Is it cheap or is it me?

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UWCBrad

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Oct 23, 2016
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30
Location
Greenville SC
I have only made a few pens, I started with 2 multi pen starter kits from PSI,'

The Magnetic Vertex Rollerball pens turn out great, but the 7mm twist ball point are a 50/50 shot. The first 4 twists turned out good, but, my last two are a no go from the assembly. The twist won't work, the parts jam, etc. I know that with the kit I only paid about $3 a piece for the Twist pens, but should I expect better quality? or is it something I am doing wrong (and how to tell what).

Their return policy is I pay shipping in original packaging within 30 days. I figure I will spend more in shipping than the pens are worth.

My next order is going to be from Craft.

But at what price point is a kit a good quality or a dud? Do I need to spend $10 - $30 each kit to get a quality pen? And if I do, will I ever make my cost out of it?
 
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Skie_M

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Aug 7, 2015
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Lawton, Ok
I've never had any major issues like that while ordering from anybody, and I order from PSI quite a bit! Even their cheapest pens, the "knockoff" version of their Slimline for only $1.50 per pen or less, in bulk, I've never had a problem with. Are you sure you aren't making an error in pressing the pens together? Not trying to press the transmission with an ink refil in it, or forgetting to ream the barrels before assembly to ensure that no glue is stuck inside there waiting to rear it's ugly head? Perhaps you pressed the transmission into the barrel too far, and the part that's supposed to be free to turn is now jammed up on the barrel wall?


In order to figure out what you're doing wrong or what's wrong with the parts (it's NOT unheard of to get a bad batch of parts from anybody, and it's not the end of the world), you'll want to disassemble the pens without damaging the parts. This is also a good method of finding and fixing the problem WITHOUT having to send them back to PSI so that they can send you a replacement. If it's simply a bad part that they sent out to you, sending them a picture is generally all they need so that they can send you a replacement for that single part rather than the whole pen, and they've been known to do that quite fast and generously... they just want "proof" to show THEIR SUPPLIER why they need an extra part for free because it was the supplier's fault. :)


Now, sending the entire pen off to PSI only means that they'll have to take the time to pull it apart themselves and figure out what went wrong, and then send you a replacement kit ... but you may or may not end up getting your pen barrels back! I would go ahead and invest in their new pen press/disassembly setup that they just came out with ... in fact, I'll be ordering one of those myself soon, as I've had some issues in the past with pen disassembly! :)
 

magpens

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Feb 2, 2011
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15,913
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Canada
You don't need to spend that much to get a quality kit but you need to change suppliers. . Check the Vendor Cheers and Jeers forum for some tips and scroll through the last 200 or so posts to see which vendors are recommended or not.
 

UWCBrad

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Joined
Oct 23, 2016
Messages
30
Location
Greenville SC
As to the assembly and disassembly. I went cheap and made my own pressing blocks out of walnut and use my lathe for allignment. So, disassembly is out unless I use a hammer.

As to barrel reaming, I use my Belt sander with a jig to keep the barrels perpendicular to the sander, works great, but does nothing to clean out the barrel.

Just starting out and trying to keep some of the costs down, but that might be part of my problem.

As to the vendor I read through a ton and thats where I came up with Craft for my next order. BUT, PSI also had a lot of positive feedback.
 

ed4copies

Local Chapter Manager
Joined
Mar 25, 2005
Messages
24,523
Location
Racine, WI, USA.
Your question points out an important differentiation.

When I learned how to make pens, I went to a class (that I paid for) and was taught proper techniques. THEN I purchased the kits that I had learned to make. Over time, I started trying other kits. BUT, I KNEW the rudimentary elements of how the pen was SUPPOSED to work. So, I could do troubleshooting. In fact, I started to test each section as it was assembled, so I would not HAVE to disassemble nearly as often.

PSI sells pen kits--but you should find a teacher to help you learn the craft (or do a lot of reading on IAP). The $3 pen kit will work, and if it doesn't, you should be able to tell them why not. Swap parts until you have a working pen, then, swap again to determine what is "faulty".

PSI, CSUSA and Berea sell tens of thousands of each pen kit type. They ALL WORK more than 99% of the time. YES, you CAN get a faulty one, but usually it is an error in assembly that makes it fail. Here on IAP we can help you learn, but nothing beats "face-to-face" lessons.

Wanna determine what's wrong---go grab your camera and start giving us some solid information, we can then give you more solid information---you will learn (as will hundreds of others, reading this). And, you will encounter fewer "bad kits", when you know what you did to make them function poorly.

FWIW,
Ed
 

CREID

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Joined
Jul 23, 2008
Messages
3,009
Location
Vancouver, wa
I have only made a few pens, I started with 2 multi pen starter kits from PSI,'

The Magnetic Vertex Rollerball pens turn out great, but the 7mm twist ball point are a 50/50 shot. The first 4 twists turned out good, but, my last two are a no go from the assembly. The twist won't work, the parts jam, etc. I know that with the kit I only paid about $3 a piece for the Twist pens, but should I expect better quality? or is it something I am doing wrong (and how to tell what).

Their return policy is I pay shipping in original packaging within 30 days. I figure I will spend more in shipping than the pens are worth.

My next order is going to be from Craft.

But at what price point is a kit a good quality or a dud? Do I need to spend $10 - $30 each kit to get a quality pen? And if I do, will I ever make my cost out of it?

