New to pen turning

[MikeJ]

Hi,

I have been turning for a little over a year now, but until this fall only made one or 2 pens. then my Wife asked me to make pens for her family for the holidays. I get to turn, and no problems with me buying new stuff... A win win for me right .

I ended up making 30 pens (Big family, and also a few for co-workers.) The co worker pens ended up with me making another 20 for a big meeting here in 2 weeks.

So after all this, I had fun and became a little bit of a better turner, but ran into some issues I'm not sure why I had.

All the pen kits used were the PK 7mm slimline from PSI

My biggest problem was the tubes beaking free from the blanks when I was trueing them up on my drill press. I always cleaned the tubes up with emory cloth before glueing, and could see the dried glue on the tubes after they broke free. I always let them sit at least 24 hours before trimming them.

I have a barrel trimmer from PSI that I use on a very old drill press. I make sure the shaft of the trimmer is inside the tube before I turn the press on just in case, but still some broke free.

Could it be the glue? I used 2 different types of Home depot super glue, PSI glue and even water activated polyurethane glue. All had failures.

I was wondering if my drill press isn't running true and a slight wobble is generating too much heat? I'm not sure how to check that except if I clamp a block down and drill a hole, it seems true and the right size.

I'm at a loss.

Also, the majority of the pens I made were various woods, but some were acrylic. They posed a new set of issues. On 3 different blanks there were from what I can tell faults near the center where the blanks blew apart when they got thin. I was very careful to use very sharp tools, and to try to keep any heat generated to a minimum. I used a very light touch to take off only a little at a time as the walls got thinner. That didn't seem to help

Is that normal for acrylics?

Lastly, I noticed that after a few pens my bushings were worn and if I matched the wood to them, it was too thin for the actual pen parts so I started to check my blanks with a caliper. The problem I ran into there was that almost all the center bands and pen tips had different outside dimensions. They were close, but different enough to feel if looking for a smooth transition.

Is that normal? Just something found on less expensive pen kits?

I'm sure some of this is just a learning experience, and me needing to develop better techniques. That I'm fine with. I'm just wondering if I'm doing or using something fundementally wrong.

Sorry for all the questions!

Thanks!

 

[markgum]

Hi Mike;
welcome to the group. I use 5 minute expoxy and havn't had a problem with the tubes coming lose since. It seems to work better than super glue. I also let them sit overnight before truing them up.
for the bushing, I use calipers. yes, it takes a bit longer, but well worth it. I measure the nib work on that end of the pen. then the center band and work there, then move on to the clip. yes, they can be a little difference in size of each, when I say little, I do mean LITTLE on th slim line kits. but yes, when a good eye checks them out a .01" thickness looks HUGE.
hope this helps.
the fun is just beginning.

 

[jkeithrussell]

Regular super glue is not the best thing to use for the tubes. I'm not sure what you mean by "PSI glue." I used to use medium CA for my tubes, but then switched to Gorilla Glue for wood and 5 minute epoxy for everything else. I almost always let the glued up blanks sit overnight before working them, but a bare minimum of 4 hours. I've never had a tube come out, so I'm not sure what is going on with your set-up. It sounds like a combination of the wrong glue and maybe not enough of it.

For the centerband issue, measure each centerband and sand/measure the blank carefully. As an alternative, you can use some creative shapes to make the cap end slightly bigger than the nib end and eliminate the centerband. This doesn't look good on every slimline, but it works some of the time. I have a couple of pics in my photo album, but there are better examples in the other members' photo albums.

 

[wb7whi]

I am wondering if there was a bit of ca inside the tube and the torque from the drill press caught it and twisted the barrel free?
As for centerbands I prefer to make my own and shape the pen accordingly. I take a suitable blank and drill it with the appropriate drill bit then cut off about 3/8 sections. I then cut a 1/16 in tenon on each side of the blank once turned round and glue the new center band onto the clip side blank. I then remove the center bushing and put the pen together on the mandril and shape the center band with the pen body.

Wayne

 

[jkeithrussell]

I am wondering if there was a bit of ca inside the tube and the torque from the drill press caught it and twisted the barrel free?
As for centerbands I prefer to make my own and shape the pen accordingly. I take a suitable blank and drill it with the appropriate drill bit then cut off about 3/8 sections. I then cut a 1/16 in tenon on each side of the blank once turned round and glue the new center band onto the clip side blank. I then remove the center bushing and put the pen together on the mandril and shape the center band with the pen body.

Wayne

do you just leave the tenon exposed on the nib end -- does that help it hold together after assembly?

 

[MikeJ]

Thanks everyone, I will definately use 5 minute epoxy from now on. I did try the Gorilla super glue but had issues there also. maybe not as many as with Super Glue brand glue, or the PSI super glue, but still issues.

