Stabilizing set up pics wanted

[Spence]

I'm in the process of building a vaccum set up for stabilizing and was curious as to what other folks had built. Would anyone be willing to either post or send me some pics of what they have? I think I've read just about everything posted here and on other sites but there was a curious lack of pics. I hope to be posting the results of my Swamp Yankee Rube Goldberg set up in the near future. LOL Thanks in advance!

 

[alamocdc]

This is what I use.

<br />

 

[GregD]

I'm using the same setup as Billy. It works great. Keep an eye on Harbor Freight. They often have the venturi type vacuum pump on sale.

 

[Spence]

Thanks Billy and Greg. I considered the venturi at first but then decided I wanted to have the use of a vac chuck for the lathe too. I'm goint to use either a Gast or Thomas pump. How often does your air compressor have to cycle to get the right amount of vacum in your chamber? I'm assuming that once that amount is reached the ball valve is closed to hold it there. The HF is so cheap that I might still get one as a back up. Who ever said you can have TOO many toys? LOL
Thanks again!

 

[alamocdc]

Spence, you are right about the ball valve assumption. Mine pulls 20" almost immediately using a gallon jar. In fact, I can't seem to pull more than about 21" using the gallon jar. I get 24" from a quart jar, but they are just too small to use much. I also want to get a vac chuck for my lathe eventually and while this device will certainly work for that, my little compressor would run pretty much all the time so I'll probably end up spending more $$$ on a dedicated Vac pump one of these days. For now, I have enough jigs and other chucks to do what I need. []

 

[Spence]

LOL Billy, I'm a total tool junkie. Matter of fact I avoided pens for years knowing what would happen when I start gearing up. Have at least as much fun making my own tools,jigs, etc as I do turning. Turning tools alone I think there are about 80 and I've made about a third I think. Throw in being a prime pack rat and I'm always running out of room. Welcome to the maddness indeed.

 

[ctEaglesc]

If you install a ball valve on the suction line as well as the supply you can shut off the air and seal the chamber.
I use the same set up and hold a vac of 20+ inches over nite.
remeber the gauge will go down as air is sucked into the vac line/gauge/

 

[Spence]

Exactly what I'm setting up eagle. Since I want to be able to do more than one batch at a time I figured that was the only way to go. While I have a 2gal paint pot I could use as a chamber, I've started collecting 1 gal glass pickle jugs also. I like the idea of being able to watch what the little beasties are up to in there. LOL
Thanks for the tip.

 

[TomServo]

Don't you guys worry about what happens when one of those glass jars implodes? I'd be afraid to use a regular glass jar.. At Folgers they used a glass jar about 1" thick to test the vacuum on the coffee cans (when they used vacuum packing) and they STILL filled it completely with water before pumping it down.. I suppose for stabilizing you'd want to fill it completely (as much so as possible) so maybe my concern isn't too valid?

 

[ctEaglesc]

Originally posted by TomServo
<br />Don't you guys worry about what happens when one of those glass jars implodes? I'd be afraid to use a regular glass jar.. At Folgers they used a glass jar about 1" thick to test the vacuum on the coffee cans (when they used vacuum packing) and they STILL filled it completely with water before pumping it down.. I suppose for stabilizing you'd want to fill it completely (as much so as possible) so maybe my concern isn't too valid?

One can never be too careful I suppose.If you don't feel comfortable doing something then don't do it.
Knowledge is power, ignorance is bliss.Common sense is best.
In over a year of using "pickle jars I have had none "implode",I did have one crack but no major problems and actually continued to use the same container eveen with the crack.
An <b>implosion</b> won't send glass flying everywhere.
The instant there is an opening,i.e. crack and air enters the vessel the vacuum is lost.
This subject was discussed a few times but is probably archived by now.
There is an excellent search feature on this site.
A search on vacuum in archived threads should provide plenty of reading

Originally posted by Spence
<br />Exactly what I'm setting up eagle. Since I want to be able to do more than one batch at a time I figured that was the only way to go. While I have a 2gal paint pot I could use as a chamber, I've started collecting 1 gal glass pickle jugs also. I like the idea of being able to watch what the little beasties are up to in there. LOL
Thanks for the tip.

I have found that the gauge gives me an indication of how much of a vacuum I have does not tell me the best time to turn off the suction valve.
Bubbles from the material do, ergo the glass container to see what's happening.

 

[smoky10]

Here's what I use for stabilizing. It will pull 24"-26" almost immediately and with the manifold I can hold the vacuum for ever with a good seal of the top.

