Durability of Finishes

[Smitty37]

I did a little checking and this post is to more or less confirm what a lot of folks already know.

TN Gold and Black TN are the most durable finishes. Black Chrome and Chrome are next. Satin Chrome is also a Chrome Alloy and should wear well.

Gun Metal for those who didn't know (I didn't) is a tin bronze alloy.

Rhodium will not wear Quite as well as Chrome and Platinum itself is similar to 24kt Gold.

Most 24kt Gold finishes are now clear coated with epoxy to increase durability, the epoxy wears pretty well.

I think silver and copper are also but have not had that confirmed yet but they certainly do something to ward of tarnish.

The above information came from Rizheng in response to questions I asked.

 

[witz1976]

This is the first I have ever heard of Chrome wearing better than Rhodium and Platinum being compared equally to 24K gold....interesting.

 

[wizical]

I think more research needs to be done!

 

[arioux]

This is the first I have ever heard of Chrome wearing better than Rhodium and Platinum being compared equally to 24K gold....interesting.

I have a lot of problem witht that one. Comparing Rhodium and platinum plating to 24k !!!!. This is far from what people already knows. Well from my experience with these plating and discussion with other experienced turner at least.

Of course bad plating on any finish will never do the job. It's a question of who applies the plating and how.

This is one manufacturer point of view. If you go to Berea, you will have something different. PSI and CSU will give you their version. Every one will rate the plating they carry as they know them.

Since i don't see any platinum or rhodium or titanium plating in the Rienhzeng regular offer, i would like to know what they know about it.

 

[Displaced Canadian]

Smitty,
This does give me something to think about. I have personal experience with 24 ct gold. Woodcraft sells 24 ct. gold and woodcraft gold that supposed to wear better than regular gold. I have made pens with it but I don't know how they are wearing. In my experience Black TI does wear well I would assume the same of TI gold. I have only made 1 black chrome pen and the finish didn't last at all but the metal under the finish was copper colored not silver. I don't know who made the kit. I have made pens from rhodium but have no idea how it really lasts. Does anybody have a daily driver in rhodium who can show us how it is lasting? Not a Sunday going to meeting pen , but a real daily use pen?

 

[ldb2000]

Dan , Leroy is right about the platings . Platinum is a soft metal and does wear fast , this is why Rhodium is used as a decorative plating in jewelry instead of Platinum . Chromium is a very hard metal with very good wear resistance which is why it is used for car bumpers and other items subjected to harsh conditions and heavy wear , also why it is used as a plating for tools and an additive for making the tools as well . Of all the platings used in pens , Chrome , if plated right , is probably the best wearing of all , equal to Titanium nitride .
Chris , Black chrome used on pens is not a plating but a finish and as such is subject to wear and chipping , definitely not a very long lasting finish . The reason you see a copper color under it is because the base metal the parts are made of is brass , although some of the cheapest kits use white metal (a zinc alloy) .

 

[1080Wayne]

From a copy of the Moh`s scale of hardness

Aluminum 2-2.9
Gold 2.5-3
Silver 2.5-4
Brass 3-4
Iron 4-5
Platinum 4.3
Platinum/Iridium 6.5
Chromium and Titanium nitride(Ti gold) 9.0

The ranges are probably due to trace amounts of alloying materials . Platinum appears to be quite a bit softer than chromium .

Then there is the Knoop test

Chromium 935
Titanium nitride 1800

And then there are the companies who apply these things !

 

[ldb2000]

Add to the chart above , Rhodium has an Mohs hardness of 6 .

 

[Smitty37]

This is the first I have ever heard of Chrome wearing better than Rhodium and Platinum being compared equally to 24K gold....interesting.

I have a lot of problem witht that one. Comparing Rhodium and platinum plating to 24k !!!!. This is far from what people already knows. Well from my experience with these plating and discussion with other experienced turner at least.
Of course bad plating on any finish will never do the job. It's a question of who applies the plating and how.

This is one manufacturer point of view. If you go to Berea, you will have something different. PSI and CSU will give you their version. Every one will rate the plating they carry as they know them.

Since i don't see any platinum or rhodium or titanium plating in the Rienhzeng regular offer, i would like to know what they know about it.

The did not compare Rhodium to gold .... only Platinum and Platinum is much softer than Rhodium even though they are in the same group of metals.

They do offer Rhodium and titanium gold in fancy slimlines and black titanium as well.

 

[Smitty37]

mmmm

This is the first I have ever heard of Chrome wearing better than Rhodium and Platinum being compared equally to 24K gold....interesting.

Chrome is in fact a harder metal than Rhodium...not at all surprising that it should wear a little better...

 

[Wildman]

When you lay a chrome and platinum pen side by side I can not tell the difference.

I have made cigar pens with both platings they look the same to me!

Not sure customers want to pay more for the kit that cost more when items look exactly alike.

 

[Smitty37]

Hmmmmm

When you lay a chrome and platinum pen side by side I can not tell the difference.

I have made cigar pens with both platings they look the same to me!

Not sure customers want to pay more for the kit that cost more when items look exactly alike.

I have seen them side by side from my supplier and their rhodium is a tad brighter than their chrome actually I have a hard time telling their rhodium from their silver plating

 

[Smitty37]

copper and silver

As I thought, copper and silver platings are also sealed with clear epoxy.

 

[Russianwolf]

now, putting the hardness aside for a moment, there are other factors in durability. Skin chemistry for example can cause pitting on a hard plating that the same person wouldn't see on a softer plating. It just depends on the person. I'm sure there might be others factors as well, so the hardness isn't the end all be all answer.

 

[Smitty37]

Start with hardness

now, putting the hardness aside for a moment, there are other factors in durability. Skin chemistry for example can cause pitting on a hard plating that the same person wouldn't see on a softer plating. It just depends on the person. I'm sure there might be others factors as well, so the hardness isn't the end all be all answer.

I agree that hardness isn't the end all be all but premature wear is the most common complaint I see regarding plating in these forums. So hardness is a good starting point when looking at durability.

 

[DurocShark]

As I thought, copper and silver platings are also sealed with clear epoxy.

I can confirm this. My carry fountain pen is a silver Navigator. The epoxy on the clip suddenly came loose and is flaking and peeling. Ugh.

I switched to a rhodium Baron for my carry pen.

 

[Wildman]

I think using a copy of Craft Supplies "Pens and Plating 101," with star system is a good proof source to show buyers. Another good proof source is Berea Hardwoods "An Explanation of Platings."

Yes making those charts bigger is okay so customers can read for themselves. Knowing when to use or not use a proof source is part of good salesmanship. You do not want to end up buying the product back! Simply saying do not use those charts on every customer. Especially if they already made up their mind to buy.

I knew there was a hardness scale, for tool steel admit not sure ever heard of a MOH Scale. In any event am too stupid to get in a conversation with a customer on MOH Scale. Would have no problem letting a knowledgeable customer explain it to me.

 

[Smitty37]

Information

How the information here is used or not used is up to the user. I just put in some info that came into my possession. I am personally going to change some of my offerings and perhaps list the tougher platings as a group and let the customers choose.

 

[Wildman]

Please do not take offense at my posting. Think hand crafted pens sell themselves once people try them. Not until price of them becomes an issue is plating important to you and buyer.

 

[Smitty37]

Information

The intent is just to pass on information readers can decide for themselves how important it is.