Paduak Stablizing Test Results

[Dieseldoc]

From brailsmist 1/28/19 post Paduck is gorgeous and comments from membership on finishing Paduak problems with voids in grain. i decided maybe stabilizing would help.

Test:
3/4X3/4X23/4 blanks were used in both test.weight 0.7 oz-21 grams.
cactus juice over night,removed vacuum,soaked four hours, drained, warped in tin foil, baked at 200, four hours.
Check weight 0.75 0z- 22 grams..
Drilled,tubed, turned and found results were not any difference than from non stabilized blanks, lot of open grain voids.

Retested using the same process, except used new bottle of cactus juice. same process , however now the blanks weight improved to 0.9 oz-25 grams.

Found after turning much better results in less open grain voids. Stabilizing filled voids.

Finished blank attached, finished with CA, 3 thin,5 med, micro mesh and polish.

conclusion:
stabilizing works.

By the way don't use year old cactus juice!!!!

Cheers


Charlie

 

[magpens]

I find this quite interesting. . Thanks for this report.

 

[jttheclockman]

I am wondering if stabilizing woods such as that and snakewood and purpleheart would help to keep color from fading and or cracking in woods like snakewood.

 

[1080Wayne]

I believe the usual recommendation is to leave the wood in the cactus juice after removing vacuum for at least the same length of time that it was under vacuum . Double the time might be better for dense materials . Also , two pieces of the same species will not necessarily add weight to the same degree . Stabilizeability is a wood property which will likely vary between sapwood and heartwood , crotch wood and straight grain wood , other types of figure , and a range of density , all caused by different growing conditions .



Some of my Cactus juice is certainly much older than a year , and it still seems to work . Doesn`t hurt to keep in mind though that it will act as a solvent for some low molecular weight organics , which might be preferentially forced into the pores , and might bake out .



Have never tried padouk or purpleheart as I don`t consider them to need stabilization so can`t comment on it`s effect upon colour retention . However , have just done a piece of tuliptree burl with nice green and purple , plus white/cream sapwood . The surface of the block is definitely more brown than it was . Still have a casting operation to do on it , but will post a picture when the piece is finished .



I have also stabilized aspen poplar with green stain fungus , and been disappointed with reduction in colour .

 

[jttheclockman]

I believe the usual recommendation is to leave the wood in the cactus juice after removing vacuum for at least the same length of time that it was under vacuum . Double the time might be better for dense materials . Also , two pieces of the same species will not necessarily add weight to the same degree . Stabilizeability is a wood property which will likely vary between sapwood and heartwood , crotch wood and straight grain wood , other types of figure , and a range of density , all caused by different growing conditions .



Some of my Cactus juice is certainly much older than a year , and it still seems to work . Doesn`t hurt to keep in mind though that it will act as a solvent for some low molecular weight organics , which might be preferentially forced into the pores , and might bake out .



Have never tried padouk or purpleheart as I don`t consider them to need stabilization so can`t comment on it`s effect upon colour retention . However , have just done a piece of tuliptree burl with nice green and purple , plus white/cream sapwood . The surface of the block is definitely more brown than it was . Still have a casting operation to do on it , but will post a picture when the piece is finished .



I have also stabilized aspen poplar with green stain fungus , and been disappointed with reduction in colour .

Maybe because of a heat factor??? Is that possible to lose the color??? At some time down the road I may play around with things like this too now that I picked up a used vac system.

 

[MRDucks2]

I had some "bad" cactus juice myself. But, I it believe it was more from being subject temperature extremes in the jug rather than age. If you read the label, temps over, I believe, 80 or 85 degrees F can affect it.


Sent from my iPhone using Penturners.org mobile app

 

[greenacres2]

I believe the usual recommendation is to leave the wood in the cactus juice after removing vacuum for at least the same length of time that it was under vacuum . Double the time might be better for dense materials . Also , two pieces of the same species will not necessarily add weight to the same degree . Stabilizeability is a wood property which will likely vary between sapwood and heartwood , crotch wood and straight grain wood , other types of figure , and a range of density , all caused by different growing conditions .