 

[darbytee]

My system is a little (lot) more low tech. It's a brake bleeder pump connected to a mason jar. It can pull 25" and does a decent job. I've used the same two jars for over a year and have had no trouble with cracking or imploding.

 

[rtparso]

One of my responsibilities at work is ES&H (safety). As I said before:
"Yes, While the pressures involved are much lower then is normally encountered in positive pressure work (approximately 14psi or 1 atmosphere) and should be too low to burst the glass, if the glass breaks the glass will go flying. In the lab we enclose all of our glass vacuum vessels. When we are fancy we buy vacuum vessels that are coated but if $ are tight or we need something right now we use a very specialized scientific tool (duct tape). At home I would not bother just be careful and don’t bump the glass." Since you are dealing with &lt;14psi the chances of a 1 gal pickle jar failing due to the vacuum is small but the glass is under stress and a small strike could cause a failure of the glass once the glass fails it (as the big E said) it implodes when this happens it will cause the glass to fly. Eagle is partly right the glass flies in but when it impacts other glass in the middle it rebounds and flies out. This can happen with quite a bit of force. And if the glass fails it will do so suddenly. The size of the vessel and the depth of vacuum determines the amount of force (kinetic energy) available. If you have a 3' dia vacuum vessel you have a lot more force then a 1 gal jar. There are several options that you can use if you think that you need more safety. Make a box for the vessel to sit in (thick cardboard should stop everything). Wrap it in duct tape (this will keep everything together). Wrap it in clear plastic (clear vinyl tape works great). Do nothing and be careful.

 

[ctEaglesc]

GOd!
If you people are so worried about a jar imploding I would hate to see the get up you wear when you are turning a pen at high speed on a Jet mini.
A safer hobby perhaps?
Thank God Columbus wasn't afraid of falling off the edge of the earth.

 

[alamocdc]

My gallon jars came vacuum packed full of pickles or olives. If they can withstand the vacuum from that, they can handle what I'm doing. BTW, Spence, my seal is almost always good enough that I can hold 20+" for 48 hours or longer. I started spreading a thin layer of petroleum jelly on the lip of the jar before putting the lid on and this seems to have helped the seal hold. If it doesn't hold it's beacuse the lip of the jar is contaminated with solution drippings from a previous batch. [] Oh, and I keep my jars surrounded my a stack of oak while under pressure just in case and I'm careful no to bang them around. All it takes is a little common sense.

 

[dubdrvrkev]

I use one just about like darbytees's. I am currently collecting the parts to increase capability though. I am considering a 5 gal bucket with a thick piece of acrylic on the top with a rubber seal in between. I want to be able to do smaller bowl blanks. I have not tested to see if vacuum will crush a bucket though. That could put a kink in things.

 

[btboone]

Kevin, I would guess that vacuum would crush a bucket. The low curvature coupled with lots of square inches surface area is a bad combination.

 

[Ron in Drums PA]

I think a old pressure cooker should work fine.

 

[Spence]

Thanks everyone! Between getting sick and having to deal with a flooded shop due to all that rain I wasn't able to keep up with this discussion. Some good news though is I just picked up a Thomas vac pump on ebay and will soon have my system put together.[] Pics to follow soon!

 

[Spence]

Forgot to post the pic of the pump! LOL

 

[Thumbs]

Implosion is something to be concerned about and is an extremely dangerous occurrence when it happens. If you think it is something that can be safely discounted, take an old tv picture tube and break it, see what happens to the glass. If anyone is dumb enough to actually do this, I'd advise you to stay on the safety glass side of the tube and/or a fair distance away. What Ron said is quite true but may not be apparent by casual inspection. It happens very very fast! Up close and personal very fine shards of broken glass at speed can do you some damage. The vacuum in the picture tube may be drawn to a finer level than you can but it was designed specifically for that purpose. It's fortunate that glass is a plastic material and will withstand a fair amount of compression. The same amount of caution is required for this apparatus as any other tool.

 

[DCBluesman]

Originally posted by Thumbs
<br />...It's fortunate that glass is a plastic material...

Not in my world. Glass is generally composed from 60% silica sand, 20% soda ash, 15% limestone, 5% non-acrylic stabilizers, colorants, etc.

Safety issues should always be addressed.

 

[Thumbs]

Nonetheless, talk to any physical chemist about glass.

 

[Thumbs]

Actually, I should have said somewhat plastic...... As it is actually a fluidic compound........

 

[Thumbs]

Or I could say, I guess we live in different worlds, eh?