Loose Rings on Imperial. Is this a "feature"?

[webmonk]

I turned another Imperial this weekend and found that the two gold bands turn freely. I've also noticed this a time or two on the Emperor kit. Is this supposed to be a feature, like a worry ring or something? Or is this a flaw where the ring wasn't pressed on enough?

Also, any ideas on how to make it stop turning? The rattle when you pick it up makes it feel cheap, which is a bummer from a $60 kit.

Thanks,

 

[Brewmeister35]

Jon,

I have 2 Imperial kits right now. One that's already been made with some pricey Amboyna barrels and one still in the box. I just checked both of them and sure enough, the completed pen does have 1 loose gold band. The new one in the box is solid. I'm guessing your's is alot worse than mine. It moves, but barely. Definitely NOT what I would want to find on a pen I just paid big bucks for. I don't see how it can be fixed once the pen is together. This sucks! The 2nd most expensive kit out there too [B)]

 

[webmonk]

The band on the bottom of this one sounds like it acts like yours does. It turns, but you have to really mean it and even then it feels like it catches on something. The one in the middle offers no resistance at all. It's loose enough that it rattles when you write.

The gap between the band and the sides of the channel it rides in is tiny (just smaller than the thickness of printer paper.) I'm wondering if there's a chance of getting something down in there? Something like wax that you could heat so it runs down in there, but that can be cleaned off of (without harming) the finish when you're done.

Any ideas along those lines?

 

[Brewmeister35]

Boy, I don't know if that would hold it good enough. Even if it did, a little heat or wear and tear would loosen it right up again.

 

[Randy_]

Sounds like an email to CSUSA customer service is in order?

That is certainly "NOT" acceptable for a kit of that price!!

 

[webmonk]

Yeah, I'm definitely going to call them and let them know. I'd still like to be able to salvage this pen though. It's a christmas gift and the actual piece of wood used has some significance to the person so while making a replacement is possible, it's not preferable.

Thanks for the advice though!

 

[JeffinWIS]

I am totally unfamiliar with that pen, but maybe a tiny bit of LOCTITE would work???

 

[josef]

Jon,

I'm also trying to make Christmas gifts and I'm going nuts with all of the little things slowing me down [!] Maybe my pen making karma will improve a bit if I can help you out!

I don't know if this is the same problem I saw a couple of weeks ago with an Emperor kit, but I'll let you know what happened and maybe it will help you salvage your pen. The rings on the Emperor would spin easily and would rattle when the pen was picked up. What I discovered is that I could tighten up the bands (the ring within the bands actually) with more pressure from the pen press. BE CAREFUL, you can obviously destroy a pen if you press too hard. Anyway, don't know if it will work for you, but it solved my problem with a similar kit.

Best Regards,
Josef

 

[gerryr]

Do not try try to tighten the loose ring by pressing the parts together with more pressure. You may get lucky and it will work or you may find that no amount of pressure will fix it. I discovered that on a Jr. Statesman with a loose ring, didn't rattle but would turn quite easily. I clamped it in a vise for three days under what I thought was really extreme pressure and it made no difference. Call CSUSA and they'll replace it. Or you can disassemble it and correct the problem that is causing it to be loose. Just drill a hole in a piece of hard wood barely large enough for the CB but smaller than the loose ring. Then you can press the main CB part into the hole leaving the two trim ring behind.

 

[josef]

Strange. I described the most recent case with an Emperor kit, but I've had this happen with this kit a couple of times recently. One time, because I disasembled it and the center ring became loose. In both cases a little extra pressure in the pen press worked like a charm. Anyway, I've been using both kits personally with absolutely no problems since. It only takes a few seconds to try, and with a little care you can avoid damaging either blank or kit. YMMV.

Since Jon said "I'd still like to be able to salvage this pen though" I thought it my be worth a try, even if it's just a slim chance.

I've only been making pens for a couple of months, so I'm sure gerryr's advice is superior.

Josef

 

[Randy_]

Jon: After considering your problem for a little while. I can't think of a good solution. Maybe someone else will have a touch of genius and devise a solution.

I think your best bet is to disassemble the pen to save the wood and hope CSUSA will send you a replacement kit that has good fittings.

I took a close look (under 10x magnification) at a fitting off a Statesman kit to see how those decorative rings are fitted. It looks like they slip onto the outside of the primary part of the fitting(probably should be a tight press fit; but maybe not) and then another plain ring is pressed onto the primary fitting behind the decorative ring. I don't know if the decorative ring is supposed to be a snug fit by itself or whether the follower ring is what is supposed to keep the decorative ring firmly in place?

