Wood to Turn

[Tonto]

I'm new at this and have focused on turning wood pens so far and wanted to share an idea to those in the commercial side of this craft. I turned a few pens in Buckthorn and Honeysuckle as gifts to folks I work with who spend considerable time killing these weed species. I was curious if there are folks out there turning the wide variety of other noxious weed species like autumn olive, salt cedar, etc. The other side of this is a somewhat specialized market of turned items from these species as gifts for the folks who work with them and would appreciate the irony of something useful made from their wood, often quite beautiful as I have found with the above two species. Then I think about using treated lumber for carpenter friends, you get the idea. I like the discussions that talk about diections to try and the casting/stabilization threads got my wheels turning. This is a great forum.

 

[Russianwolf]

there was an article in woodturning design about a guy that turns items of Poison Ivy (the wood being safe once completely dry). I've been exploring my area looking for possible <s>victims</s> er.... candidate woods. I would like to be sure what it is for future reference so some I'll have to wait for spring to cut. Redbud is very common in my area. Have at it. You never know what people will find beautiful.

On the pressure treated stuff, be very careful. The chemicals they use to treat it are very dangerous and the dust is a know problem.

 

[Tonto]

I have a few folks I'd like to make a poison ivy pen for, I've joked about that, funny to hear somebody is doing that. I was always warned that every part of the poison ivy plant (poison oak and sumac as well) contains the toxic oil that causes the reaction in most (not all) folks. Burning it can affect folks through exposure to the smoke that carries the oils. Like any wood, I would be careful with dust even from dry wood but the final work, properly sealed is probably OK, just don't chew on it. I just recall what my nostrils felt like when sanding Sapodilla (Chicle) for a pin I was carving from some scrap I brought back from Belize. I'm careful with treated too, much the same as when I build anything with it. A great reminder that some of these tropical woods pack a punch. Where could I find a copy of that article?

 

[THarvey]

Originally posted by Russianwolf

there was an article in woodturning design about a guy that turns items of Poison Ivy (the wood being safe once completely dry). I've been exploring my area looking for possible <s>victims</s> er.... candidate woods. I would like to be sure what it is for future reference so some I'll have to wait for spring to cut. Redbud is very common in my area. Have at it. You never know what people will find beautiful.

On the pressure treated stuff, be very careful. The chemicals they use to treat it are very dangerous and the dust is a know problem.

Redbud is beautiful when turned. I have a root burl, I hope to turn and show off in the next few weeks.

The poison ivey article was interesting. I do not have any plants that large near me. One of you guys try it and let the rest of us know what you thing.

I agree with Mike. The pressure treated stuff is too dangerous. The old pressure treating chemicals are dangerous when heated. The new coper based treatment is rough on tools. Besides, the wood has a tendancy to twist and split as it dries. [}]

 

[leehljp]

I will say with personal first hand knowledge that PI, even when totally dry, IS still dangerous. I got some, about 2 1/2 inches in diameter from a huge tree across the street from my USA home when I was there in 2005. The vine had been cut from its base in 2001 and sprayed with something that killed it in its root. No PI around that tree since then. I got about 2 feet of it and cut it for pens. This had been dead and air dried for 4 years.

AFTER cutting it, I broke out all over. The next morning I called the doctor and was told that I would have to wait in a long line to see the doctor and might have a 3 to 4 hour wait. When I got there, the receptionist took one look at me and took me straight to see the doctor.

 

[Fred]

The only good Poison Ivy is DEAD AS HECK Poison Ivy. Burning it and inhaling the smoke will kill you from the inside out. (Don't ask me how I know, just believe me.) I swear that danged vine was dead at least three years and it still got me. The dust is reactivatwd when it gets on the skin and minute traces of the oil still exist to get you!

DO NOT EVEN CONSIDER turning pressure treated timber. Definitely not a cool idea! There is just too much other stuff to turn instead. The poison used in the treatment is far more toxic than you want to breath or come into contact with.

I am digging up a Nandina Bush (a pest) and the wood is so bright yellow it is just begging to be tried out. We shall see!

 

[Russianwolf]

http://www.arizonasilhouette.com/Woodturning_Design_Magazine.htm

the article is in the one second from the top with a couple pens on the cover.

like most others, I've never seen a vine that big. I could however turn it without a problem. fortunately I'm not alergic to it. Found that out when some buddies and I went hiking and unknowingly crawled through some. It was college and a couple were female and I loved helping them with their Calomine lotion application. [}]
They even tried to rub it onto me after we found out. [:0]

 

[Russianwolf]

Originally posted by THarvey


Redbud is beautiful when turned. I have a root burl, I hope to turn and show off in the next few weeks.

