Good pens or great pens

[stevers]

Hi Folks,
First post other than intos. You probebly hear this question too often.
Whats the difference between a good pen and a great pen? I have turned mabey 25 or 30 pens, quite a few slim lines, a few comfort grips and several euros. And a few click pencels too.
I thought they looked pretty good, seem to fit pretty well. Little week on the finish, still using Hutt PPP. The euros are my favorite, nice looking kits. Will move up to screw caps and the like some day.
Is it the fit to the rings? The finish? The quality of the kit? You'll probebly tell me all of the above. Its hard to tell from the pics sometimes. I'd post some pics if my digital camera was working.
My pens are looking better as I turn more. But what do I do to know if they are really getting better.
Thanks in advance for your time and help.
Steve

 

[Dario]

Submit them here to be critiqued []

You will get lots of good input to improve your pen making skills. []

 

[stevers]

I wish I could, my camera is'nt working right now.

 

[angboy]

Well personally, I'd say any pen is great if it looks like mine do and I made it!!! [][^][]

But seriously (since there may be some people out there who would disagree, (but I doubt it!), I'll give a serious answer). But I don't think that is an easy question to answer. Sure those technical things are obviously important. But to me, there's so much more to it, like the time and effort you put into making a pen, the meaning behind it, etc.

I have a few pens that I won't give away and won't use (and hopefully soon will have a display case for). They may not be technically the best of anything I've/others have made, but they have other meanings for me- for example, one that a special person made for me (but of course his are also technically great []), one that was made with wood from a special source, one that was also made with special wood and that I feel like I put more of myself into than usual. etc.

So while Dario is right, you'll be able to get technical feedback on any pen you post, I'd encourage you to avoid getting hung up on only the technical aspects, and don't forget to look at some of those other things that may make a pen great! What one person defines as a great pen may not be the same as another person- you only have to look in this forum at some of the pens (often the more unusual ones it seems) that some people hate and would probably never say is a great pen, and others love and would probably say is a great pen. You may get a consensus where other people agree with you about whether your pen is great or not, but I also believe that a lot of what makes it a great pen is when you feel in your heart that there's something that makes it a great pen! For me, it's a question I answer for myself, others don't answer for me.

 

[ldimick]

It really is up to you.

Personally I used to think there was no such thing as a great synthetic pen. It was a feeling that only wood was a challenge and had character. But now I know differently.

The finish should be smooth. Or should I type smooooooooottttthhh. I prefer a nice shine.

The material should not have any undesigned ripples or dips in it.

The grain (if wood) should line up and it should have character.

The blanks should line up with the hardware in all planes.

And the hard one is that it should be comfortably balanced.

It should write smooth.

It should turn easily but not sloppily.

The color of the kit should complement the material.

 

[Mikey]

Agree with Lynn.

Finish is a big part, and to me it should shine and show clarity with no runs or drips that one can feel to the touch.

Wood should be smooth when you rub from end to end with no ripples. (skew very important)

Kit material choice is just as important and the color of the kit and material. A great pen will not be great if the finish is going to wear offf in 6 months.

One that wasn't mentioned, that IMO needs to be... presentation. You can take a nice looking pen, and if it is sitting in a plastic box, it looks like any other. If you set it in leather or a custom wooden box, then it stands out.

 

[rtparso]

Get a chair a good cigar and a bright light. Sit down and study the pen as you slowly smoke that cigar. By the time you finish you will notice somethings that you could do better. Then go make a better pen.

 

[RussFairfield]

It seems to me that you have answered your own question.

You said:
"I thought they looked pretty good, seem to fit pretty well. Little weak on the finish, etc.... "

And:
"My pens are looking better as I turn more. But what do I do to know if they are really getting better?"

You will know that they are really looking better when you can remove "pretty" and a "little weak" from your 1st statement.

The "looking better as I turn more" tells you that you need to keep making pens, and always trying to make the next one better than the last.