If CSUSA sends you a new kit, you could do one of two things with the old hardware. One would be to make up another pen and gift it to family or friend who would like a nice quality free pen and would not care about the minor defect. I guess you could also keep the "second" pen as a display item. (You might be able to put a coat of clear fingernail polish on the ring to keep it from spinning in demo mode.) Second alternative would be to see if you can remove the two rings from the fitting and then reinstall them with a small dab of glue. I don't hold much hope that the rings will come off; but it certainly wouldn't hurt to try.

Good luck.

 

[Randy_]

Originally posted by gerryr.....<br />Or you can disassemble it and correct the problem that is causing it to be loose. Just drill a hole in a piece of hard wood barely large enough for the CB but smaller than the loose ring. Then you can press the main CB part into the hole leaving the two trim ring behind.

I told you so!! Someone did come along with a good idea.

Gerry: Did the rings pop off pretty easily or did it requite a significant amount of force? I would have some concern about damaging the plating on the decorative ring. I imagine the rings plated with black titanium would be pretty sturdy; but I wonder if the 22k plated rings might suffer some plating damage. What do you think?

Another alternative if the pen is unassembled and a loose ring is detected is as follows. Drill a hole in a scrap of wood that is just big enough to accept the "SMALL" end of the coupler. Put the coupler in the hole so ti is resting on the follower or retaining ring. Then tap the other end of the fitting with a wooden mallet or a hammer and a protective scrap of wood. This might tighten everything up enough so that the ring no longer spins. But you do need to be careful as you could permanently damage the fitting if you apply too much hammer!!

 

[webmonk]

Thanks gents! I'll give these a whirl after work and let you know what happens.

 

[gerryr]

Originally posted by Randy_
<br />

Originally posted by gerryr.....<br />Or you can disassemble it and correct the problem that is causing it to be loose. Just drill a hole in a piece of hard wood barely large enough for the CB but smaller than the loose ring. Then you can press the main CB part into the hole leaving the two trim ring behind.

I told you so!! Someone did come along with a good idea.

Gerry: Did the rings pop off pretty easily or did it requite a significant amount of force? I would have some concern about damaging the plating on the decorative ring. I imagine the rings plated with black titanium would be pretty sturdy; but I wonder if the 22k plated rings might suffer some plating damage. What do you think?

Using the wood block to press the main piece of the coupling out doesn't damage the plating, and it doesn't actually take very much force, probably less than is required to press the coupling into the tube.

 

[webmonk]

So I called customer service who got me in touch with a tech. I wasn't overly impressed, as his advice was that all that could be done was to disassemble it and he would ship me a replacement center band. I had a feeling that taking this thing apart would ruin something either by gouging it on something, scratching plating, or any other number of boneheaded things so I went ahead and ordered another kit just in case. So now that I had a new kit on the way and nothing really to lose (aside from the chunk of special wood that was doomed anyway) I went out to the shop to try out the suggestions.

First up was pressing it more. I started with a gentle press and nothing happened. It still shook and spun. I pressed a little harder and it actually tightened up a bit so I pressed even harder (which I would guess to be twice as hard as I feel comfortable pressing the parts in normally) and it tightened up fully and doesn't move at all now. I was really worried about cracking the wood, but I guess this lady is just living right or something.

So long story short...
Problem: Loose rings.
Solution: Press harder. (It's worked at least once!)

Thanks to all who helped!

 

[scubaman]

Originally posted by webmonk
<br />So long story short...
Problem: Loose rings.
Solution: Press harder. (It's worked at least once!)

Of course this is the right solution... But here are a couple of additional thoughts/suggestions. For nomenclature: I'll refer to a platinum kit with gold trim. The outer ring is part of the fitting, then comes the gold ring, then another platinum ring.

The bands are just stacked. Before you assemble a kit, check and see if the gold band turns. If it does at that point, use a tube slightly larger that the proper one, or a drilled wood block, and press the platinum ring on. Or use a spare tube of the right size with e slot sawn in about 1/2" which allows you to pull it off again easily. If you can't stop the spinning then, get the part replaced.

When you use a finished barrel to press the platinum ring on, you are taking a chance, because now your pen barrel takes the full force - it becomes part of the press... not always a good idea! It's better to disassemble, correct the part, and reassemble. When you disassemble, the impact of the hammer you use will usually make the platinum ring move up, even on a fitting where it did NOT turn before. Which will make the gold band spin... so always check before reassembling!

Disassembling is easy - unless you have an uncured finish. To protect the cap barrel from the clip, slide the plastic bung that many kit fountainpen nibs are protected with for shipping over the clip so it will not mar the finish as it slides up.

 

[webmonk]

Good tips! Glad I didn't need them, but that makes sense.

Thanks!