seeking pen turning equipment advice

[underdog]

I'm saving up some money for some pen turning equipment, and may want to spend at the Redmond/Rockler grand opening on Fri/Sat. (If I don't win something as a door prize.)

I want to get a functional mandrel and a barrel trimmer at the minimum.

At the moment, I have a mandrel with #2 MT and a bent shaft, with a few umm... "well used" bushings.

I've used this setup to turn my first pen, (the Wally World Speshul) but at the very least I want to replace the shaft.

What is your advice? Get the collet type mandrel or just replace the shaft on this one? What's a good price for either?

Besides the Barrel Trimmer, what other equipment is essential? And what's a good price on Barrel Trimmers?

What about Pen Kits? (I have all the wood I need, I just need the guts!) What are the better brands and types?

(I have a Jet mini and some turning tools and a little experience, so I'm targeting stuff unique to penturning.)

Thanks,

 

[JimGo]

The collet type mandrel that goes into the MT hasn't been all that well reviewed here - many have suggested either staying with the "standard" MT mandrel, or buying a Beall or Axminster collet chuck and using that to hold the actual mandrel. If you go that route, one of our fellow members (http://www.woodchipshome.com/) has a great deal on the Beall collet chuck - you will be hard pressed to find a better price. I bought one after having used the "standard" MT mandrel, and can see an improvement in my pens.

Barrel trimmer kits go for about $35 at a retail store like Rockler or Woodcraft. PSI's trimmer kit is a little less for the non-carbide trimmer, if I recall correctly (especially if you order from Woodturningz). If you don't mind making your own shims, you can get away with just the trimmer and the 7mm insert, which will further reduce the price (I think they're about $15).

Pen kits - don't buy 'em at Rockler or Woodcraft unless the prices are at a nice discount, or unless you need one right away and can't wait for it to be shipped. There are three main kit suppliers - Craft Supplies USA, Berea, and Penn State Industries. A few companies, like Bear Tooth Woods, have created custom plated versions of these kits, but my understanding is that they are still the same basic kits from one of the three suppliers. PSI's kits tend to be less well reviewed here than the others, though IMHO that's unwarranted. The Craft Supplies USA kits can basically only be ordered directly from them (http://www.woodturnerscatalog.com), although I think Rockler and Woodcraft may carry a few of their kits (under different names). Berea's kits (http://www.bereahardwoods.com) can be purchased through several different vendors, including Arizona Silhouette (http://www.arizonasilhouette.com) and Bear Tooth Woods. From what I've seen (and it's a VERY informal poll that relies purely on my memory, which is about as sturdy as a two-legged stool), Arizona Silhouette has the most extensive selection of Berea kits, and their prices are usually very competitive with the other resellers. Penn State Industries kits can be ordered directly from them (http://www.pennstateind.com) or from one of their resellers at a better price (for example, http://www.woodturningz.com or http://www.POCWoodworking.com).

As for "better types" of kits, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, so everyone here has their own favorite kits. However, the ones I see most frequetly here, which is probably a good indicator of the value of the kit (i.e. bang for the buck) are the slimline (any of the three MFG's), cigar (any of the three MFG's), Baron (Berea), Jr. Gent V.2 (Craft Supplies USA), Jr. Statesman v.2 (Craft Supplies USA), and Emperor (Craft Supplies USA). They each have their advantages and disadvantages, though for all of these the advantages significantly outweigh the disadvantages.

I'd suggest that you'll also want to focus on the platings. 10K and 24K platings will wear quickly. You'll spend more for a Titanium Gold or Platinum/Irridium finish, but the pens will look better a LOT longer (easily justifying the cost difference in the kits).

Other than that, if you have some MicroMesh (also from http://www.woodchipshome.com/) and some CA (from one of the bulk buys - I like Monty's prices and service, but that's just MHO), it sounds like you'll be well on your way!

 

[gerryr]

Jim forgot to ask how you plan to drill the blanks. If you plan to drill on the lathe, you'll need a 4-jaw scroll chuck and a Jacobs chuck for the tailstock. I have a Nova Precision Midi Chuck, which is very good, but if I were buying one now, I would probably spend a little more money and get the Barracuda setup from Penn State Industries. Buy the #2MT drill chuck from Harbor Freight, $9.99 and it's a great bargain. If you have a drill press, then you will want to get on the list for one of Paul Huffman's vises(Paul in OKC).

 

[ctEaglesc]

Though it takes more time you can use the Beall collet to hold the blank for drilling on the lathe, it is more accurate for drilling patterned blanks

 

[underdog]

Whoa....
That's a nice looking chuck, but that Beall chuck is more than I spent on my Nova midi chuck. Trust me guys, when I say I'm saving up, it means I'm scraping up the pennies...[^] If I do get that chuck, what size do you recommend? I'm a little puzzled by the question on the website that asks which size best fits my needs.

Also, when you say the collet chuck has not been all that well reviewed... Does that mean it got bad press? Or does it mean that not very many people have used one? If it got bad press, then what were the complaints?

It almost sounds as if I should just replace this shaft since I'm on the cheap...

What about bushings?

I also have a drill press whose Jacobs chuck does actually (sorta) fit my MT#2. I've not used the chuck in the lathe much, as I'm not sure the Jacabs taper is exactly the same. But that Drill chuck from HF sounds like a plan...