Some of my Cactus juice is certainly much older than a year , and it still seems to work . Doesn`t hurt to keep in mind though that it will act as a solvent for some low molecular weight organics , which might be preferentially forced into the pores , and might bake out .



Have never tried padouk or purpleheart as I don`t consider them to need stabilization so can`t comment on it`s effect upon colour retention . However , have just done a piece of tuliptree burl with nice green and purple , plus white/cream sapwood . The surface of the block is definitely more brown than it was . Still have a casting operation to do on it , but will post a picture when the piece is finished .



I have also stabilized aspen poplar with green stain fungus , and been disappointed with reduction in colour .

Maybe because of a heat factor??? Is that possible to lose the color??? At some time down the road I may play around with things like this too now that I picked up a used vac system.

I did a post in the Stabilizing forum on a vacuum oven i picked up last month. Since water boils at around 76 f under 29" of vacuum--i'm wondering if drying under vacuum (before stabilizing) might help in color retention. Curing, of course, would still have to be done at over 180 for polymerization.
earl

 

[Dieseldoc]

I believe the usual recommendation is to leave the wood in the cactus juice after removing vacuum for at least the same length of time that it was under vacuum . Double the time might be better for dense materials . Also , two pieces of the same species will not necessarily add weight to the same degree . Stabilizeability is a wood property which will likely vary between sapwood and heartwood , crotch wood and straight grain wood , other types of figure , and a range of density , all caused by different growing conditions .



Some of my Cactus juice is certainly much older than a year , and it still seems to work . Doesn`t hurt to keep in mind though that it will act as a solvent for some low molecular weight organics , which might be preferentially forced into the pores , and might bake out .



Have never tried padouk or purpleheart as I don`t consider them to need stabilization so can`t comment on it`s effect upon colour retention . However , have just done a piece of tuliptree burl with nice green and purple , plus white/cream sapwood . The surface of the block is definitely more brown than it was . Still have a casting operation to do on it , but will post a picture when the piece is finished .



I have also stabilized aspen poplar with green stain fungus , and been disappointed with reduction in colour .

Maybe because of a heat factor??? Is that possible to lose the color??? At some time down the road I may play around with things like this too now that I picked up a used vac system.

I did a post in the Stabilizing forum on a vacuum oven i picked up last month. Since water boils at around 76 f under 29" of vacuum--i'm wondering if drying under vacuum (before stabilizing) might help in color retention. Curing, of course, would still have to be done at over 180 for polymerization.
earl

Earl:

Good point, as the cactus turned light color of red after stabilizing. I think maybe it was bleached out during the process.

Never less stabilizing works in controlling the grain of the wood, as Paduak has soft grains running through out and that is where the saw dust from sanding get caught.

Today I did another batch of stabilizing and will use those pieces making a segmented pen, I will be interesting to see how much better control is found when sanding out the blank and have little or no bleed out on the maple .seatmate.
charlie

 

[1080Wayne]

Earl , nothing would be gained by drying under vacuum before stabilizing . That drying occurs while the wood is in the Cactus juice under vacuum . It is possible to take any piece of wood and dry it that way , but it isn`t recommended because it takes a lot longer than pre-drying in your oven , and puts moisture in the vacuum pump oil , which doesn`t enhance longevity . The Cactus juice doesn`t begin to enter the wood until the vacuum is released .



Vacuum lowers the boiling point of many things , possibly including whatever makes padauk red . The light red Cactus juice Charlie ended up with may be due to that process , or perhaps the colourant is slightly soluble in the juice . Cactus juice almost always changes colour thanks to these two processes .



Charlie , I think MRDucks2 probably hit the nail on the head re your old Cactus juice , assuming you had it in your possession last summer when it was so hot .