A common beginners mistake is reading the messages from those folks who like to brag about how fast they can make a pen. This is not a race. Don't get caught up with trying to make a pen in 5-minutes. If it takes an hour to do it right, then it takes an hour.

Remember this slogan: <b>Perfection of fit and finish first</b>. Write it on the wall where you can see it every time you turn a pen. Once you have that, then is when you can start trying to find ways to do it faster, if that is what you want to do.

 

[Bev Polmanteer]

Listen to Russ, it is the best advice you will ever get!

 

[stevers]

Thank you Lynn, some great advice. And thank you too Russ, that makes a lot of sence. Also Ron. And Mikey, you mentiomed presentation. I have been woodworking for quite a few years and one of the first things I did was build a display box. 9 by 16 or so and holds 15 or so pens, pencils letter openers etc.

Ballance is one I never thought of untill now. I had a freind tell me, "this pen isnt 'heavy' but it isnt 'light' either" So I can see where ballance will come into play.

I need to decide on a finish style also. I like to try some diff things untill I find one I like then learn it well and stick with it. Go with what you know, like they say.

Thank you all for the wonderful comments and its time to hit the shop.

Steve

 

[ldimick]

I have noticed a pattern. We start off trying to make as many pens as we can because it is fun, we receive praise, and it's new. Then we start to slow down and notice the imperfections. Then we sit down and really start trying to figure out how to do it better and different.

There are some weeks that I don't make a pen because I am not happy with a particular outcome and I want to find a better way. Now I am more interested in designing a good finished product instead of just turning a pretty piece of wood.

Sometimes that thought process involves trying to find new materials, new designs, new kits, or even just trying to find a better color combination with a particular kit.

 

[rtparso]

I agree with Lynn. But I just thought it was because I was lazy and just wanted to sit and smoke a cigar.

 

[mick]

I agree with most of whats been said here, but for myself personally I don't think i've yet to make that`"great" pen. I like my pens, my pens sell very well, they're pretty and have some or all of the things mentioned above, but I've yet to make a pen that I couldn't find some little flaw either real or preceived, but it doesn't deter me from keeping on striving for the "Great" pen. I make fewer pens than when I first started but I also take longer to make those fewer pen and I think that pretty common here as we all hone our skills and become our own worst critic. This isn't a bad thing though. As long as we aren't completely satisfied with our work, that work will continue to improve as we one by one eliminate those real or preceived flaws.
I've rambled enough...and I accuse Connie of being wordy....lol. I gotta go make one more "almost " perfect pen![]

 

[stevers]

I know exactly what you mean about making fewer and better pens. I find myself thinking more about what to do next and what to make it out of. I try to save my better blanks or scraps for just the right one. This morning I went out and made a Classic (euro). It went well enough untill I got impatient on my second pen and blew out the nib end. So I just found something else to do so I could get a break from it. I sorted my sand paper and improved the box I keep it in, added some deviders.

Hey, while I got your attention. Whats my next step on finishes? Like I mentioned earlier, i'm still using Hutt PPP. I sand and MM up to 3600. But I did notice the pens seem to loose their shine pretty quick with the PPP. Any sugestions will be great.

Thanks
Steve

 

[rtparso]

Although it might be sold as a finish PPP is a wax with some buffing compound in it. I sand to MM 3600, add 1 coat thin CA, sand to 12000 and then use PPP.

 

[stevers]

how do you use CA?

 

[JimGo]

Originally posted by stevers
<br />how do you use CA?

Check the homepage, and do some searches. You'll find a LOT of tips!

 

[rtparso]

I use the simplest method I have heard. Sand apply thin CA burnish excess off with saw dust (also fills grain) sand and polish. It gives a satin plus shine. If you want high gloss forget simple. I think the way I described gives a good non-plastic look to the wood, wears well, brings out the character (chatoyant), and is easy. I personally don't like a high gloss shine.

 

[stevers]

Thanks for all the help folks. I'm in the prosses of trying my first CA finish now. Applied today and got busy with the neighbors. should give it time to dry. I'll work more on it in the next few days.

Steve