PSI has always been good to me when I have had a problem. Call them (not email) ask to talk to the tech service dept. They may ask if they can help before they transfer you, but if you explain the problem you are having they will then know that you do indeed need to talk to tech service and transfer you ( they do this because there are few people in that dept and a lot of callers that ask for tech support don't really need tech support ). The tech service guy has always taken care of me. I call them about once every two years. If they determine you do indeed have a defective part and you cannot get it to work by trying something he may suggest, they will probably send you a new part. That has been my experience. But call, not email.
 

ed4copies

Local Chapter Manager
Joined
Mar 25, 2005
Messages
24,523
Location
Racine, WI, USA.
I HAVE to ask!!!

How, in the world would you SHIP that Adirondack chair, if you sold it!!!!

Beautiful pieces!!!
 

CREID

Member
Joined
Jul 23, 2008
Messages
3,009
Location
Vancouver, wa
Your question points out an important differentiation.

When I learned how to make pens, I went to a class (that I paid for) and was taught proper techniques. THEN I purchased the kits that I had learned to make. Over time, I started trying other kits. BUT, I KNEW the rudimentary elements of how the pen was SUPPOSED to work. So, I could do troubleshooting. In fact, I started to test each section as it was assembled, so I would not HAVE to disassemble nearly as often.

PSI sells pen kits--but you should find a teacher to help you learn the craft (or do a lot of reading on IAP). The $3 pen kit will work, and if it doesn't, you should be able to tell them why not. Swap parts until you have a working pen, then, swap again to determine what is "faulty".

PSI, CSUSA and Berea sell tens of thousands of each pen kit type. They ALL WORK more than 99% of the time. YES, you CAN get a faulty one, but usually it is an error in assembly that makes it fail. Here on IAP we can help you learn, but nothing beats "face-to-face" lessons.

Wanna determine what's wrong---go grab your camera and start giving us some solid information, we can then give you more solid information---you will learn (as will hundreds of others, reading this). And, you will encounter fewer "bad kits", when you know what you did to make them function poorly.

FWIW,
Ed
Yea, and what Ed said. This is good solid advice. And Ed is a good solid individual. Go to his website and he has lots of tutorial videos and you can learn a lot there too. I have, I do and I will again.
 

JimB

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Joined
Mar 18, 2008
Messages
4,683
Location
West Henrietta, NY, USA.
As to the assembly and disassembly. I went cheap and made my own pressing blocks out of walnut and use my lathe for allignment. So, disassembly is out unless I use a hammer.

As to barrel reaming, I use my Belt sander with a jig to keep the barrels perpendicular to the sander, works great, but does nothing to clean out the barrel.

Just starting out and trying to keep some of the costs down, but that might be part of my problem.

As to the vendor I read through a ton and thats where I came up with Craft for my next order. BUT, PSI also had a lot of positive feedback.

Your problem is probably here in your post. You MUST ream the barrel before assembly. Even the smallest speck of glue inside the tube will create problems with improper assembly and cause the transmission not to work properly.

When assembling twist pens I always test the transmission before assembly. Just give it a few twist to ensure it works. That way, if it doesn't work correctly after assembly I know it was something I did or didn't do (like get all the glue out of the tube).

Disassembly for a pen like that only requires a set of punches, $10 at Harbor freight and a hammer.
 

UWCBrad

Member
Joined
Oct 23, 2016
Messages
30
Location
Greenville SC
Thanks for the advice, and yes, pictures would have helped.

As to the chairs, Have not sold them yet, but they are a dream to sit in.

And Ed, I was born and raised in Kenosha, I really would like to get back up there again. Thanks again

And yes, it is very possible that the tubes had glue in them. I did test the transmission (never heard it called that before), and it does make sense, i was just not able to disassemble. Got lots of tools to assemble and build, not much to disassemble. Need a punch set.
 

mecompco

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Apr 24, 2015
Messages
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Location
Fairfield, Maine
A punch set is SO useful. I use mine for squaring blanks on the lathe, disassembly (with a 1 lb. dead blow hammer), AND I wrap the appropriately sized punch with 320 grit paper, chuck it in my hand drill, and use it to clean out my tubes--this gets rid of any glue that has made it past my wax plugs and loosens up the fit a bit (it the fit is too loose, a drop of blue Loc-Tite works wonderfully).
 
Last edited:

stonepecker

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Oct 29, 2012
Messages
4,382
Location
central Minnesota
punch from harbor freight is the way to go.
Very seldom do I have a problem with Harbor freight tools........cause I know what to expect. Buy them and use them correctly and they do last.

Now I am talking hand tools. You know to look at it before you buy it. Make it happen and when you can afford better, then buy them.
 

jsolie

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Apr 25, 2013
Messages
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Location
Sunny Murrieta, CA
+1 on that transfer punch set from Harbor Freight. These punches have been one of the most useful things for penmaking that I've purchased. I don't just use them for disassembly, I'll use them in one of Rick Herrell's sanding jigs to square the end of the blanks to the tubes.
 

ed4copies

Local Chapter Manager
Joined
Mar 25, 2005
Messages
24,523
Location
Racine, WI, USA.
Hey Brad,

If you get back up to Kenosha in the summer, when we are not so ridiculously busy, gimme a call. If we spend an hour or so over a lathe, you will know what to look for as you make pens.

Still love your chairs!! Nice work!
 

campzeke

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Joined
Jun 28, 2015
Messages
577
Location
Tampa, FL
I HAVE to ask!!!

How, in the world would you SHIP that Adirondack chair, if you sold it!!!!

Beautiful pieces!!!

ED, I have a plan for a very comfortable Adirondack chair I would be happy to send you. A man with your talent should have no problem building a few of your own. If I can do it, anybody can.
 

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jttheclockman

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Feb 22, 2005
Messages
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Location
NJ, USA.
I think every carpenter or wannabe carpenter has made those chairs. I can still remember working on them when my father built a couple when I was a youngster. I inherited my Dad's woodworking genes for sure.
 
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