Dang stuff is like a weed around here. I have a wind break at the back of my lot and half of it is wild redbud trees. During the spring you see them peeking out of every copse you pass.

 

[Tonto]

I milled a cut redbud stem into wood for carving, at the time I was using stuff 1/4 inch thick and the colors were great, nice dark heartwood with a creamy sapwood that would probably look nice on a pen. Heartwood color would fade over time though but still nice. Regarding not being affected by Poison Ivy, topical exposure vs. inhaled dust is an apple/orange or apple/pomegranite deal I suspect, and I've heard that folks unaffected could develop a sensitivity over time so you never know when that would kick in. The pressure treated warnings surprise me, I wouldn't be that worried if you had good eye and airmask protection like is sensible when sawing it for a new deck, not any more toxic than some other woods (poison ivy excepted) Regarding odd woods, I've milled quite a bit of buckthorn on a table saw, air dry stickered blanks in my garage for a couple of months and that works well. Honeysuckle is very moist and has a hollow pith so you need a big one (diameter) to get usable wood and it being moist, requires some controlled drying, I found it better to dry first then mill instead of milling then drying so the wood drys out slower. Stuff is usually between 3-5 inches in diameter, a large bandsaw could increase the size if logs you could deal with but the buckthorn and honeysuckle is small diameter at best.

 

[Fred]

From Tonto's post, "The pressure treated warnings surprise me, I wouldn't be that worried if you had good eye and airmask protection like is sensible when sawing it for a new deck, not any more toxic than some other woods (poison ivy excepted)"

So Tonto are you saying the arsenic is not toxic. I hate to very strongly disagree with you there and so would many others that died from the danged stuff. Copper Sulfate is quite a booger as well. And you don't think the danger warnings are there for a good reason? Well, do the warnings on breathing vapor from items such as Methyl Ethel Keytone, or drinking antifreeze solutions, etc., do these warnings surprise you as well?

Stupidity is all I can think of and be somewhat polite.

You can play with it all you want. Just remember that many of us here have tried to warn you of the very deadly long term consequences of doing so. The effects are not immediate, but continue to be foolish and you won't be turning for long.

And on the topic of sensitivity ... If one is allergic to a substance, i.e., Poison Ivy then the body will react to it in various ways. If one is not allergic BUT becomes sensitized later on due to various times of contact, then that reaction is often VERY strong, and future contact will quite possibly be even more severe and it gets worse with each outbreak. Go to your nearest cancer treatment center and look at all those affected by second hand smoke who are dyng from their long/short time exposure to fumes from cigarettes. Same idea!

 

[Glass Scratcher]

I must be confused, did Redbud just get mixed up in the thread or is it a toxic wood? I have the dying remnants of one(Redbud) my parents planted after I was born, long ago, in the front yard, and it would make a really neat namesake.

Don't have any Poison Ivy hereabouts anymore, but have plenty of Devil's Ivy(Smylax). Dug up a honker of root/tubor about 2 weeks back and have it sitting drying out. Thought it might make an interesting centerband for a pen or 2.

Toxic woods to avoid also would be Oleander, although I have never seen it large enough to turn, I'm sure someone would figure it out.

 

[Russianwolf]

we are discussing "found" woods in general, not toxic ones specifically. The redbud isn't toxic to my knowledge.

 

[bobskio2003]

I've turned a few poison ivy pens without any affects (and yes I'm allergic to poison ivy) but there is a trick. First you need to let it dry down for a year or so and then (most importantly) is to removed the bark and the layer just underneath that. That is actually where the oil most people are allergoc too, can be found. So I stripped the bark and underlying layer in the winter for two reasons. First I needed to wear gloves anyways because of the cold and secondly, I didn't have to worry about the oil become atomized from heat. I did wear a dust mask but that was about it, when cutting and turning it. It is quite nice, if you can find big enough pieces, as it has a yellowish heartwood.
I'm not sure what kind of evasive species we have here in New York but I've tried quite a few different shrub species and some have some interesting characteristics so I suggest just trying it and see what happens. Bob I.

