come loose when you run it in reverse. If you are using the no-mandrel method this problem is eliminated. Also, I am used to having the lathe push from the top and pull from the bottom of the blank. To me it feels weird to pull from the top and push from the bottom.

 

[ed4copies]

Originally posted by Blind_Squirrel

My Nova DVR XP has forward and reverse on it. I found that the tension nut on the mandrel tends to come loose when you run it in reverse. If you are using the no-mandrel method this problem is eliminated. Also, I am used to having the lathe push from the top and pull from the bottom of the blank. To me it feels weird to pull from the top and push from the bottom.

Much more worrisome, your chucks will tend to come loose (from the headstock) if you have a "tool catch". Depending on your RPM's this could be VERY dangerous.

 

[Texatdurango]

Originally posted by jtate

I don't get it. If you're using a reasonably portable lathe - like the Jet Mini, whty wouldn't it work to just pick up the whole lathe and turn it around so that the headstock is on your right instead of your left? Then the piece on it would be rotating up toward you and that's the point for the increased sanding ability isn't it?

Better yet, have your lathe on a seperate stand, not the workbench, and then just walk around to the otherside of it with your sand paper in hand.

OR... just mount the lathe on a lazy susan type turntable, with a locking pin of course. Just un-pin the lathe from the table, give 'er a 180 degree spin and you're sanding backwards!

 

[Mudder]

Originally posted by ed4copies

Much more worrisome, your chucks will tend to come loose (from the headstock) if you have a "tool catch". Depending on your RPM's this could be VERY dangerous.

Ed;

The Nova has an area on the headstock that is not threaded and the chuck adapters have a setscrew in them to tighten against said non threaded portion of the headstock to keep the chuck from unwinding. [}]

 

[ed4copies]

Impressive arrangement Scott.

But it won't help Randy's Jet.

As is frequently the case, Eagle e-mailed to tell me you can sand your blank "in the other direction" by reversing it on the lathe.

My understanding was you were trying to set up a "sanding station" similar to my "buffing station" and wanted the sandpaper wheel to turn away from you, so the sawdust would not "blow in your face".

 

[Randy_]

Actually, this is not about my JET, Ed, or even about sanding. And the entire issue doesn't affect me anyway since I own a non-VS JET and a small JET dust collector. BTW, the reason folks want to sand with the lathe running in reverse is because it produces a better finished surface.....where the dust goes is really a non-issue.

Eagle is correct.....sort of. Flipping a pen blank on a mandrel or a spindle being turned between centers will allow a crafter to sand in reverse. However, it really is not a practical solution for sanding bowls and the like that are turned with a faceplate or or a chuck.

Haven't seen a follow-up comment about your experiment to determine if working from the back side of the lathe is the same thing as working with the spinning in clockwise direction? Any luck?

By way of further explanation, there was a post on another web site by a guy who removed the headstock from his JET VS and rotated it 180° so he could turn larger projects outboard of the lathe. I have been trying to convince him that there are some problems with this idea including the unhappy possibility of the chuck or faceplate unscrewing during turning. My thought was if he wanted to do outboard turning on his JET VS, changing the rotation of the motor would make it a much safer proposition.


For any who might be interested in the other discussion, you can find it here.

 

[Mudder]

Originally posted by ed4copies

Impressive arrangement Scott.

But it won't help Randy's Jet.

As is frequently the case, Eagle e-mailed to tell me you can sand your blank "in the other direction" by reversing it on the lathe.

My understanding was you were trying to set up a "sanding station" similar to my "buffing station" and wanted the sandpaper wheel to turn away from you, so the sawdust would not "blow in your face".

My point was that you could do the same thing on the Jet as the portion of the adapter that is threaded is exactly the same size. All you need is a drill, A tap & a setscrew.