Making my own center band sounds interesting too.

Are any brans of the 5 minute epoxy glue better than others?

Thanks again!

 

[Longfellow]

Patchogue, N.Y

Mike,
I can't help you with your problem but my son lives in Patchogue just down the street from the Pine Grove Inn. That was my favorite restaurant when I lived on L.I.- Ken Oakley

 

[pipecrafter]

I like to use T-88 epoxy on almost everything. Yeah, it takes at least 24 hours to cure, and I tend to let it sit for at least 48, but the holding power is unmatched. I just schedule my work to allow for the cure time.

 

[MikeJ]

Where do you get the T-88 epoxy?

Pine Grove Inn... Great German food and beer!

 

[pipecrafter]

I get it at Woodcraft, but I seem to recall you can get it at Rockler as well.

Even with T-88, you have to be sure you're using enough. Really slop it on the tube, and work the blank back and forth to get it spread around inside there. Nitrile gloves are pretty much required.

 

[GBusardo]

I am wondering if there was a bit of ca inside the tube and the torque from the drill press caught it and twisted the barrel free?


Wayne

Actually, that was my first thought also. As far as turning your pen oversized. I measure the pen parts before I start to turn. I then make sure the bushing I am using are not larger than the pen parts. When I am getting close, I break out the calipers again. If I do not get a good fit, I take the pen apart, put it back on the mandrel and do a little sanding. Then refinish.

Have fun and welcome to the forum

 

[leehljp]

Be sure to coat the inside of the blank before inserting the tube with epoxy. If you use Gorilla glue do the same.

 

[MikeJ]

Great, I'll order some today.

Thanks for the help!

 

[MikeJ]

Be sure to coat the inside of the blank before inserting the tube with epoxy. If you use Gorilla glue do the same.

Hmmm, I have only coated the tubes so far, maybe thats part of my problem. How do you keep the glue of of the tubes this way?

 

[leehljp]

Hmmm, I have only coated the tubes so far, maybe thats part of my problem. How do you keep the glue of of the tubes this way?

I use plumbers putty but old playdough and even clay works if it is soft. Use that to plug one end up and use that end to insert into the blank. Also be looking for a steel brush for small bore guns; they do great work and are quick in cleaning out the dried glue. If you can't find one, use a rat tail file and use light strokes to clean it.

 

[pensbymdsmith]

I had the same problem and solved it by putting a little 3-in-one oil on the mill first. It lowered the the friction which in turn lowered the heat that releases the CA.

 

[dasimm]

I use a similar method as lee uses but I use Dental wax instead. I also use CA for all my pen tubes and I have not had any real problems (knock on wood).

Here is how I do it:

1. I clean up the pen blank ends to ensure they are square using the table saw.

2. Then I clear a spot on the bench and place a small garbage bag spread out over my work area and clamp it down. I do this because the CA will not stick to the bag and it makes cleanup a no brainer.

3. I sand he tubes down using 400 grit and then plug both ends with Dental Wax. I do both ends - which will be apparent why further down the process.

4. I put on the disposable gloves and setup a small fan to pull the fumes away from me before moving to the next part.

5. I then create a small puddle of the CA thick on the bag and completely submerse the tubes (one at a time) in the pool of glue adding more glue as needed.

6. I then slide the tube into the appropriate blank making it flush with one end of the blank. I wipe off the excess glue with my finger.

7. I then stand the blanks on end (flush side down) - lining them up across the bag.

8. I then drip a small amount of Thin CA in the top side of the blanks to fill in any voids that might have occurred. I repeat as necessary and then hit each one with a shot of accelerant.

9. I usually let them set for 24 hrs - adding thin CA to the exposed tops (if necessary) as I work on other things.

10. I then use the table saw to trim the remaining end off the blank.

11. Clean out the dental wax with a small pic & I'm ready for the lathe.

I've been refining my process over several months and have been getting excellent results with this one.

Hope this helps.

 

[Greg O'Sherwood]

Wow David!

That is a very long process! I'm sure you get great results, though.

I either CA or 30 minute epoxy depending on the material, then flush mill. I can go from full sized, undrilled blank to the lathe in 5-35 minutes.

Using a mill actually fills any minute gaps around the tube edges with particles of the material you are using. A dab of CA solidifies it.

.

 

[desertyellow]

Welcome.
You are in the right place
Lots to see and learn

 

[shull]

One thing to keep in mind is that the barrel trimmer is actually a hand tool. When used in power tools it should be used at the slowest speed possible and fed at a slow speed. Don't forget to keep the trimmer sharpened also.