Wild Idea - Name Change

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jeff

jeff

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Hey all... I have been thinking about something for a long time and I wanted to run it by you for comments.

I've noticed increased use of the terms "pen making" and "pen makers" rather than "pen turning" or "pen turners". Literature also uses the "making" variation more often than not. Although the turning is a big part of the equation, I think that "pen making" is possibly more descriptive of what we do.

So, what do you all think about a name change for the IAP?

What about the "International Association of Pen Makers"

A few thoughts to seed the discussion...

I own the domain penmakers.org (and it has always redirected here)

Our acronym IAP would not have to change (although there's that dangling "M" we'd need to ignore...or use one word "Penmakers")

The logo would need to be modified, but we could either modify the existing logo, or go nuts and have a logo contest.

Any and all comments, positive, negative, or neutral are welcome!
 
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Would that make my current turning smock with the current IAP logo a collectible? [}:)] Seems to me it is just a matter of semantics, and we'll probably be called different things at different times. I personally feel the current IAP brand is well established, and changing the name may cause some loss of momentum. I'd suggest that as long as the kit users out number the custom pen creators, we should stay "Pen Turners" and change once/if the tide shifts over to the custom "Pen Makers".
 
I'm for it. I tell people I "make" custom fountain and ballpoint pens, not "turn" them.

People usually come close to choking when they see the awesome pens, and only when they ask me how I do it that I do not say I "turn" them on the lathe. I say that I "machine it" on the lathe or "carve" with the lathe.

"Turn" isn't a verb that evokes a sense of "action" or "artistry". Machine and carve do. If a person were to watch what we do, they would not naturally say "he is turning wood"-- they might say carving, machining, or who knows what else.

Use words that evoke a mental image. Learn to choose your words carefully (and spell them rite). Hey, preaching class is paying off in places other than the pulpit!
 
LEAVE IT ALONE! We turn pens, all of us. If you start casting pens insted of turnig them, then you are a pen maker. Otherwise, all pens on this fourm are "turned"!
 
I'm with Curtis on this. I may be wrong but think everybody here is using a lathe of some sort to turn their pens. Besides this is not a marketing site it is a gathering of crafts people with a common interest. I think you got it right the first time Jeff and if it aint broke dont fix it.
 
I ran a Google search and had the following results:
Hits Term

490,000 for pen making
87,100 for penmaking
341,000 for pen turning
6,770 for penturning

I'm not certain if the number of hits should be a factor in determining a name change. I just did it out of curiosity.

The term "turners" or even "turning" isn't readily understood by many people in the USA, especially younger people. Sadly, many of my university students have no idea what a lathe is or even looks like. Thus, the phrase "penturning" isn't readily understood by the lay public. On the other hand, "penmaking" sounds a little less mysterious or romantic.

Frankly,I prefer the term artisan .... as in "Pen Artisans". I'm certain I'm in the minority on that descriptor.

With all of this said, I could go along with changing our name to the International Association of Penmakers.
 
Originally posted by DocStram



The term "turners" or even "turning" isn't readily understood by many people in the USA, especially younger people. Sadly, many of my university students have no idea what a lathe is or even looks like. Thus, the phrase "penturning" isn't readily understood by the lay public. On the other hand, "penmaking" sounds a little less mysterious or romantic.

Frankly,I prefer the term artisan .... as in "Pen Artisans". I'm certain I'm in the minority on that descriptor.

With all of this said, I could go along with changing our name to the International Association of Penmakers.
Click to expand...

I think Doc spelled that one out pretty well. I tell people I like to do wood turnings and get that glazed-over look (you know, the look YOU give people when they are telling you about something you do NOT understand but you are going to act like you know JUST what they are talking about).

So then I tell them I carve bowls and pens on a machine.

OH!

Then the barrage of questions come, which I am quite happy to answer.
 
Originally posted by redfishsc

I'm for it. I tell people I "make" custom fountain and ballpoint pens, not "turn" them.

People usually come close to choking when they see the awesome pens, and only when they ask me how I do it that I do not say I "turn" them on the lathe. I say that I "machine it" on the lathe or "carve" with the lathe.