 

[bobskio2003]

I've turned a few poison ivy pens without any affects (and yes I'm allergic to poison ivy) but there is a trick. First you need to let it dry down for a year or so and then (most importantly) is to removed the bark and the layer just underneath that. That is actually where the oil most people are allergoc too, can be found. So I stripped the bark and underlying layer in the winter for two reasons. First I needed to wear gloves anyways because of the cold and secondly, I didn't have to worry about the oil become atomized from heat. I did wear a dust mask but that was about it, when cutting and turning it. It is quite nice, if you can find big enough pieces, as it has a yellowish heartwood.
I'm not sure what kind of evasive species we have here in New York but I've tried quite a few different shrub species and some have some interesting characteristics so I suggest just trying it and see what happens. Bob I.

 

[Tonto]

http://www.ptw-safetyinfo.ca/cca.htm
I've searched for product info about pressure treated, and they all say the same thing, nasty stuff that makes me wonder why we build sandboxes and decks from it so I'll take a bow and mea culpa, but remind everyone that if you read the warnings for things like gas and alcohol, stains, solvents and other things we use everyday, they would read similar hazards. And if you can smell it, you are getting exposure. Now for another unusual wood, Devils Walking Stick, (Aralia spinosa) Turned and carved a piece, not very dramatic but interesting creamy white for this obscure shrub. I am searching for lilac now and any other oddball species I can mill a blank from.

 

[rando81]

I've cut some dead branches off what my wife calls smoke bush and it has some interesting grain and color , yellow with a gray to black rings . I'm letting it dry now , it looks like it will make some nice pens.

 

[Russianwolf]

Originally posted by Tonto

http://www.ptw-safetyinfo.ca/cca.htm
I've searched for product info about pressure treated, and they all say the same thing, nasty stuff that makes me wonder why we build sandboxes and decks from it

I don't. I only use PT for items that will come into contact with the ground. everything else gets plain of Fir/Spruce/Pine construction lumber. The life is about the same (as long as it's not in contact with the ground to attract termites) and cost is less. I have a deck that I made 5 years ago. The frame is PT and the decking is plain. Still looks great.

Back on topic, Yeah I have a couple lilac bushes that I'm waiting for some parts to get thick enough for blanks. Maybe another year or so. I'm also eyeing a wild honeysuckle bush. I just took down a small 2.5inch diameter weeping willow that has already been cut into 18 inch lengths and found a way to my shop. I'm also wondering about one of the butterfly bushes I has in the yard.

 

[KenV]

Most all the pressure treated stuff is hem-fir or similar softwoods. My HAZWOPER card us in the desk, and there is not much need to mess with ugly soft woods with so many good ones to work with. The copper salt treated ones are not in the same class as creasote or Penta, but why bother. There is not good reason to be sniffing methyl ethyl death either.

Liliac can be plain, or can have some nice color. The ones I have recovered from the Seattle area tend to have heart rot when they get to any large size (over about 2 inches), but can be nice with varitions in color. I have a large chunk of rosebud in the garage -- looks to be nice color but not much variation in the grain.

 

[holmqer]

I had mentioned this earlier and no one who responded in that thread had tried it...

How about Trumpet Vine?

I will probably give this a try, I spotted a 2" diameter vine while on vacation that seemed dead and shipped home several feet of it. I will use the trick described earlier for safely handling Poison Ivy and go full protection.

The vine seems so light that I may have to cast it in PR or Alumalite to keep it together.

The wood is odd, it is quadrilaterally symetrical with 4 rays of pith extending inwards from the bark about half way to the center then solid wood then a central pith core. I imagine that I could clean out the rays with a dental pick then pressure cast it with something the color of the flowers (red, yellow or purple)

 

[Tonto]

I would be curious about barberry too, a few years ago BPT (before pen turning)I dug out an old plant and the root wood was almost fluorescent yellow which I suspect once exposed to air would darken like osage orange but who knows. Lots of buried treasure out there. Any advice on efficient processing of odd shaped limbs etc. into pen blanks? I make lots of sawdust with a table saw and now have a small bandsaw which will help reduce loss to kerf. Rhododendron interests me as well, nothing is safe in the yard.

 

[Jarheaded]

I thought about turning some poison ivy as a gift for my ex-wife, but just thinking about it got me itching and scratching so I just sent her the alimony check without a pen. Her loss, but if anyone makes any poison ivy pens, I will buy her one as long as you will ship it directly to her.[}]
Have a great new year,
Johnnie