And Eagle is correct, you can take everything apart and reverse the blanks. I'm too lazy to do that so I bought a machine that does it at the press of a button. Of course some will say I'm a tool snob but it's a name I can live with [8)]

Finally, I think folks like to sand in reverse because on some woods the fibers tend to "law down" and sanding in the opposite direction gives you a better chance of sanding off said fibers. Besides; if you hold the paper at the bottom in the 7 or 8 o' clock position I doubt you'll get sanding dust in the face


(ED, I'm being persnickety. Thought you would have figured it out by now. BTW: I didn't get my peppermill instructions yet [])

 

[Randy_]

Originally posted by Mudder

.....My point was that you could do the same thing on the Jet as the portion of the adapter that is threaded is exactly the same size. All you need is a drill, A tap & a setscrew......

Scott: On my JET Mini non-VS, the unthreaded portion of the spindle is only 1/8" wide. Is the VS model different?

I'm not sure you could drill and tap a properly sized hole for a set screw to catch that unthreaded shoulder as it (the hole) would be too close to the edge of the adapter. What do you think??

 

[Chuck Key]

Here is another discussion on reversing DC motors. This one cautions that the electronics on the controller needs to be set up to allow the motor to stop before changing directions other wise the current generated by the rotation of the motor will burn up the controller when the direction is changed. I don't know anything about the electronics in the Jet Mini controller but expermenting could be costly without checking out the circuits.

Here is the link: http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=281333

Chuckie

 

[Mudder]

Originally posted by Randy_

Originally posted by Mudder

.....My point was that you could do the same thing on the Jet as the portion of the adapter that is threaded is exactly the same size. All you need is a drill, A tap & a setscrew......

Scott: On my JET Mini non-VS, the unthreaded portion of the spindle is only 1/8" wide. Is the VS model different?

I'm not sure you could drill and tap a properly sized hole for a set screw to catch that unthreaded shoulder as it (the hole) would be too close to the edge of the adapter. What do you think??

Ed said

Originally posted by ed4copies



"Much more worrisome, your chucks will tend to come loose (from the headstock)"

I'm specifically talking about the chuck adapter. Drill & tap for a nylon point or a brass tipped set screw available from parts supply houses for less than $1.00.

 

[Randy_]

Originally posted by Mudder

.....I'm specifically talking about the chuck adapter. Drill & tap for a nylon point or a brass tipped set screw available from parts supply houses for less than $1.00.

Sorry. Guess I am a little dense. I'm not getting your point.

 

[Russb]

Chuckie, there is a problem if you switch from one direction to the other with the motor spinning. If you let the motor come to a stop there should be no problem. I've wired 3 Vicmarc minis with a DPDT switch as mentioned earlier with no problems. Most commercial reverse switch setups I've seen do have a switch that prevents you from going from one direction to another without a pause. I've heard a story that if you switch from one direction to the other without stopping it turns the motor into a generator and blows out the GFCI boxes on the same circuit. Just a story I heard, did it really happen, don't know.

 

[digitalmorgan]

....or he could get gravity boots and hang from the ceiling while sanding. I do NOT recommend doing this while nude! Never again!

 

[low_48]

Another way to cut off those fibers is to take a slightly damp rag and wipe down the project before the final sanding. Those fibers will swell up and when dry, cut off very easily with fine sandpaper. The process is called "whiskering".

 

[PenPal]

Randy,
I make locking safe on the threaded section by drilling,tapping then fitting a small pellet of nylon before the grub screw,saves damaging the thread and allows after removing the grub screw for the safe removal of the chuck if necessary,the nylon comes off the thread.

Regards Peter

 

[CrazyBear]

For those whos suggest simply walking round the lathe or turning the entire lathe about to sand in the opposite dirction...That wont work.

You are still sanding in the same direction. You either need to turn the BLANK around or, as is asked here, have a reverse turning setup. (I got one)[8D][8D][8D]

This allows you to sand the wood in BOTH directions and you get a MUCH smoother finish.