"Turn" isn't a verb that evokes a sense of "action" or "artistry". Machine and carve do. If a person were to watch what we do, they would not naturally say "he is turning wood"-- they might say carving, machining, or who knows what else.

Use words that evoke a mental image. Learn to choose your words carefully (and spell them rite). Hey, preaching class is paying off in places other than the pulpit!
Click to expand...

Wait a minute, preachers as salesmen!? Now that is an image for you!! :D:D:D
 
I think telling people that I am going to turn some pens opens up an opportunity to talk about turning. Since I turn more than just pens, I consider myself a wood turner, not a wood maker. I also think that if what we did was not on the lathe, most of us wouldn't enjoy doing it. Keep it as it is.
 
Originally posted by wdcav1952



Wait a minute, preachers as salesmen!? Now that is an image for you!! :D:D:D
Click to expand...


Lol, no I don't sell Amway!

Now as far as preaching, if I can't climb into the pulpit and talk for 30-45 minutes about something that I am excited about and can talk about in interesting, powerful ways, then I have no business climbing into the pulpit.
 
I'm pretty much neutral, but leaning to the "Don't change it" side.
 
If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

This is an organization and a forum for the initiated not the general public. We know who we are. When we are presenting ourselves and what we do to a stranger (potential customer) we would have to explain what we do first, then list our credentials (number of years experience, memberships, etc.) afterward.

Every craft an profession has its jargon. Among ourselves we are penturners. Strangers will probably need an explanation regardless of the term used. Besides, we would want to hype the product (and ourselves) a bit. You might say something like, "I'm a penturner. I create unique handcrafted pens in natural and man-made materials using a lathe and a variety of other tools. I have been woodturning for 15 years and have been focusing on creating pens for the past 7 years. I have been a member of the International Association of Penturners for the last 5 years."

If a person already knows what you do, any term will work; if they don't know what you do, no term will work with out further explanation.
 
I'll go with Bob " If it ain't broke, don't fix it."

Imagine if Kraft changed their name to International Cheese Makers:D, I really don't think it would help thier business.

But... It is an excellent idea having penmakers.org redirected to this site.

Edit in:

There is already a penmakers.com and a penmakers.net, changing to penmakers.org might cause some confusion.
 
Originally posted by wdcav1952

Originally posted by redfishsc

I'm for it. I tell people I "make" custom fountain and ballpoint pens, not "turn" them.

People usually come close to choking when they see the awesome pens, and only when they ask me how I do it that I do not say I "turn" them on the lathe. I say that I "machine it" on the lathe or "carve" with the lathe.

"Turn" isn't a verb that evokes a sense of "action" or "artistry". Machine and carve do. If a person were to watch what we do, they would not naturally say "he is turning wood"-- they might say carving, machining, or who knows what else.

Use words that evoke a mental image. Learn to choose your words carefully (and spell them rite). Hey, preaching class is paying off in places other than the pulpit!
Click to expand...

Wait a minute, preachers as salesmen!? Now that is an image for you!! :D:D:D
Click to expand...
Rite,Right,, Huh!
 
Originally posted by kent4Him

I think telling people that I am going to turn some pens opens up an opportunity to talk about turning. Since I turn more than just pens, I consider myself a wood turner, not a wood maker. I also think that if what we did was not on the lathe, most of us wouldn't enjoy doing it. Keep it as it is.
Click to expand...

I vote keep it as is... Like Chris, I'm a wood turner.. pens are one of my products that I "turn" on my lathe.
 
While the new suggested name will cover some who actually make pens without turning...I believe they are in minority (probably less than 1%?) and hopefully don't feel out casted with the current name.

I too believe it is better to leave the current name as it is.
 
Pen turner, Pen crafter, Pen artisan, Pen sculptor, Pen maker, what's in a name, some just sound fancier, I'd say leave it alone too.

True, we could get carried away and come up with a hundred phrases for what we do or call ourselves but in the end we put things on a lathe and turn them. In this case, those things are pens so pen turners sounds fine to me.
 
