#@*! Pencils

Chasper · Mar 12, 2008

I really don't like making pencils, but I get asked to do it anyway. I've made them with slims, 8mm euros, perfect fits, el grandes, modified sierras and Pentel conversions; don't like any of them.

1. Almost nobody buys a pencil for their own use, they buy a set as a gift. I tell them that for the price of a slim pen/pencil set I could make them a really good pen. I haven't talked anyone into that yet. . .
2. The slim pencils break down, and I have to rebuild them, usually with parts from a new kit, it isn't easy to disassemble a slim pencil. I think they would all come back for repairs except the gift receipients never use the pencils.
3. Matching two blanks and still making them interesting is a fustration. Matching PR or boring wood is easy, but try matching two olive wood blanks.
4. It cheapens the whole notion of fine writing instruments to make a pencil. There is a legacy about fine pens, the legacy/history of pencils is that they are made of wood, painted yellow and have an eraser on the end.
5. Making a very nice pencil like an El Grande is like buying an Escalade pick-up to haul one load of firewood. It looks good and gets the job done, but outrageously unnecessary.
6. When you have 200 pens on the table why do they want to buy the pen and only the pen that is in the set?

Anybody up for a manufacturers boycott of pencil making? If someone asks me for a pen/pencil set I'll offer them a great pen and throw in a new yellow pencil for free if you will.

rherrell · Mar 12, 2008

If it bothers you that much, quit making them. This stuff is supposed to be fun. Too many other things in this world to get aggravated about, don't let pencils be one of them!

wdcav1952 · Mar 12, 2008

Originally posted by rherrell

If it bothers you that much, quit making them. This stuff is supposed to be fun. Too many other things in this world to get aggravated about, don't let pencils be one of them!

That about says it all!

Chasper · Mar 12, 2008

I've spent too many years trying to sell people what they think they want to buy, even if I think is is a bad idea. Trying to please has permeated the commercial chromosones in my DNA. Someday I'm going to retire and only do what I want to do.

I'm not a comfortable smilie user, my instincts are to rely on hyperbole to express my tongue-in-cheek comments. It is possible, in fact; probably, that my original post as well as this reply comes across as a lot more serious than intended.

IPD_Mrs · Mar 12, 2008

Come on Gerry use some of that good ole Hoosier ingenuity on this. There are a couple of items that I hated to make, that I kind of like to make now. I put a price on them so I am either happy or the customer backs off. So lets just say that you typically get $75 for a slimline pen and pencil set. When a customer asks you to make a set for them, be happy and tell them no problem the price is $150 and there are no guarantee on the pencil. Or if you really do not want to deal with them at all, tell them that you respect your customers to make something with such inferior components.

Mike

Chasper · Mar 12, 2008

Mike,
What if I told them that I have a mental disorder that causes me to refuse to sell anything to stupid people? You think that would work?

I take it that since you are still making the items you formerly did not like to make, that they were willing to pay the higher price? That offers some intersting possibilaties, my usury chromosones are still functioning properly.

turned_for_good · Mar 12, 2008

I believe that every pencil I have sold has been for the person that bought it. I haven't had nearly the problems that you speak of with them either.

holmqer · Mar 12, 2008

I have yet to make a pencil, but I use the commercial ones daily. I even bought mech pencils in the $20 to $40 range back before I started turning. There are plenty of us who love them.

As a daily writer, I use a fountain pen for all text, and a mechanical pencil for all drawing (I am an engineer and constantly sketch up ideas).

alamocdc · Mar 12, 2008

If they want a pencil, sell 'em a stick w/graphi<s>c</s>te in it.[}

]

Oops, I made a booboo.

Sylvanite · Mar 12, 2008

Originally posted by holmqer

...I use the commercial ones daily. I even bought mech pencils in the $20 to $40 range back before I started turning. There are plenty of us who love them.

There are plenty of good mechanical pencils out there. Unfortunately, those are not the ones that come in the kits, lol.

I've tried the slimline, american, and cigar pencil kits and find none of them satisfactory. A sierra w/ schmidt mechanism comes close. I bought a drill bit from Don Ward, just so I could make a pencil out of a decent (Pentel) mechanism.

Regards,
Eric

DKF · Mar 12, 2008

If a customer wants a pencil, or a pen/pencil set, and they are willing to pay the price that you set forth, then why not....IMHO, simply price it to make it "well" worth your time.

gerryr · Mar 12, 2008

Sell them your very own Pentel conversion.

OldWrangler · Mar 12, 2008

Count me among those turners who hate pencils. The kits are mostly crap. I made one special for a friend's daughter for Christmas. It has come back twice for adjusting and they just called and it is not working again. I now have parts of 4 kits in it and about 4 hours of labor and more than that of agrevation.

I am a PENTURNER and not a friggin' PENCILTURNER! When someone make a foolproof pencil kit will be the next time I make another. If anyone asks for a pencil I just tell them I am a penturner ..............only!!!