As for the Chuck spinning off. some chucks have a retaining nut or screw to hold them on in lathes that are designed to reverse. Otherwise move your tailstock up to stop the chuck spinning off the lathe. Turning between centres or using a mandrel stops this problem as well

 

[great12b4ever]

Maybe this is a crazy idea, and it would take a little checking, but what about getting a slightly longer v-belt and reversing one end so the two sides cross in the middle giving an X patern. This would allow the headstock, spindle and pen/bowl to spin in reverse and not have to do any wiring or worry about the controller. Most of the work would be done as usual in the forward direction, then a fairly quick belt change and Viola, reverse Just my quick thoughts.

Rob

 

[pssherman]

Originally posted by great12b4ever

Maybe this is a crazy idea, and it would take a little checking, but what about getting a slightly longer v-belt and reversing one end so the two sides cross in the middle giving an X patern. This would allow the headstock, spindle and pen/bowl to spin in reverse and not have to do any wiring or worry about the controller. Most of the work would be done as usual in the forward direction, then a fairly quick belt change and Viola, reverse Just my quick thoughts.

Rob

This won't work because the 'V' of the belt would be upside down on one of the pulleys and the friction generated at the crossing point would quickly wear the sides of the belt.

However, this would work if your lathe uses a belt with a round cross-section. You would need 2 different (lengths) belts for this.

Paul in AR

 

[great12b4ever]

Paul the "V" of the belt would NOT be upside down on one of the pulleys at all. If you took one of the belts, and twisted it to make a figure 8 the "v" would still be the turned the same way on each end. Just like you buy a bandsaw blade all nicely coiled, but the teeth are all the same way. We used to do this on shop fan motors to reverse the fans for pulling air in, or when smoke in the shop became unbearable, to push air out. In these instances we did add an idler roller to keep the belts apart where they crossed by putting a little side pressure on one of them, but we were running these for HOURS, not just a few minutes, and sanding on a VS is at slow speeds anyway. SO IT WILL WORK! Yes, you would have a friction problem, but if all you were using it for was sanding, you could get a lot of use out of it before it parted or broke. I stated in my previous post that you would need a slighly longer belt for the reverse operation, but you would use a standard belt for the forward operation.

Rob

 

[Randy_]

I think the two pulleys on the JET Mini are too close together for this to work properly.

Other thing is that changing back and forth between the longer belt and the shorter belt would be quite a headache as you would have to remove the spindle from the lathe each time you made a change.

On some lathes with the proper design, this trick could work; but it is not practical to use on the mini. Also note that the JET Mini uses a flat multi-grove belt and not a traditional V-belt.

 

[Mather323]

Thanks you for the info Randy, I get my new lathe next week and it will be rewired thanks to you.

 

[Daniel]

The idea behind sanding with the lathe in reverse is that you actually can sand in both directions. as you sand one way small wood fibers lay over rather than get cut off. reversing the sanding direction helps clean those fibers off. so you still have to sand in forward as well.

 

[Randy_]

Originally posted by Mather323

Thanks you for the info Randy, I get my new lathe next week and it will be rewired thanks to you.

Just be sure to remember the "CAUTION" that should have been mentioned earlier about changing directions while the motor is still spinning. Doing that "COULD" damage the speed control!! To be safe, you must turn the lathe off, wait for the motor to "FULLY" stop, switch directions and then turn the lathe back on.

 

[jwoodwright]

Randy, I found an article by Mack DeBose...

http://gulfcoastwoodturners.org/RESOURCES/Reversing Switch for Variable Speed Jet Mini Lathe.pdf

Hope this is what you wanted.

 

[Randy_]

Thanks, John. That is an excellent article. Think I will contact those folks and see if we can get permission to add it to our library.

 

[SteveH]

When I added the reversing switch to my Jet Mini, I used a DPDT Center Off switch. I know if you always think about it you will stop the lathe and reverse direction and restart the lathe, but I did it just to be on the safe side when I get excited.

As an aside, we have had some demonstraters at our local turners club that turn hollow forms with the lathe running in reverse, makes it easier to do.

Steve