Thanks for all the good info on pen stuff...

 

[Dario]

This thread may help a bit too.

http://www.penturners.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=17115

 

[gerryr]

Originally posted by underdog
<br />
What about bushings?

I also have a drill press whose Jacobs chuck does actually (sorta) fit my MT#2. I've not used the chuck in the lathe much, as I'm not sure the Jacabs taper is exactly the same. But that Drill chuck from HF sounds like a plan...

Bushings are pen kit specific. Each different pen kit, except the Jr. Statesman and Jr. Gentleman, requires a different bushing set.

If the Jacobs chuck from the drill press doesn't fit the MT exactly right, don't try to use it for drilling. Get one that fits properly.

 

[ctEaglesc]

Depending on what is holding the shaft now, a new mandrel is $3.00 at Woodcraft.
It'll work

 

[wdcav1952]

Jim,

Remember we ALL love to spend OPM. (Other People's Money) []

It is not a requirement to get everything you need with the first round of purchases. Start small, and work your way up. I used Morse Taper mandrels for two years before I upgraded to a Beall Collet Chuck. I consider it to be a great step up, but not vital when getting started. I have never used the MT collet mandrel, so I cannot comment on it. With a more "standard" MT mandrel, the mandrel can be replaced for about $5.

Bushings are semi-disposable items that get worn down and need to be replaced. You may get into making your own bushings later, but for now expect to buy a large number of bushings as each kit has its own bushings.

Look at some of the starter sets in the catalogs and then pick what you need from the set. I don't regard the sets as a good purchase as there are items in the set that really are not used.

Start small and work up to bigger and better things.

FWIW,

 

[RussFairfield]

There is some discussion of what you need to turn a pen on my website. It might be helpful. The link is below.

 

[underdog]

Thanks Russ. I'll take a look at it when I get home this evening.

Ummm... about making bushings.. I'm a DIY kinda of a guy...

What's involved in that? Do you need a metal turning lathe? Or can you just make 'em like I did for the Walmart pen, out of some hard wood?

 

[its_virgil]

Or use corian or other plastic...some use delrin. Take a look at this:
http://www.penturners.org/content/MakingBushings.pdf

Do a good turn daily!
Don

Originally posted by underdog
<br />Thanks Russ. I'll take a look at it when I get home this evening.

Ummm... about making bushings.. I'm a DIY kinda of a guy...

What's involved in that? Do you need a metal turning lathe? Or can you just make 'em like I did for the Walmart pen, out of some hard wood?

 

[ctEaglesc]

It almost sounds as if I should just replace this shaft since I'm on the cheap

Not all shafts are interchangeable with all MT adapters.
Where did you get yours from?

Also, when you say the collet chuck has not been all that well reviewed... Does that mean it got bad press? Or does it mean that not very many people have used one? If it got bad press, then what were the complaints?

Wood craft discontined selling the Beall system(it was over priced on their website and stores to begin with) and replaced it with a collet set that works in the M2 taper on the lathe rather than on a threaded headstock,
It has limited uses and to me would seem like a pain to require a drawbar, and not have a "thru-hole" feature such as the Beall.
It it quite a bit less expensive than the Beall but thenn again not as many features.

 

[vick]

Originally posted by underdog
<br />Whoa....

Also, when you say the collet chuck has not been all that well reviewed... Does that mean it got bad press? Or does it mean that not very many people have used one? If it got bad press, then what were the complaints?

I believe he was reffering to the adjustable mandrels not the collet chuck. The adjustable mandrels have a collet type mechanism that allows you to adjus the length of your mandrel. Some people have had good luck with them on other have not. To begin with I would stick with a regular MT mandrel.

 

[underdog]

My mandrel was given to me by a friend. It's just your standard MT#2 with a threaded rod. I have no idea what the brand name is. I could go measure it and check the TPI I guess. If I want to try to replace it this weekend, I guess I better take it with me...

Thanks for the feedback on the adjustable/collet type mandrels. Am I understanding that you need to use these with a drawbar? If so, why do they need one? Don't they have the same dimple in the end of the shaft that the others do?

Now to take a look at the bushing PDF and Russ' site... I'll go get my mandrel and measure it also...

 

[underdog]

So here's a picture of the mandrel with bushings:

<br />

Pen Mandrel, #2MT, bent mandrel shaft, worn bushings, Size .246" Dia, .8mm tpi on MT end, .9mm tpi on knurled nut end. I'm guessing the bushings are probably for slimline set.

 

[JimGo]

Russ's site has a great discussion about how to straighten the mandrel, but you can replace that with a brand new one, including the MT adapter, for about $15 at Woodcraft, or you can simply get the new madrel for about $5 (may be less) at Woodcraft (or order online if you want). That set-up is exactly what Cav was telling you to stick with 'till you can afford/justify buying the Beall.

Those bushings don't look like slimline bushings to me, except maybe the one closes to the knurled nut (the brass nut). I haven't done any of them, but they look like the kind of bushings you'd use on a 7mm Euro, but that's just a SWA guess.

 

[ctEaglesc]

I believe that's a WC set up
new mandrel and adapter $10.00
new mandrel alone $3.00

 

[underdog]

Well I'll be near there on Sat. for the Southeast Bubbaville thang. I might jes' swang by there...

Thanks for all the help guys, I really appreciate it.

What's Delrin?