Geo in Winnipeg · Mar 12, 2008

I'm with gerryr. I haven't made a Pentel conversion (yet - I have the step drill) but I've been using a pentel P205 for over 15 years without problem!

bruce119 · Mar 12, 2008

I just made these using the step drill that Don Ward sold. I used a pentel p205. Very easy turned out great. Gives you a lot of design opportunities.

Bruce

thetalbott4 · Mar 12, 2008

What if I told them that I have a mental disorder that causes me to refuse to sell anything to stupid people? You think that would work?

Oh now thats funny! LOL. I'd give $20 and drive about 75 miles to see that.

kirkfranks · Mar 12, 2008

Just wondering here but do you have enough pen/letter opener sets out on your table so that the folks that are looking for a "gift set" would get the idea?
Also the pen/letter opener/magnifying glass sets for the real spendy folks.

I am just thinking that if that was available you could keep the pen/pencil sets out of sight and maybe it would not be as big an issue.

I have not sold at shows (mostly just sold at work), but all of the sets I have sold were pen and letter opener. Might be cause I have never taken a pencil to work (I don't like them either) and that is where most of my sales are.

Chasper · Mar 12, 2008

I agree that the Pentel pencils are in a class above the kits available. I have one I use myself. I'd like to make a better clip for them, but that hasn't been a priority yet. I made a desk pen by drilling out a long blank and inserting a bic nib and ink tube, it writes great but I wouldn't sell it to anyone.

I feel that every working day of my life I sell things that I wouldn't own. For an extended interlude in my career I sold women's footwear. That was an honorable business, I sold a couple million pairs, but I never even tried a pair on. When I sell a pen it has something of my taste and personal craftmanship in it. If I did not want to own it, I would not sell it.

I've never tried the letter opener sets, but they don't interest me for the same reason as the pencils; not my taste.

follow3 · Mar 12, 2008

What about the perfect fit convertable. You can convert them from pen to pencil easily. ONLY offer that one type of pencil, so if a customer wants a set they will have to buy those.

I am a contractor and I also use my pricing as a way to avoid problem jobs and a way to control my back log. If I don't like the job or the homeowner, I jack up the price to a level that either they will decline or I will be happy to do the job. Do the same with pencils, but still limit the availability to only the kit that you like the most. (or dis-like the least[}

])

Steve

Sfolivier · Mar 12, 2008

The large pencils (a pencil el Grande????) seem silly to me, although I have never held one. On the other hands, The pencil slimlines are nice. I like them better than the slimline pens and their horrible cross style refills (can you tell I write with fountain pens and hate sticky ink...).

A very light slimline pencil is a great writting instrument. It is faster than a pen, with less pressure, is erasable and writes on more surfaces. I wouldn't write a love letter with it

But it's great to take notes, it's flies on the paper. It's also longer than a slimline pen and I think more elegant.

gwilki · Mar 13, 2008

I've had excellent luck with the Perfect Fit pencil. The great part about it, too, is that if it doesn't sell, you can put a refill in it and, presto, it's a ballpoint.

The 9mm Pentels seem to hold up very well, too.

bruce119 · Mar 13, 2008

Originally posted by Sfolivier

A very light slimline pencil is a great writting instrument. It is faster than a pen, with less pressure, is erasable and writes on more surfaces. I wouldn't write a love letter with it But it's great to take notes, it's flies on the paper. It's also longer than a slimline pen and I think more elegant.

I'm with you I love my pencil. That is all I use at the computer a .05 lead. I don't have a pencil in my check book. But I use the pencil for everyday writing around the house.

Ozzy · Mar 13, 2008

I agree with Mike (MLKWoodWorking) raise the price until you feel better about it. I did that this year with antler pens. Last year I charged $60 a piece, $45 if they supplied the antlers. I got soo many orders this year that it started taking up to much of my time (I have a full time job and I'm a full time student). I bumped the price up to $100 a piece, $85 if they supplied the antlers. It didn't really slow the orders but I sure felt a lot better about my time.

DCBluesman · Mar 13, 2008

Back to a simple solution. Don't make them. [8D]

Blind_Squirrel · Mar 13, 2008

Originally posted by Chasper

For an extended interlude in my career I sold women's footwear.

Chasper · Mar 13, 2008

Where did you get my picture?

Hosspen · Mar 13, 2008

BirchBarkBruce,
I like the pictures of the pentel pencils you've made. What is the bottom one made of? The red & white looking one. Thanks!

bruce119 · Mar 14, 2008

Originally posted by Hosspen

BirchBarkBruce,
I like the pictures of the pentel pencils you've made. What is the bottom one made of? The red & white looking one. Thanks!

Thank you
They are from top to bottom:
Walnut
Mangrove Driftwood
Flaming Box Elder
Red Dyed Loofah
(The loofah is similar to cactus. I dye it Red, Blue, Black then cast it in PR then color the inside of the drilled hole with white paint.)

gwilki · Mar 14, 2008

Bruce
I really like your loofah. I've been playing with loofah for a while, and I think my problem is that I leave it too dense. I really like your look.

#@*! Pencils

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