Mac
Member
I have noticed ,that some pens ,in the show your pens , look like they are finished with a BLO/CA finish and they say they are a CA finish. Is it my eyesight or do some not know the difference, or do you think, there is a difference?
Is it BLO/CA or CA ?
- Thread starter Mac
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jbostian
Member
I have wondered if there is a difference or not. I am new to turning and just started using the CA finish. Two local people have shown me how they apply a CA finish and neither of them use BLO. I have seen a CA/BLO finish in person and have compared it to a CA finish without BLO and I cannot tell a difference. I was wondering if one method is more durabe then the other. Hopefully some one with more experience will chime in and help clarify the differences.
Jamie
Jamie
nate peel
Member
I have done both. It seems to just be a personal preferrence.When you talk about ca finish you will get as many processes as you have penturners.. The BLO helps me get a more consistently good finish
Bree
Member
The BLO lubricates the finish making it easier to smooth and more importantly it accelerates the curing of the CA. A little BLO goes a long way to getting a finish that requires very little sanding because the finish is glassy smooth to start with. The acceleration of the BLO makes the curing very fast so you get two benefits.
The BLO has no affect on the wood because it is applied after the CA has been applied. It technically speaking doesn't touch the wood. It may give a little amber tinting to the blank compared to CA with no BLO but I have not really noticed any great difference. It works with the wood in most cases.
If I were turning a white Holly pen and wanted max whiteness, I might do CA only. But for 99% of projects I prefer CA/BLO.
My $.02
:wink::wink::wink:
The BLO has no affect on the wood because it is applied after the CA has been applied. It technically speaking doesn't touch the wood. It may give a little amber tinting to the blank compared to CA with no BLO but I have not really noticed any great difference. It works with the wood in most cases.
If I were turning a white Holly pen and wanted max whiteness, I might do CA only. But for 99% of projects I prefer CA/BLO.
My $.02
:wink::wink::wink:
dalemcginnis
Local Chapter Leader
Actually that's only true if a person does a CA/BLO finish. I do a BLO/CA finish so my BLO does in fact come in contact with the wood. And as has been stated it is just my personal preference. I too have been able to compare both finishes and see no difference. So why do I use the BLO? Because for me it is an easier finish than just CA.
Bree
Member
You can use BLO on the wood to pop the grain or add some color but that really has little or nothing to do with the CA part of the finish. If you use BLO on the wood or any other oil, you must let the oil dry before applying the CA. If you apply the CA over oil that has not fully dried (polymerized), you run the serious risk of developing clouds under the finsh that will wipe out the shine.
The CA/BLO technique uses BLO to chemically interact with the CA... not as a wood finish. You can use it as a wood finish but just understand that this use is quite distinct from the function of BLO in a CA/BLO finish.
I often use Tung oil as a wood finish and then follow (after drying) with CA/BLO.
dalemcginnis
Local Chapter Leader
You can use BLO on the wood to pop the grain or add some color but that really has little or nothing to do with the CA part of the finish. If you use BLO on the wood or any other oil, you must let the oil dry before applying the CA. If you apply the CA over oil that has not fully dried (polymerized), you run the serious risk of developing clouds under the finsh that will wipe out the shine.
The CA/BLO technique uses BLO to chemically interact with the CA... not as a wood finish. You can use it as a wood finish but just understand that this use is quite distinct from the function of BLO in a CA/BLO finish.
I often use Tung oil as a wood finish and then follow (after drying) with CA/BLO.
Here's where the BLO/CA vs CA/BLO wars begin.:wink::wink::wink: I apply my CA immediately after applying the BLO and using the same spot on the paper towel as the BLO and I've only had one that ever turned cloudy and that was on Cocobolo. Sanded it down and reapplied the finish and all was good.
As has been said, there are as many techniques as there are turners, Experiment, find a technique that works for you and use it. Don't worry about all of us that insist you're doing it wrong because your not doing it like we do. When it comes to a CA finish, if you like the results you are getting then THAT'S the right way.
its_virgil
Member
I apply the boiled linseed oil to the wood first and then the CA.
The oil does darken the wood just a little and makes the grain more prominent. Like you, I would not use the oil on really light woods that I want to remain light....like the holly you mentioned.
In fact,I often apply WATCO Danish Oil (Medium Walnut) and friction dry it prior to starting the finish.
We all have our own way of applying CA.
Do a good turn dily!
Don
The oil does darken the wood just a little and makes the grain more prominent. Like you, I would not use the oil on really light woods that I want to remain light....like the holly you mentioned.
In fact,I often apply WATCO Danish Oil (Medium Walnut) and friction dry it prior to starting the finish.
We all have our own way of applying CA.
Do a good turn dily!
Don
leehljp
Member Liaison
It is either, both work, and both don't work. When done right, you will not notice the difference on a finished pen - unless the BLO is added to the wood (and wiped off well) before CA is applied, then the wood will take on a more amber (and enhanced) color or tone.