Don't change.

I don't make anything. I buy a kit and buy/find a piece of wood or other material. I modify the material by turning/carving, Then assemble everything. So what did I make?

Some who cast their own blanks are getting closer to the description, and Skiprat may be the one closest to the Penmaker Description.
 
Originally posted by fernhills

Originally posted by wdcav1952

Originally posted by redfishsc

I'm for it. I tell people I "make" custom fountain and ballpoint pens, not "turn" them.

People usually come close to choking when they see the awesome pens, and only when they ask me how I do it that I do not say I "turn" them on the lathe. I say that I "machine it" on the lathe or "carve" with the lathe.

"Turn" isn't a verb that evokes a sense of "action" or "artistry". Machine and carve do. If a person were to watch what we do, they would not naturally say "he is turning wood"-- they might say carving, machining, or who knows what else.

Use words that evoke a mental image. Learn to choose your words carefully (and spell them rite). Hey, preaching class is paying off in places other than the pulpit!
Click to expand...

Wait a minute, preachers as salesmen!? Now that is an image for you!! :D:D:D
Click to expand...
Rite,Right,, Huh!
Click to expand...

Just using a bit of irony[:eek:)].



Even though I personally like the idea of using the term "pen crafters" or "pen makers", I'd have to say that by and large most folks here disapprove of the idea. Therefore, in the spirit of good ol' democracy (if such a thing exists) I'd say we leave it.
 
The only people I've encountered at shows who understand the term "pen turning" are other turners. I quit using that term a long time ago so I didn't have to keep explaining what "turning" is. I have yet to encounter anyone who really cares how I produce the pen, they only care what it looks like, how it feels in their hand and how it writes. I don't understand what the hang-up is on using maker instead of turner. What about saddle makers? You can buy a saddle made by the thousands by a manufacturer or you can buy a custom saddle from a saddle maker. How is that really different? You can buy a pen made by a pen manufacturer or you can buy a custom pen from a pen maker/turner.
 
Thanks for all the comments. I think we'll leave well enough alone!

penmakers.org and pencrafters.org have both redirected here for years.

Thanks for all the opinions!
 
I'd rather not fall into the larger group of pen makers and remain a pen turner. That's what we do. Plus all the confusion that would go along with it, probably not worth it. But it is your call.
 
Hi Jeff!

I know you've already chimed in and said you won't change anything, but with my big mouth I wanted to say something! :D

I have no problem with changing to a new name, OR with staying as we are. I'm good either way. But when people started saying "If it ain't broke, don't fix it!" well, that just sets me off! What that means to me is that this might be exactly the time to consider "fixing" it!

Let me give you a little history. I once suggested a simple name change, and a number of people shouted me down, with the most common comment being "If it ain't broken, don't fix it!" Shortly thereafter I got an E-Mail from a guy named Jeff Brown, and the IAP is the result!

Jeff is very aware of all the negative side effects that could come from a name change, but I know that if he is suggesting it, then a name-change might just be a very good idea! Everybody should at least think about it!

OK, I'm off my soapbox now! [:I]

Scott.
 
I think we should call ourselves the Penmaking International Turning Artisans......No wait, that might not look good on the business cards.....
 
I kinda like penmaker or pencrafter. I frequently have to explain what turning is. If the name change helps the site and the community grow, I am for it. I "craft" several different things, some of them by turning. The name is probably not as important to me as it is to some of you who do this for a living. My 2 cents. No refunds.
 
Originally posted by Scott


Let me give you a little history. I once suggested a simple name change, and a number of people shouted me down, with the most common comment being "If it ain't broken, don't fix it!" Shortly thereafter I got an E-Mail from a guy named Jeff Brown, and the IAP is the result!

Scott.
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I thought you told me that "Jeff Brown" was in your spam list?? ;):D
 
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Originally posted by RussFairfield

The word "Pencrafter" saw some use everal years ago. I still prefer "Pencrafter", but think I am the only one who uses that word.
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After folks read your post, I can with confidence say "not for long you aren't the only one"
 
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