CA/BLO, or BLO/CA, or CA alone - are in the category of "YMMV". Highly subjective to a personal choice and technique that works under under one person's conditions and techniques but not another's.
Concerning "individual technique" - the way and method that a person applies the finish largely determines the outcome. When someone writes a tutorial giving a 5 point or 10 point list, EVERY reader will interpret each word subjectively, yet they will claim that they are doing EXACTLY as the list described. Noooo! This is the main reason it works for some and not for others. Then the debate begins of which is best, correct, etc. It depends.
It is a fact that BLO "can" cause dulling of the finish if mixed with CA in the application process. However, those with experience and a correct technique (which is a subjective description) don't have a problem with it.
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Mac
Member
Its just that ,some finishes on this forum look like they have a satin finish and some look real rich and shiny,but all say it is a CA finish.
Maybe we need to know how not to mix the BLO and the CA when we are doing the finish. HANK can you or anybody help.
PS I have seen the video on the BLO/CA finish and mine look that good now. I want the shiny BLO/CA finish.
Also could someone post a picture of a BLO/CA finish pen or let me know where to look to see one.
Maybe we need to know how not to mix the BLO and the CA when we are doing the finish. HANK can you or anybody help.
PS I have seen the video on the BLO/CA finish and mine look that good now. I want the shiny BLO/CA finish.
Also could someone post a picture of a BLO/CA finish pen or let me know where to look to see one.
its_virgil
Member
Wow!
I've been doing it wrong for several years now. And I've taught lots of others wrongly also. I apply the CA on top of the oil immediately after I apply the oil. But, I will continue to do the finish wrongly.:biggrin::wink:
Do a good turn daily!
Don
I've been doing it wrong for several years now. And I've taught lots of others wrongly also. I apply the CA on top of the oil immediately after I apply the oil. But, I will continue to do the finish wrongly.:biggrin::wink:
Do a good turn daily!
Don
You can use BLO on the wood to pop the grain or add some color but that really has little or nothing to do with the CA part of the finish. If you use BLO on the wood or any other oil, you must let the oil dry before applying the CA.
leehljp
Member Liaison
Ahh, now I think I understand what you are talking about. While I don't want to totally categorize all finishes into this, . . . the differences is in the photos are: how they were taken, the lighting, the angle, camera quality, and photo tools used. A 10° to 15° angle change in taking a photo can change its appearance as to shiny versus nearly satin. In those cases, it has little to do with the CA, CA-BLO, BLO-CA, IMO.
Below are two links in which Russ Fairfield discusses CA and some with regards to BLO. If you do a search for "Russ", you will find many posts that has to do with CA and usually BLO is mentioned in those. It may overwhelm you a bit but those are helpful. Hope this helps some. By the way, When Russ speaks, I listen! He has been one of my silent mentors (I read all of his posts) since I joined IAP.
http://www.penturners.org/forum/showthread.php?t=55240&highlight=Russ
http://www.penturners.org/forum/showthread.php?t=56074&highlight=Russ
I am also including pict-links below that are different pens (and duck calls) - all finished to the same degree of shine. (Well one pen was deliberately satinized to show that it could be done with CA.). The camera angle, light angle and difusion, and pen object angle determine how well the shine will come forth in the picts. I am not a photographer and I don't know the particulars, but just experiment until I get the effect I want. I may take 20 - 40 picts from different angles and pick the one that shows up the best. Anyway, most of it - is not a matter of CA, CA/BLO per se but lighting and angles.
CA - Fairly shiny photo (No BLO):
http://www.penturners.org/photos/images/940/1_Best_pen.jpg
CA - Shiny and deliberately satinized finishes (I think I used BLO on these, but don't remember for sure):
http://www.penturners.org/photos/images/940/1_2Cigs_2Fin_1Burl.jpg
CA - Shiny but the shine is not seen (No BLO):
http://www.penturners.org/photos/images/940/1_Baron_PenStripes.jpg
CA - Shiny but excessive shine because of size and angle of light and camera (BLO used on the DC on the left, IIRC):
http://www.penturners.org/photos/images/940/1_5_Duck_Calls.jpg
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John Eberly
Member
The amount of BLO, the amount of CA, and the number of costs will influence the flat/satin/shiny character of the finish. I have found that two or three coats leaves a satin finish, and sometimes six or more may be required for a high gloss.
Two things that I've found to inhibit the development of a high gloss BLO/CA finish are too much BLO and/or not rubbing the CA in long enough.
rjwolfe3
Member
I have tried many different ways over the years and found William Youngs method the easiest for me. It is not the only way, just what works for me. I had the most trouble with sanding the finish until he posted his method of no sanding. Since then for the most part I have had good finishes. None perfect because I have never turned a perfect pen yet. He applies BLO then CA in the same spot on the paper towel.